EVE General Discussion

I have recently been put on the spot with regards to cyber bullying.

For context, I'm a lawyer and I really like Eve online. While talking about the game, another lawyer who has never played made the comment "Oh, you are one of the cyber bullies."

That was a bit of a slap in the face. This person knew nothing at all about Eve, except that we are all notorious cyber bullies.

This thread is aimed at the Eve community, to highlight our reputation in the world, and to highlight the risks we face by associating with an organization such as CCP.

We need to be clear about how Eve and CCP are perceived in the wider world.

The uncontested facts are not flattering. In 2012 an incident occurred which came dangerously close to attempted murder, for the sheer fun of it. Understand, when reasonable people hear and see the facts of what happened, they react with extreme anger and hostility.

The grave problem for all of us is how things have settled, 3 years on. That anger and hostility towards the criminal cowards who use Eve as a platform for their cyber bullying is not going away: indeed, it is growing. All over the world, laws are being drafted and passed to curb the misery caused by sociopaths on the internet.

So, where do we, as a community, fit in to this emerging picture?

Sadly, there are two increasingly divergent opinions. One is that CCP confronted and dealt with the issue, and that CCP have ethics that protect the firm from sliding into the mire. Another opinion, offered to me recently with much force and conviction, is that CCP are a business model based on cyber bullying, whose revenues depend on cyber bullying. Without cyber bullying, the argument goes, Eve would not exist at all.

I find both opinions extreme and unrealistic, but very sadly I think CCP have failed to act in such a way as to clear their name. I think it is almost certain that Eve will soon become an icon, a symbol for the worst of the worst.

To be clear, right now there are a whole bunch of lawyers who want CCP shut down for good. One small change in Icelandic law, and it is done.

Who are these people: Basically every lawyer who sees themselves as a cyber bullying expert, and who has career aspirations to this end.

Why are they targeting CCP?

Here we get into sensitive territory. Please consider the subject heading for this post.

In my discussion, I tried to defend Eve and CCP. I was asked the following questions:

1. Did you know that a guy openly, on stage, encouraged others to pressure a mentally weak person to actual, real life suicide?

2. What was his punishment by the game owners?

3. What is his current status within the game?

Because of my particular background, I was also asked what fate would await an officer who encouraged troops to push a mentally weak person to suicide. We need not go there, except to note that the behaviour in question has nothing to do with decent people, nor is it part of any real world warrior code.

So, here is the problem: one cannot answer those three questions and retain any kind of meaningful defence of CCP, as an organization. Put simply, CCP have decided to associate with this person. They have sat at his side of the table. Their leadership sit with this man, and entertain his kind without shame.

It seems to me that this state of affairs is both regrettable and ultimately untenable. Follow the simple reasoning:

If it is true that CCP need the revenues from such people, then it follows that Eve is, absolutely, a business model based entirely on cyber bullying.

If it is not true that CCP need the revenue from such people, then it follows that CCP has seriously worthless individuals across all levels of senior management, and is a cyber bullying outfit by choice.

Both choices are poor, both come from the uncontested facts, as established by the three questions listed above.

This issue is not going to fade away. The power of this reasoning will never diminish through time.

I would be pleased to hear the views of CCP staff on this subject.

We all need to know the nature of the company we keep. We are entitled to know the values of those we sit down with, on a daily basis.

This thread will to go places.

Most accusations of cyber bullying in EVE come from sore losers who complain when their space ships explode in a game about making space ships explode. These accusations are laughable and do not get taken seriously by anyone, lawyer or not. Should we ban Counter Strike because people shoot at other people's virtual avatars in that game too?

As someone who was actually bullied as a child, I find people, who dare to equate losing in a game to being bullied, disgusting.

For the mittanigate, you are a bit late for the party.

Well, I don't know about daily basis, but the truth is not a value in this thread.

Factual accuracy aside, this inane babble isn't even entertaining. (Well, ok, it is a little)

$200/hr = assumed hrly rate
1 Plex = $19.95
1 Plex ~ 800,000,000 ISK
Estimate ($200/hr / $19.95) * 800,000,000 = 8,020,050,125 Isk/hr

Full disclosure: I swerve to hit squirrels.

I'll just pop in here to remind people that this thread is being watched by a guy behind a newspaper in the corner of the diner.

I, as an expert on expertism and everything else there is, think that CCP is doing a great job!

How do you know when you've made a ship toast of epic proportion?

You get trolled by the ones who are supposed to stop the trolling.

So when I camp that attack helicopter in bf4 and dont let him get in the air the whole round, cyber bully?

Definitely. And you should feel bad.

But by telling you that you should feel bad, I am myself now a cyber bully, and I feel bad. This backfired.