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A list from a bitter veteran. [Upppdated]
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Jojo Jackson
Dead Red Eye
#81 - 2011-12-19 23:25:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Jojo Jackson
I never would go to negativ secure by intend!
I want to play WITH and not AGAINST other people as I'm a sozial and no anti-sozial player.

I might shot combat ships ... but I would NEVER should a ship, which can't defend itselve (shutle, indutrials, bargs).
Attacking this ships is like Navy Seels kill kids or 90 year old man just becouse "they can".

You know, just becouse you can does NOT mean you have to!

Xoria Krint wrote:

You need to trust the people first.


Then tell me, why I (or anyone else) should EVER trust entitys from null or low at all when all we see every damn minute is scam, ganking and hostil behavior?

Why should someone trust you?

From the very first minute every new player learns "NEVER trust anybody in EVE as they all are just little e-peen kiddys".

So tell me oh mighty bitter pirate vet ... WHY should someone trust you?

We wanted to trust them, we wanted to be part of 00 .... and yes, we learned: it was a fail as nealy all inhabitants of this areas are little dickheads.


PS: you still didn't get it.
Not the high sec players are your real enemy .... the mass of wannabes which hardcore abuse scaming, ganking, bashing are your enemys!

Why the hell can't I fitt capital repairs or shield booster on an Orca ... it's an CAPITAL ship!
Orlacc
#82 - 2011-12-19 23:29:53 UTC
"YOUR" game?

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
Xoria Krint
The Angelic
#83 - 2011-12-19 23:34:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Xoria Krint
Jojo Jackson wrote:


Then tell me, why I (or anyone else) should EVER trust entitys from null or low at all when all we see every damn minute is scam, ganking and hostil behavior?

Yea, why would you? Maybe stretch your trust to your corpmates, if they have been nice and helpfull :) (not some random 0.0 alliance?)
Jojo Jackson wrote:

Why should someone trust you?

You get trusted in Eve by reputation. That's how it works, and should work.
Jojo Jackson wrote:

So tell me oh mighty bitter pirate vet ... WHY should someone trust you?

On the forum or ingame? Ingame I don't wan't to be trusted. I got the trust i need. I'm a man of my word and has been since day 1 in Eve. But I do kill and steal. But i'm still polite about it, and even learn newbies some PvP from time to time.
Jojo Jackson wrote:

We wanted to trust them, we wanted to be part of 00 .... and yes, we learned: it was a fail as nealy all inhabitants of this areas are little dickheads.

You will never learn to PvP in Eve since you can't see your own fault in the whole thing. You will be stuck in highsec with your naive thinking. And it's sad that the players don't dare to go to the next "level" and see the true potential of politic, drama, pvp, and brothers in arms.
Orlacc wrote:
"YOUR" game?

Correct Bear
Jojo Jackson
Dead Red Eye
#84 - 2011-12-20 00:05:22 UTC
Xoria Krint wrote:
You will never learn to PvP in Eve since you can't see your own fault in the whole thing. You will be stuck in highsec with your naive thinking. And it's sad that the players don't dare to go to the next "level" and see the true potential of politic, drama, pvp, and brothers in arms.


Our fault was to belive there would be a singel trustworth soul in 00.

They are all a great pill of human junk.

After some years I now understand, that ALL "big players" out there just hold their positions by crim, BOTing, bugusing and RMTing.

And to tell you the truth ... I give a **** about anything what happens at 0.4 to 00 or the proplems this system might have since I know how this inhabitant act!



PS: "brothers in arms"? ROFL ... just check the KBs, every minute you see blue-kills .... best joke ever "brothers in arms".
blue == bit less likely to be killed but if they get enough wodka, they don't care about colors anyway!

Why the hell can't I fitt capital repairs or shield booster on an Orca ... it's an CAPITAL ship!
Xolve
State War Academy
Caldari State
#85 - 2011-12-20 00:38:02 UTC
Xoria Krint wrote:


  • Eve is about risk vs reward. Level IV missions in Empire is not risk vs reward (it's done AFK, CCP). Also, it would get lowsec more populated if all the level 4 agents where moved to low security space. Get. It. Done. (trading in Empire is a completely different story, since there is a hell of a lot of risk in some trades.) The more money, the more risk. Simple.. Alternative: Fix so that you can't make missions while AFK (or is that intended?).



    • In Null-Sec where 'tharrr be dragons' and stuff... you can make 10-15x what a level 4 mission runner makes in far. far. far less time- Guess what though? Its also done mostly AFK.

    Please let me know your thoughts on Technetium and other high value moon goo.
    Ai Shun
    #86 - 2011-12-20 00:48:03 UTC
    Fix My Lasers wrote:
    There are people that can't even break the tank on rats, like lasers vs angels. Making missions harder means lots of newbs will be stuck on L3 agents forever. Which will cause a total boredom and lots of quitting.


    Good! Because basically they are not playing EVE. They're playing WoW with a game client modification so all the mobs look like spaceships.
    Xoria Krint
    The Angelic
    #87 - 2011-12-20 00:49:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Xoria Krint
    Xolve wrote:

    In Null-Sec where 'tharrr be dragons' and stuff... you can make 10-15x what a level 4 mission runner makes in far. far. far less time- Guess what though? Its also done mostly AFK.

    At least its open PvP. Stupid people lose stupid ratting carriers everyday. But 0.0 ratting is broken as well, indeed.
    Xolve wrote:

    Please let me know your thoughts on Technetium and other high value moon goo.

    My list is not complete and Eve is broken in many ways so i probably missed a lot of things that i thinks should be changed. Moon goo should be fixed as well. For years ago, almost to late now. How much reserve is out there? Moon goo should be dynamic and be able to run out. but also to "pop" up on new locations.

    Now that would make 0.0 politics interesting.
    Sallaria Gengod
    Doomheim
    #88 - 2011-12-20 00:58:04 UTC
    Xoria Krint wrote:
    Ahoy fellow spaceship pilots. When I started to play Eve eight years ago i was looking forward to the future of Eve Online. I could imagine how cool it would be in a near future. Today, i wish Eve was rolled back to 2004, nothing is better 2011 (graphic is better, i admit).

    Here, enjoy a bitter veterans list of anger.


    • CCP introduces new ships in Eve Online without fixing the old ones first, why? More ships is not always the solutions to your problem. If you wan't to make more ships, make more ship-roles first....

    There are always going to be problems with the ships. There are always going to be balance issues, or a feature that not everyone is happy with. But, that doesnt mean that you should STOP adding ships. If that was the case, this game would still be stuck with Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships and Industrial Ships.

    Xoria Krint wrote:



    • The forum (and the game) is getting populated by many new players that don't get the concept of Eve. Players that think you should earn ISK on losing ships and players that want to make Eve to just another MMORPG. The worst is, CCP seems to listen to them.

    Oh my. Heaven forbid that new players should be interested in playing YOUR game you bitter old ****! Heaven forbid that CCP should take the word of a new, fresh player with a different perspective on the game than a bitter, stick in the mud vet!

    Xoria Krint wrote:



    • Many pilots from the past that has been giving CCP much constructive criticism and has been the voice of the scums of Eve has been banned from the forums, maybe it's time to unban some of these players from the forums and give some room for even more bitter veterans.

    Uhhh, no. Just no. If they have been banned from the forums then they must have done something REALLY bad to get banned, given the flame war that is the Eve Online forums generally.

    Xoria Krint wrote:



    • PLEX is ruining the whole game (imo it's just really stupid to release PLEX in a game that is supposed to be sandbox, PLEX for Gametime could be an option rather then todays model)

    PLEX is not ruining the game at all. You might not like it but PLEX was brought into place to tackle the endemic problem of people selling timecodes for isk. It also helped to tackle the in game ISK spammers. Taking away PLEX would be reducing the game to a ISK Spammers haven again. PLEX is keeping EVE Online safe and peaceful from ISK scams, spammers, etc, etc.

    Xoria Krint wrote:



    • The scums of Eve (pirates, scammers etc) has been nerfed year after year without getting anything back. It's time to throw a bone to the scums. Black market? Implant scanning? A working bounty system? Eve is suppose to be harsh. And it's NOT harsh enough

    Now, this is going to suprise you. I agree with some of what you have said here. Eve online does indeed need a better Black Market and a Better Bounty System. At the moment, they do pretty much nothing and are not profitable, so dont get used at all in some cases. I would like to see these two things reworked.


    • Eve is about risk vs reward. Level IV missions in Empire is not risk vs reward (it's done AFK, CCP). Also, it would get lowsec more populated if all the level 4 agents where moved to low security space. Get. It. Done. (trading in Empire is a completely different story, since there is a hell of a lot of risk in some trades.) The more money, the more risk. Simple.. Alternative: Fix so that you can't make missions while AFK (or is that intended?).
    And back to the stupidity. No, you have had your way with level 5 missions. Stop crying because you cant gank newbies because they choose to stay in low sec. This isnt about how YOU want people to play the game, its about how THEY want to play the game. S...A....N....D....B....O....X! Remember? That means for them too.



    • CCP is too nice to the players and just gives them everything they want nowadays, and that's the wrong move. Sometimes it feels like CCP has lost the concept of Eve themselves. Greed is always destroying concept and ideas.

    • Ban the bots, ban the bots, Please CCP, atlest ban one bot? For me? They are ruining the economy.

    • Cheating is more common then you might think in Eve (modifications of the game client). Fix that.

    • ISK SINKS?!?

    • The selling of characters for ISK should be against the EULA.


    Oh good grief. CCP is nice to new players? Oh heavens no. Could it be that they dont want the game to be so harsh and unforgiving that it scares away most people before they even get into the meat of the game? I think it could you know. Eve Online is notorious in the MMO world as being harsh, hard and complex. So yeah...and what exactly IS the concept of EVE? Is it...a SANDBOX!!! Sanbox doesnt just apply to you buddy!

    Ban Bots...agreed. Cheating via modifid clients? Is that possible? Never heard of that being done.

    Selling characters for isk shouls be against the EULA? No, take a look at other MMOs, it happens anyway. This way CCP can keep a control on it and help reduce the number of people getting ripped off.

    Basically, you are just unhappy because EVE isnt what you FEEL it should be. You want it to be tailored to YOU and everyone else can take a leap...how sweet. QQ more.
    Jonathan Ferguson
    JC Ferguson and Son Ltd
    Ferguson Alliance
    #89 - 2011-12-20 01:09:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonathan Ferguson
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:
    Uhhh, no. Just no. If they have been banned from the forums then they must have done something REALLY bad to get banned, given the flame war that is the Eve Online forums generally.


    You'd think so, wouldn't you? You'd be wrong. Find a banworthy post in this thread: http://eve-search.com/thread/44946-1/page/3

    In a forum where people have an ignore button, 3-month bans should be for comments so egregious that 99% of people would be appalled by the post and support the ban. Not for calling someone an idiot (or some variation thereof) in a forum where such insults are commonplace.
    Jace Errata
    Caldari Provisions
    Caldari State
    #90 - 2011-12-20 01:10:58 UTC
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:
    Stuff

    This. Precisely this.

    (This is basically my attitude towards every bittervet whine thread ever. Thanks for making it into a post Big smile)

    tweeten

    One day they woke me up so I could live forever

    It's such a shame the same will never happen to you
    Sallaria Gengod
    Doomheim
    #91 - 2011-12-20 01:16:48 UTC
    Jace Errata wrote:
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:
    Stuff

    This. Precisely this.

    (This is basically my attitude towards every bittervet whine thread ever. Thanks for making it into a post Big smile)


    You're welcome! Big smile
    Jonathan Ferguson
    JC Ferguson and Son Ltd
    Ferguson Alliance
    #92 - 2011-12-20 01:23:15 UTC
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:


    You're welcome! Big smile


    So you can't find a banworthy post? Ya, neither could Hilmar. But he didn't give a **** either.
    Sallaria Gengod
    Doomheim
    #93 - 2011-12-20 01:24:59 UTC
    Jonathan Ferguson wrote:
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:


    You're welcome! Big smile


    So you can't find a banworthy post? Ya, neither could Hilmar. But he didn't give a **** either.


    You ahve chosen one, ONE instance out of what is probably Hundreds if not THOUSANDS of forum bans. And if you dont like how CCP moderates its forums...dont post here, concentrate on playing the game instead.
    Xoria Krint
    The Angelic
    #94 - 2011-12-20 01:27:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Xoria Krint
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    Oh my. Heaven forbid that new players should be interested in playing YOUR game you bitter old ****! Heaven forbid that CCP should take the word of a new, fresh player with a different perspective on the game than a bitter, stick in the mud vet!

    I like you.
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    Uhhh, no. Just no. If they have been banned from the forums then they must have done something REALLY bad to get banned, given the flame war that is the Eve Online forums generally.

    You know nothing about Eve history, noticed.
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    PLEX is not ruining the game at all. You might not like it but PLEX was brought into place to tackle the endemic problem of people selling timecodes for isk. It also helped to tackle the in game ISK spammers. Taking away PLEX would be reducing the game to a ISK Spammers haven again. PLEX is keeping EVE Online safe and peaceful from ISK scams, spammers, etc, etc.

    Instead of making a "solution" like PLEX. They could just get spam-filters. Your argument there is the worst ever. But cute.
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    Now, this is going to suprise you. I agree with some of what you have said here. Eve online does indeed need a better Black Market and a Better Bounty System. At the moment, they do pretty much nothing and are not profitable, so dont get used at all in some cases. I would like to see these two things reworked.

    Yay, surprise.......
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    And back to the stupidity. No, you have had your way with level 5 missions. Stop crying because you cant gank newbies because they choose to stay in low sec. This isnt about how YOU want people to play the game, its about how THEY want to play the game. S...A....N....D....B....O....X! Remember? That means for them too.

    What do you don't get? You can still run level 4 missions in low security space? I also stated that I think they could keep it in high sec as long as they fixed it, so you can't bot it so easy, and do it AFK so easy. Whats so stupid about that?

    (Also, i don't gank people, i fly solo 90% of the time, fighting outnumbered, or outgunned)
    Solj RichPopolous
    Silent Havok.
    H A R D L I N E R S
    #95 - 2011-12-20 01:30:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Solj RichPopolous
    Like what that other guy said, EVE is way too boring a game to actually spend money on. This is why I personally fully endorse PLEX. Of my time spent logged on I spend ~75% of it station spinning waiting for something to happen, definitely not worth $15/mon.

    But I do believe EVE should be more harsh. I am in favor of level 4s in lowsec, and not because I want to gank n00bs. In other MMOs that are far more forgiving than EVE a n00b quickly learns that if he wants to make the big money he will have to go to the dangerous areas. I believe the main reason for the disparity between the PVP inclined and the PVP adverse is in the experience.
    If n00bs have to quickly learn to use scanner and be proactive in a constant PVP environment then there wouldn't be so many people who just utterly fail without constant FC direction.

    Further more you can be casual and still do missions in lowsec. I know for the most part the human race is lazy and the majority suffer from a spatial awareness deficiency as well as the inability to think ahead more than 1 or 2 steps. But they should still be forced to learn instead of having everything hand fed to them.
    Xoria Krint
    The Angelic
    #96 - 2011-12-20 01:30:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Xoria Krint
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    There are always going to be problems with the ships. There are always going to be balance issues, or a feature that not everyone is happy with. But, that doesnt mean that you should STOP adding ships. If that was the case, this game would still be stuck with Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships and Industrial Ships. (but i bet you dont notice the difference, since you don't PvP.)

    True, but its really bad now, and has been for long. Eve was much more balanced back when there was only Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships and Industrial ship.

    And before they add a new ship - they should have thought of a role. Don't you agree honeybee?

    EDIT: Gnite guys, i bet this thread ain't over yet. Love you all <3Oops
    Sallaria Gengod
    Doomheim
    #97 - 2011-12-20 01:41:11 UTC
    Xoria Krint wrote:
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    There are always going to be problems with the ships. There are always going to be balance issues, or a feature that not everyone is happy with. But, that doesnt mean that you should STOP adding ships. If that was the case, this game would still be stuck with Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships and Industrial Ships.

    True, but its really bad now, and has been for long. Eve was much more balanced back when there was only Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships and Industrial ship.

    And before they adda new ship - they should have thought of a role. Don't you agree honeybee?

    EDIT: Gnite guys, i bet this thread ain't over yet. Love you all <3Oops


    Hehe, Im gonna crack one of your nutz if you call me honeybee again. P

    But lets get to the point. Saddly it not so easy as you think to ensure balance in a game the size and complexity of EVE.
    What started off as something simple has, over time, become more and more complex. From 4 ship classes to what? Over 30 each with atleast 2 ships in each? Spread over 4 races. Thats an insane amount of information to get to grips with, let along trying to balance it. And as for balancing, there are only so many ways you can do it.

    You can try and slot it in somewhere in an existing class and tweak the numbers. You can give it its own class. You can make it a tech level higher than the others. But, every single method is going to present problems. Its just that some are more exagerated than others. Blanace is not an easy thing to achieve despite what you might think. Even less so in a game like Eve where the dynamics of the game and peoples uses of the ships can throw the blanace that was intended right out of the window.
    Xoria Krint
    The Angelic
    #98 - 2011-12-20 01:45:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Xoria Krint
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    Hehe, Im gonna crack one of your nutz if you call me honeybee again. P

    But lets get to the point. Saddly it not so easy as you think to ensure balance in a game the size and complexity of EVE.
    What started off as something simple has, over time, become more and more complex. From 4 ship classes to what? Over 30 each with atleast 2 ships in each? Spread over 4 races. Thats an insane amount of information to get to grips with, let along trying to balance it. And as for balancing, there are only so many ways you can do it.

    You can try and slot it in somewhere in an existing class and tweak the numbers. You can give it its own class. You can make it a tech level higher than the others. But, every single method is going to present problems. Its just that some are more exagerated than others. Blanace is not an easy thing to achieve despite what you might think. Even less so in a game like Eve where the dynamics of the game and peoples uses of the ships can throw the blanace that was intended right out of the window.

    I think you try to see it too complex. I would say it's really simple. Attack vs counter. That's what it's all about. Pretty simple when you just spell it out? Right? Have you ever seen a Falcon in game, my cupcake? Or maybe tasted some of the sweet overpowered ECM-drones?

    (I call you honeybee out of love, respect my love)
    Sallaria Gengod
    Doomheim
    #99 - 2011-12-20 01:48:09 UTC
    Xoria Krint wrote:
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    Hehe, Im gonna crack one of your nutz if you call me honeybee again. P

    But lets get to the point. Saddly it not so easy as you think to ensure balance in a game the size and complexity of EVE.
    What started off as something simple has, over time, become more and more complex. From 4 ship classes to what? Over 30 each with atleast 2 ships in each? Spread over 4 races. Thats an insane amount of information to get to grips with, let along trying to balance it. And as for balancing, there are only so many ways you can do it.

    You can try and slot it in somewhere in an existing class and tweak the numbers. You can give it its own class. You can make it a tech level higher than the others. But, every single method is going to present problems. Its just that some are more exagerated than others. Blanace is not an easy thing to achieve despite what you might think. Even less so in a game like Eve where the dynamics of the game and peoples uses of the ships can throw the blanace that was intended right out of the window.

    I think you try to see it too complex. I would say it's really simple. Attack vs counter. That's what it's all about. Pretty simple when you just spell it out? Right?

    Have you ever seen a Falcon in game, sir? Or maybe some of the sweet overpowered ECM-drones?



    But, if Eve were a game that was that simple, it wouldnt appeal to the audience that it does. Would it? And it would be a very empty game. Well, it would be emptier. Besides, Eve is thankfully NOT that simple. It would be boring. I applaud that CCP has tried to mix up the ships by giving some of them specific roles that dont fall along the simple lines of Attack Vs Defense. It means that you are required to adopt different strategies. I think...you are looking at EVE far too simply.
    Xoria Krint
    The Angelic
    #100 - 2011-12-20 01:52:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Xoria Krint
    Sallaria Gengod wrote:

    But, if Eve were a game that was that simple, it wouldnt appeal to the audience that it does. Would it? And it would be a very empty game. Well, it would be emptier. Besides, Eve is thankfully NOT that simple. It would be boring. I applaud that CCP has tried to mix up the ships by giving some of them specific roles that dont fall along the simple lines of Attack Vs Defense. It means that you are required to adopt different strategies. I think...you are looking at EVE far too simply.

    Wow.. Now you are mixing things up. There is difference between Eve being complex. And ship balancing being complex. And even how complex it now can be (rocket scienceShocked). We have not seen any progress on even trying to balance it, some things has been broken for years and nothing changes, but new features comes out. Quite frustrating. But you thinks everything is just as it should be? Aiiight