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You're not actually going IN to an asteroid field!!
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Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#21 - 2015-01-21 11:06:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Daichi Yamato
Cause RP reasons?? We can pretend some of the missiles hit pretendy rocks.

I was just pointing out that the whole equation thing was unnecessary.

Sig affects turrets too if the target or attacker is moving.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Lugh Crow-Slave
#22 - 2015-01-21 11:25:11 UTC
I know it effects turrets if the target is moving but it affects missiles even if the target isn't


RP reasons aside this would have a poor effect on missiles if you wind up engaging a target in a belt and i can't agree with a system that would have a negative effect on PvP just so miners have a reason to enjoy the pretty rocks.

but this is a fun topic so lets keep the ideas coming

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Kenrailae
Scrapyard Artificer's
#23 - 2015-01-21 12:23:01 UTC
To be fair, Line of sight between attacker and target, all arguments about server load aside(yes I know there are an asteroid field full of them both ways), would massively change the way Eve PVP worked. Maybe for the better.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal
Tusker Crazinski
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2015-01-21 13:57:15 UTC
Not going to lie this would be interesting.... but all I'd do is use a TP to confirm LOS.
Silvetica Dian
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#25 - 2015-01-21 14:39:09 UTC
FoxFire Ayderan wrote:
They'd be crazy to follow us.

Being a miner it's rather dangerous to actually be in the asteroid field among the rocks, given that should any gankers show up (or extra tough rats), you may have a difficult time getting out. Meanwhile the rats/gankers have 100% free and clear shots with no obstructions (not even the largest asteroids) to hitting you.

So, a smart miner stays well free and clear of the rocks they are mining, for ease of exit should it be needed.

And you don't get to enjoy the very cool effect of being in among the rocks (especially now with the update).

I think it ought to actually be of benefit to be in among the asteroids. Now granted it's probably a programming nightmare to make all the rocks be actual obstructions to gun fire. However, it ought to be significantly more difficult for rats (or gankers) to hit you if you are in among the asteroids. And of course difficult for you to hit back (if you are equipped to do so).

However any combat drones will leave the asteroid field to fight off attackers. And so they would actually become a threat to attackers who are getting hit by them, while meanwhile they are having great difficultly hitting you!

This makes more sense now too given there are all these little rocks around now. All these little rocks would deflect and absorb many shots on you, however they would not be an obstruction to getting up to warp speed as you just bump them out of the way. (Only the big rocks obstruct your path).

Perhaps there is a way to program this so that the deeper you are among the rocks, the greater the cover. And perhaps as asteroids are eliminated the amount of cover decreases.

Now.... let the griefer and ganker protests and wailing begin. Lol


so you want debris to interfere with gun targetting as well as presumably mining lasors?
i am sure all the miners will be very happy adjusting their position after every roid pops until they can hit their next target.....
or did you this mechanic to only effect people who play in a different way to yourself?

Money at its root is a form of rationing. When the richest 85 people have as much wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion (50% of humanity) it is clear where the source of poverty is. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/20/trickle-down-economics-broken-promise-richest-85
Mantish Maca
ORE DYNAMIC OPERATIONS
#26 - 2015-01-21 15:45:45 UTC
How about simply do that ships near rocks in some range have signature radius bones?(lowered)
FoxFire Ayderan
#27 - 2015-01-21 21:20:14 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Cause RP reasons?? We can pretend some of the missiles hit pretendy rocks.

I was just pointing out that the whole equation thing was unnecessary.

Sig affects turrets too if the target or attacker is moving.


Indeed, that is probably the easiest route to go. That is unless you wanted to take into account where in the belt you are into effect (for instance deeper in). But I suppose that's not entirely necessary.
FoxFire Ayderan
#28 - 2015-01-21 21:29:25 UTC
Silvetica Dian wrote:


so you want debris to interfere with gun targetting as well as presumably mining lasors?
i am sure all the miners will be very happy adjusting their position after every roid pops until they can hit their next target.....
or did you this mechanic to only effect people who play in a different way to yourself?


Now why would the debris interfere with mining lasers? They are made specifically to vaporize rocks.

I would like for the small debris to be actual objects that your mining ship could push out of the way as it moves through the belt and which your mining lasers would visually vaporize as they get in the way of a rock you are mining. But given that's not feasible with the way they are currently designed, we can just assume they don't interfere with mining lasers.

I would actually like the mineable asteroids to interfere with mining lasers because it's rather dumb looking when your mining laser passes through one of them to mine the rock your on. This isn't all that frequent, but when it occurs I do in fact move my ship so that the laser isn't passing through another rock to get to the one I'm on.

Anyhow that's all beside the point. Which is it would be nice for it to be advantageous to situate your ship inside of a belt in order to better protect yourself. We can assume the rocks interfere with gun fire (projectiles, missiles, non-mining lasers) , but not with mining lasers themselves.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2015-01-21 21:41:17 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Neat. So no downsides to the miner whatsoever!


Seems like a perfectly reasonable and balanced idea, and definitely not some halfbaked ganker fix.


...

Actually, it would probably get more miners tangled in rocks than it would save any from weapons' fire. It also blocks the miner's shots to the attacker, if they were actually shooting anything back.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#30 - 2015-01-21 21:53:30 UTC
FoxFire Ayderan wrote:



Now why would the debris interfere with mining lasers? They are made specifically to vaporize rocks.




They should pick up scrap ore.

there are ores in the game that are near worthless. They are almost certainly floating around the same belts as the rest of the rocks but just dont show up on overview.

As they pass through your mining beam they should be vaporized, appear in your ore hold and take up some of the m3 per cycle, effectively reducing your efficiency unless you get up real close.

This could be done with the same %/metre to target formula or whatever, and crappy ore keeps appearing in your hold which you have to eject. Another reason to not go afk.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Scuzzy Logic
Space Spuds
#31 - 2015-01-22 06:06:00 UTC
Wouldn't it be simple toadd an area debuff that makes anything trying to hit something in an asteroid field have a chance to miss?

Not that I'm too keen on the idea, but I like the RP aspect.
Scuzzy Logic
Space Spuds
#32 - 2015-01-22 06:06:54 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
FoxFire Ayderan wrote:



Now why would the debris interfere with mining lasers? They are made specifically to vaporize rocks.




They should pick up scrap ore.

there are ores in the game that are near worthless. They are almost certainly floating around the same belts as the rest of the rocks but just dont show up on overview.

As they pass through your mining beam they should be vaporized, appear in your ore hold and take up some of the m3 per cycle, effectively reducing your efficiency unless you get up real close.

This could be done with the same %/metre to target formula or whatever, and crappy ore keeps appearing in your hold which you have to eject. Another reason to not go afk.


I... am okay with this.

Then again I mine Veld...
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