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Suggestion New Clone Mechanic
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Rollo Brinalle
Imaginary Rats.
#1 - 2015-01-08 08:01:38 UTC
So as CCP is looking all things clone and the overall goal to create more content in the game I have a suggestion.

NEW:
The new mechanic I'm proposing is the ability to immediately "Transfer" into a new clone if you are in the same station as a clone you want to occupy.

UNCHANGED:
I agree with leaving untouched the current mechanic to "Jump" to a clone in a different station should be restricted and held to the 24 or shorter due to skill training etc... as there are many benefits of keeping this in place.

BENEFITS:
The proposed new mechanic would
1. Allow for players to take advantage of more of the game sooner creating more overall content
2. Could keep a player in the game longer
3. Create more movement and activity in different areas of the game.
4. Remove the risk adverseness where players would just hang out because they are not in the proper clone

LORE:
It could fit well into the lore as a an ability the Sansha or SOE have been experimenting on and either we discovered from Sansha or SOE is now distributing after they were caught using the ability in the shattered WHs.


Thoughts from the community on this. I don't really see any glaring negativity to a change like this.


Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2015-01-08 14:10:12 UTC
This gets suggested on a weekly basis. The last one is only on page two of this very forum.

Please, learn to search.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#3 - 2015-01-08 14:35:08 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
This gets suggested on a weekly basis. The last one is only on page two of this very forum.

Please, learn to search.

I don't recall seeing a variation which explained this specific concept so well.

The one where you can freely swap clone if in the same station, that is.

The past ones tended to be somewhat vague, or created the wrong impression too often.

As to the idea itself, I know many would argue that it is fair having a player deal with the consequences of a clone jump resulting in being stuck out of play, or risking implants priced outside the range of casual use.
The term fair gets batted around a lot like this.

Life is not fair. Worrying about what is fair, is a waste of time when fair and best results are not aligned.

If this makes the game play better, put it in.
Save fairness for the real world, where it has actual value.

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
King Fu Hostile
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#4 - 2015-01-08 14:49:31 UTC
Rollo Brinalle wrote:


BENEFITS:
The proposed new mechanic would
1. Allow for players to take advantage of more of the game sooner creating more overall content
2. Could keep a player in the game longer
3. Create more movement and activity in different areas of the game.
4. Remove the risk adverseness where players would just hang out because they are not in the proper clone


You need to open these up a bit more

I realize you just pulled them out of your stinkhole, but at least make an effort to cover your real motive, which is:

5. Allow players to be risk averse and remove all the consequences of using implant sets
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#5 - 2015-01-08 15:04:51 UTC
King Fu Hostile wrote:
Rollo Brinalle wrote:


BENEFITS:
The proposed new mechanic would
1. Allow for players to take advantage of more of the game sooner creating more overall content
2. Could keep a player in the game longer
3. Create more movement and activity in different areas of the game.
4. Remove the risk adverseness where players would just hang out because they are not in the proper clone


You need to open these up a bit more

I realize you just pulled them out of your stinkhole, but at least make an effort to cover your real motive, which is:

5. Allow players to be risk averse and remove all the consequences of using implant sets

Your point plays out to only allow two potentials:
1. So, you want players to either be avoiding gameplay when they find themselves in a high ISK-loss potential situation,
OR
2. You want them to be so wealthy that the loss of ISK on this scale has no meaning to them.

A player that fits into the range where loss of expensive implants becomes a consideration, will not undock for fun when they are wearing them.
They would logically only undock when the loss of these implants became a secondary consideration.

People do make mistakes, but most often only when they consider a single move ahead.

BOB: I need to be in this space, so I can join with my buddies and pew pew!
(Bob clone jumps, as regular travel would fail to place him there in time)
BOB: Oh poop, it seems I have the expensive ratting implants plugged in here, I forgot! I cannot afford to risk these on a roam where I will have a great risk of being podded!!

Bob is unlikely to make the mistake of undocking in implants he cannot afford to lose, far more than he would simply say go for it, because Bob cannot afford to replace these implants casually.

TL;DR Your desire to have justice in consequences comes at the price of cutting out gameplay

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Hopelesshobo
Hoboland
#6 - 2015-01-08 15:23:57 UTC
Personally I have always been a fan of not incurring a jump clone timer if you are swapping clones in the same station. The main reason for a jump clone timer as it is, is to prevent instant travel at will anytime you want. If one wants to be in a different clone with different implants, and they take the time to either travel to that system, or makes a tactical choice to keep all their clones nearby instead of spread all over the galaxy, let them reap the benefits of their decision.

Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#7 - 2015-01-08 15:43:01 UTC
Hopelesshobo wrote:
Personally I have always been a fan of not incurring a jump clone timer if you are swapping clones in the same station. The main reason for a jump clone timer as it is, is to prevent instant travel at will anytime you want. If one wants to be in a different clone with different implants, and they take the time to either travel to that system, or makes a tactical choice to keep all their clones nearby instead of spread all over the galaxy, let them reap the benefits of their decision.

This exactly.

Make jump clone travel a separate issue from jump clone exchanges for implant purposes.

Do you place a local jump clone, worthless to travel since you are at the location?
You had to use a travel clone either before from here, or have standings high enough to place one directly, in order to even have this empty clone in the first place.
(Free use, since you receive no travel benefit, you are effectively using an implant fitting option previously only available as a side effect to travel)

Do you want to jump to a distant clone, where you can be on the other side of the galaxy in an instant?
This exists currently, and is limited to block excessive travel by a timer function.

Either way, your skills only allow a limited number of clones, as well as requiring you to have certain standings to place that first clone which you intend to jump with.

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Rollo Brinalle
Imaginary Rats.
#8 - 2015-01-08 16:10:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Rollo Brinalle
King Fu Hostile wrote:
Rollo Brinalle wrote:


BENEFITS:
The proposed new mechanic would
1. Allow for players to take advantage of more of the game sooner creating more overall content
2. Could keep a player in the game longer
3. Create more movement and activity in different areas of the game.
4. Remove the risk adverseness where players would just hang out because they are not in the proper clone


You need to open these up a bit more

I realize you just pulled them out of your stinkhole, but at least make an effort to cover your real motive, which is:

5. Allow players to be risk averse and remove all the consequences of using implant sets



What my suggestion allows is an option for a person to move quickly from one body to another so they can do other things. Hell maybe a individual is in a hauler clone with those specific implants like hauling, or mining boosting, or running incursions and that activity is done now and they want to go do something else. If the limiting factor is being in the wrong clone for the job I'd rather offer an option to quickly change their clone rather then sitting idle in station or go off to play another game because they choose not to risk a clone that is only for a specific job or yes too expensive. Regardless of the reason we should give more options to do other things not limit people.

(TL:DR: Miner rant over "Risk Adverseness")
The one thing I do get tired of discussing is "risk adverseness" people will choose to either do something or not do something based upon THEIR level of risk plain and simple. If that means waiting 24 hours to do something else they will wait. When the individual has the ultimate choice of to do something or not to do something there is no way to make them risk more then they are comfortable risking. This logic goes all the way up to and includes the choice of playing the game or to not play the game until later. Again it is Their choice.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#9 - 2015-01-08 17:37:41 UTC
Nikk Narrel wrote:
King Fu Hostile wrote:
Rollo Brinalle wrote:


BENEFITS:
The proposed new mechanic would
1. Allow for players to take advantage of more of the game sooner creating more overall content
2. Could keep a player in the game longer
3. Create more movement and activity in different areas of the game.
4. Remove the risk adverseness where players would just hang out because they are not in the proper clone


You need to open these up a bit more

I realize you just pulled them out of your stinkhole, but at least make an effort to cover your real motive, which is:

5. Allow players to be risk averse and remove all the consequences of using implant sets

Your point plays out to only allow two potentials:
1. So, you want players to either be avoiding gameplay when they find themselves in a high ISK-loss potential situation,
OR
2. You want them to be so wealthy that the loss of ISK on this scale has no meaning to them.


OR we want some element of risk to come from using implants that boost your stats

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#10 - 2015-01-08 18:13:26 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Nikk Narrel wrote:
1. So, you want players to either be avoiding gameplay when they find themselves in a high ISK-loss potential situation,
OR
2. You want them to be so wealthy that the loss of ISK on this scale has no meaning to them.


OR we want some element of risk to come from using implants that boost your stats

Risk is arbitrary here.

You are not simply risking your time by betting your skills, you are upping the stakes of the bet on one side by including an element which is clearly not required by it's owner.
The owner demonstrates this beyond a shadow of a doubt, by attempting to leave that element behind.

If this were two players testing their skills against each other, and nothing else was at stake, then good gameplay could more easily emerge from that.

But, when you force this artificial need, or else allow only non-play as an option, you diminish the gameplay to a degree measured by each encounter which no longer occurs, multiplied by the number of players who would have been involved.
All sides are being punished, by that part of the game not happening.

These are players who otherwise want to go out and take risks.
The fact that they feel that the stakes are too high, means noone gets to play with them instead.

What good are claims of fairness, when they result in a contest which never happens?

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...