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[Rhea] Small Beam Lasers

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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#61 - 2014-11-28 17:41:59 UTC
I for one welcome our new soon to be nerfed right after inception Beam Confessor Overlords.





Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
God's Apples
Wilderness
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
#62 - 2014-11-28 18:31:51 UTC
Lloyd Roses wrote:
With those changes and Aurora S

Confessor: 245dps at 75k optimal
Retribution: 145dps at 50k optimal

Not bad, they'll blend in nicely with other absurdities like sniper cormorants and rail-harpies.


So is the confessor going to have an insane price or what is the reason to make it such a sniperbeast?


With a heat sink + t2 collision rig they will do something like 420 dps cold with gleam. The carnage will be glorious.

"Hydra Reloaded are just jealous / butthurt on me / us because we can get tons of PVP action in empire while they aren't good enough to get that." - NightmareX
SFM Hobb3s
Perkone
Caldari State
#63 - 2014-11-28 19:12:59 UTC
I see they've announced the cure for Herp--I mean Harpies.
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#64 - 2014-11-29 03:45:58 UTC
Maybe relax the fitting a little?

and add us a 3rd type of beam?

ultra giga gatling beam lasozs?

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro
Eessi
Murderous Inc
Me Hearties
#65 - 2014-11-29 12:52:40 UTC
Woot!! Excited about the beam confesor fleets!!! Whoop whoop
Phaade
LowKey Ops
Shadow Cartel
#66 - 2014-11-30 00:04:58 UTC
Viribus wrote:
Capqu wrote:
ishtars?


i think you'll find that a 65k EHP cruiser that can easily fit a 100mn AB and do 600dps at 80km with mega pulse tracking is in fact perfectly balanced, since they occasionally abandon drones, losing precious seconds of DPS right-clicking your drone bay and pressing "launch"

i mean the PVP savants of CCP nerfed the optimal + tracking bonus from 7.5 to 5, what more could you possibly want???



GG CCP
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#67 - 2014-11-30 03:34:03 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hanazava Karyna wrote:
So, finally, small beams are good to use? Large can be used to detent PvE so now I'm waiting for medium ones.
Good changes, thanks a lot.


Medium Beams aren't perfect, but I think you'll find them in fairly decent shape since the Odyssey 1.1 changes.

Medium beams are quite overpowered. The problem is that medium ships don't have good bonuses to the weapons.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#68 - 2014-11-30 07:35:15 UTC
MashXX wrote:
Kiting executioners ahoy!

Really happy to see one of the lesser used frigate sized weapon systems get a much needed boost. Hopefully you'll also be taking a look at small artillery cannons when the minmatar t3 destroyer gets released.

Cheers Fozzie!


Really looking forward to how this plays out on the Crusader; the CPU reduction and dps increases look very promising to me.
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#69 - 2014-11-30 07:37:13 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hanazava Karyna wrote:
So, finally, small beams are good to use? Large can be used to detent PvE so now I'm waiting for medium ones.
Good changes, thanks a lot.


Medium Beams aren't perfect, but I think you'll find them in fairly decent shape since the Odyssey 1.1 changes.

Medium beams are quite overpowered. The problem is that medium ships don't have good bonuses to the weapons.

True that. If the Zealot got a tracking speed bonus we might see them a little more widely used, but that isn't the case. Oddly enough the legion doesn't have one...I suppose fixing that might help it suck a bit less.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#70 - 2014-11-30 09:17:47 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
Medium beams are quite overpowered. The problem is that medium ships don't have good bonuses to the weapons.


What?

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This is the law of ship progression!

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Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#71 - 2014-11-30 11:28:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Reaver Glitterstim
Medium beams don't need a tracking bonus, they track just fine with scorch ammo. Give them an optimal range bonus and they have overpowered range. The Maller would be decent if defensive ships made decent kiters, but the Maller being a brawler just sets it up for medium pulse lasers which suck. The Omen can lose that capacitor bonus because it's unnecessary as medium beams actually don't draw all that much capacitor in anything but an extended siege (and who in their right mind would use a skirmish ship like the Omen in a siege?). The Harbinger REALLY doesn't need that capacitor cost reduction, as it could easily maintain full lasers during an extended siege. It should get some other bonus instead. The Navy Omen and the Zealot are actually pretty decent. I don't know if the Phantasm is any good but it has a tracking bonus that it probably doesn't need. Otherwise it would make an excellent kiter with that afterburner bonus. Absolution is pretty beast as a beam laser brawler.

So I guess the sucky laser boats are the tech 1. Just give one of them a range bonus and it becomes beast.






Or you could nerf medium beam laser tracking to a reasonable value--still higher than rails but not THAT much higher--and then make their capacitor cost actually hurt, to justify their incredible DPS. Then the capacitor cost reduction would be nice, tracking bonuses would be useful, and medium laser ships with range bonuses would be less overpowered. Laser boats without the capacitor cost reduction would be quick gank boats (like omen or zealot), while the brawlers (like maller or harbinger) should have the cost reduction.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#72 - 2014-11-30 12:00:25 UTC
In conjunction with what I said in the pulse thread, I can see this allowing for a beam fit Retribution doctrine. Other laser ships I will still prefer the pulse. If it makes it to medium and large, it will be far less impacting as so many Amarr ships have been converted to missile and drone now. There are very few laser boats left.
Akemon Numon
Doomheim
#73 - 2014-11-30 12:14:51 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
Medium beams don't need a tracking bonus, they track just fine with scorch ammo. Give them an optimal range bonus and they have overpowered range. The Maller would be decent if defensive ships made decent kiters, but the Maller being a brawler just sets it up for medium pulse lasers which suck. The Omen can lose that capacitor bonus because it's unnecessary as medium beams actually don't draw all that much capacitor in anything but an extended siege (and who in their right mind would use a skirmish ship like the Omen in a siege?). The Harbinger REALLY doesn't need that capacitor cost reduction, as it could easily maintain full lasers during an extended siege. It should get some other bonus instead. The Navy Omen and the Zealot are actually pretty decent. I don't know if the Phantasm is any good but it has a tracking bonus that it probably doesn't need. Otherwise it would make an excellent kiter with that afterburner bonus. Absolution is pretty beast as a beam laser brawler.

So I guess the sucky laser boats are the tech 1. Just give one of them a range bonus and it becomes beast.






Or you could nerf medium beam laser tracking to a reasonable value--still higher than rails but not THAT much higher--and then make their capacitor cost actually hurt, to justify their incredible DPS. Then the capacitor cost reduction would be nice, tracking bonuses would be useful, and medium laser ships with range bonuses would be less overpowered. Laser boats without the capacitor cost reduction would be quick gank boats (like omen or zealot), while the brawlers (like maller or harbinger) should have the cost reduction.





You do realize Scorch only works with T2 Pulse Lasers? "Medium beams don't need a tracking bonus, they track just fine with scorch ammo." So you either don't know your ass from a hole in the ground or are trolling.
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#74 - 2014-11-30 18:48:56 UTC
I'd wager that the small rails and small arties will get looked at when the other T3 destroyers get released, which may well include turret-wide balances like the Scorch change.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#75 - 2014-11-30 18:55:10 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
I'd wager that the small rails and small arties will get looked at when the other T3 destroyers get released, which may well include turret-wide balances like the Scorch change.


perhaps then missiles will finally get looked at ..
- HAM's and rockets needs -50% range , but with some damage buffs in exchange
- maybe remove the lame rapid launchers gimmick for some proper missile options of appropriate sizes
- new missile tracking mods ,
- nerf cruises range down and slight ROF nerf.. Rise you know you overbuffed them

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
Schneevva
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#76 - 2014-12-01 06:30:36 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
I'd wager that the small rails and small arties will get looked at when the other T3 destroyers get released, which may well include turret-wide balances like the Scorch change.


Why exactly would this happen?
Reynas Arthie
Doomheim
#77 - 2014-12-02 00:17:06 UTC
Have been using small beam Tormentors and Executioners since the frigate re-balances.

+20% DPS and better alpha is very welcome might even verge on the OP.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#78 - 2014-12-02 02:16:00 UTC
No one uses these, therefore any change is effectively irrelevant anyway, so go for it.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#79 - 2014-12-02 02:18:34 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
Medium beams don't need a tracking bonus, they track just fine with scorch ammo.


Quoted to illustrate stupidity.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Anthar Thebess
#80 - 2014-12-02 09:30:39 UTC
Can we have similar changes to Dread guns?
Dreadnought lasers really need some love.

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