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Dev Blog - A new look for EVE’s UI – feedback needed!

First post First post First post
Author
O'drwex Dythoni
S0utherN Comfort
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#381 - 2014-11-10 19:47:05 UTC  |  Edited by: O'drwex Dythoni
Post II
8 UI key points

litle things we love because

We asked for them
You listened to us
We waited for them
They changed things for the best
Bad things were there before
Now good things are here
Just like real world cockpit improvements
Spaceships UI implements matters
They're the real deal, no need for fancy mp3 looking theme
Just things that you're not ashamed...
And we're happy about...
Them working and looking as intended !

Post I
Deacon Abox
Black Eagle5
Villore Accords
#382 - 2014-11-10 20:37:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Deacon Abox
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Wait wait wait a minute, you mean that all windows will be always transparent? By God, NO, I beg you!!! That would render the game UNPLAYABLE to me!!! SadSadSad

I TOTALLY and COMPLETELY nead a solid color background to read any text -PERIOD- No "ifs" or "maybes" or "whys" or "we can tune it", I suffer macular degeneration and I CAN NOT READ TEXT ON TEXTURED BACKGROUNDS.

Do whatever you want to pinned windows, I never pinned none exactly for this reason -but I need the option to have a solid color background behind every text, always and everywhere. Just an OPTION, no need to make the whole design revolve around the needs of people with visual impairment -but mind of it!

Unfortunately your macular degeneration may get the same consideration as players who get nausea from the forced camera pan with the gate jump animation. That consideration being zero.Straight

edit- and of course we've all had a taste of your affliction every time the damn over bright suns in space saturate the screen at any distance such that you can't even see the damn UI.Straight

CCP, there are off buttons for ship explosions, missile effects, turret effects, etc. "Immersion" does not seem to be harmed by those. So, [u]please[/u] give us a persisting off button for the jump gate and autoscan visuals.

Cecil McNamara
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#383 - 2014-11-10 21:09:56 UTC
It would be nice to have the space-view in a window and be able to arrange all the other ui-parts around it
Aureus Ahishatsu
Deadspace Knights
#384 - 2014-11-10 22:00:27 UTC
I would just like to commend you guys on this change. For a long time I have been looking at the icons on the left hand side thinking "good god these icons are horrible to find what i'm looking for!" Particularly when an account is reinstalled or logging into a new account on a computer. The market, item index, and wallet icons in particular come to mind as being overly complicated. It may not sound like much but I agree the icon overhaul was needed. I don't know if the colorless icons add but i'll take your word for it. If nothing else the icon changes are great though. Looking forward to this patch. As for the transparency it's like windows aero is getting released for eve LOL .
TheSmokingHertog
Julia's Interstellar Trade Emperium
#385 - 2014-11-10 22:31:30 UTC
Cecil McNamara wrote:
It would be nice to have the space-view in a window and be able to arrange all the other ui-parts around it


And then independent scale all windows.

"Dogma is kind of like quantum physics, observing the dogma state will change it." ~ CCP Prism X

"Schrödinger's Missile. I dig it." ~ Makari Aeron

-= "Brain in a Box on Singularity" - April 2015 =-

Faridzan
Don't Wake a sleeping bear
TIME CRIT
#386 - 2014-11-10 22:42:59 UTC
Rain6637
NulzSec
#387 - 2014-11-10 22:52:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
The day that spreadsheets became charts.

I started with a clean screenshot of space and added interface items one by one. After whittling away all the blank space, what was left was best displayed as a widget or a chart.

Tables aren't bad, in fact I think the information needs to be there in table format if they player wants to see it. The main issues are tables that are not interpreted into charts.

Other elements of UI turned into widgets when I started stripping away the blank space. Like the market widget, above the market activity feed.

Rows and Columns

A big issue with the windows we see is that columns and rows are bound to the same window. Rows display horizontally, and columns display vertically. Making them inseparable gives you a height and width, which guarantees you'll end up displaying things in a square format. Stop that.

These "do everything right now" windows are also bad because whole parts of the windows don't need to be displayed until an item is selected in the left side of the window. It stays blank until it's populated. Then after it's populated, it stays there until the window is closed or the next item is selected. Huge waste. The price windows should also have a "replace with new window, create additional window when SHIFT is pressed."

Market is the best example of where this can be removed. This is an example of the market selection where the specifics don't show up until they're needed--and then they should open a new window. The market categories should behave like the skill section of Character Sheet, where just one section is selected at a time, and the rest collapse. Better, yet, the inactive categories should disappear until the selected one is collapsed again. That widget should be movable, by the way.

Columns are also best manipulated starting at the top. So the side-neocom thing, stop that. I want to start at the tops of columns, not have to jump left and right between buttons and scroll bars, etc. Start at the top of the screen.

Eliminate F11 windows

I've combined probe scanner and star map with the game viewport (you know, the one we want to see) with an overlay. It's impossible to get the icons in space to coincide with the probe scan and star maps, but you can still mate the swivels anyway, so that when you turn the probe map, your camera faces that direction. This eliminates the bottom window in the F11 menu completely. Allowing the star and constellation maps eliminates the need for the others.

What you do with F10 and F11 now is set them as background windows to the viewport, and set them to a Toggle modifier key to activate them and bring them to the foreground, and subdue the viewport. What this allows is actions for the player between scanner sweeps, etc.

Local is clunky

This is probably the best example of completely wasted space, in the form of a table that has a column married to rows. In fact, I don't particularly care about the names of the pilots in local, I just want to know their standings to me. Just give me the count, by standings, or corp, fleet, etc.

For players who really want a player name display, perhaps in smaller systems where traffic is light but worth pouncing on, the standings colors can be a way to set standings as display a priority, and also a toggle to display the various standings at all. Whether it's lowsec or nullsec, (or highsec but **** them) it's likely that all the player wants to see are particular standings.

System count, obviously. I've tried some ideas for displaying the important info, like a delta ticker and a pie graph. The exceptional thing about the pie graph is that it can be placed within the current system icons, for a look into the local of next door systems. You could also add it in the form of lights to a stargate, since we align the camera down it anyway (which is jarring, but whatever). As if to say "jump is happening, this is the status of the system you are jumping to."

At EVE vegas in '12, soundwave said that spaceships right now are about as smart as a 70's buick. Change that.

Market could also use a delta graph of liquid vs escrow vs buy / sell etc.

I have more, but I need to build the graphics, still. I feel like if I don't put it into visual format, you won't get it. CCP. ten years and we're still playing Excel.

remove:
-concealment
-empty, wasted space
-un-marry rows and columns
-delay appearance of windows as long as possible
-retract them as soon as possible

-tables are bad, unless they're interpreted or visualized with a chart or widget

-preserve immersion
-improve awareness

btw, why can't we align to probes? would be useful when we get a basic hit, and make responding to a warpable scan result sooner.

also, why did you keep this art stuff a secret until Sisi? I wish we had some way to stop you from spending so much time on a reskin.



A lot of Neocom windows have a search function at the top. My gut tells me the People & Places search function is the most comprehensive, and the best candidate to become a unified search field, to display out to the side of the Neocom buttons.

also give it a key bind that when pressed, will open a small search window with the input field active... so that I can start typing and press enter without looking. toggle it off too.

Another thing worth removing is mouse travel.
Gogela
The Conference Elite
CODE.
#388 - 2014-11-11 01:03:58 UTC
The onhover window transparency thing... that is SO useful, especially in a game in which you typically have so many windows up. Excellent upgrade. EvE will look a lot better on average imho.

Signatures should be used responsibly...

XxRTEKxX
256th Shadow Wing
Phantom-Recon
#389 - 2014-11-11 03:36:25 UTC  |  Edited by: XxRTEKxX
I spent about an hour on the test server today to try out the new UI. I really like it a lot. I ended up using the setting for Hologram the most. I like how well the contrast is on everything. I especially like the opaque background when using a window. It's cool when it goes back to semi-transparent when not used. Reminds me of Smart Glass. Glass that changes from transparent to translucent when activated with voltage, light or heat.

I also really liked how when I pin a window to get more transparency then I use that window and it goes sort of translucent on the background to increase the contrast of the text.

One thing that was nice to see was when the Sun was behind a window, the window was pinned, and I could still read all the text on the window. That is something I've been wanting in EVE for a long time. I haven't tried that in other than a couple systems. Not sure how it will look with the various types of suns in EVE.

Thanks CCP, keep up the great work.

The icons on the NeoCom....... Those I don't like very much. They'll definitely take some getting used to. All the windows now look more futuristic, but the NeoCom with it's icons just looks too plain and dull.
Lord Salty
The Classy Gentlemans Corporation
Moist.
#390 - 2014-11-11 07:26:04 UTC
So to clarify, Rain....you are without a doubt utterly ********.
Never before have i read such a massive amount of verbal diarrhea.
Everybody who has read what you wrote is now dumber for having read it.
You have most definitely made the world a worse place for expressing such stupid views.
Everything you propose here comes from a person 12 boxing 12 different characters on 12 different screens.
The rest of us enjoy the visuals we have. You are the only person desiring more numbers on your screen so that you can pay less attention.
Rain6637
NulzSec
#391 - 2014-11-11 08:00:15 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#392 - 2014-11-11 08:04:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Indahmawar Fazmarai
Deacon Abox wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Wait wait wait a minute, you mean that all windows will be always transparent? By God, NO, I beg you!!! That would render the game UNPLAYABLE to me!!! SadSadSad

I TOTALLY and COMPLETELY nead a solid color background to read any text -PERIOD- No "ifs" or "maybes" or "whys" or "we can tune it", I suffer macular degeneration and I CAN NOT READ TEXT ON TEXTURED BACKGROUNDS.

Do whatever you want to pinned windows, I never pinned none exactly for this reason -but I need the option to have a solid color background behind every text, always and everywhere. Just an OPTION, no need to make the whole design revolve around the needs of people with visual impairment -but mind of it!

Unfortunately your macular degeneration may get the same consideration as players who get nausea from the forced camera pan with the gate jump animation. That consideration being zero.Straight

edit- and of course we've all had a taste of your affliction every time the damn over bright suns in space saturate the screen at any distance such that you can't even see the damn UI.Straight


Well, a solid background fixes both issues. So far the situation is that I only can read the text of transparent windows against a planet's shadow -ordinary space is too bright and textured and just interferes with text. Even seeing my own ship is a problem.

I somehow hope they take this more seriously than the forced pan+nausea issue, as otherwise i'm doomed, I barely can play on the current Sisi build.

Admittedly I'm in a small collective... MD usually only affects people beyond certain age, and mine started like 20 years too early... but it's a real issue, and what is usable for us, turns to be comfortable for able-sighted people. Your brain never haves enough contrast. Cool
Xander Scaul
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#393 - 2014-11-11 08:28:05 UTC
I have spent some time on the test server, for what it's worth here are some of my thoughts on the new interface/style:

1. Every window is translucent and it made things hard to read (for me). It also was hard to read the show info windows when in space because of that effect.

2. I could not change any windows in a way that wasn't translucent, that by itself annoyed me. You should be able to change the windows.

3. The tool tips obscured some tabs and also my overview. Due mainly to where I have my windows, but I should be able to change the size of the tool tips themselves.

4. I personally do not like the new icons in the station tab (reminds me of Apple products), but that is just a personal preference. But can you give us an option to change them. Options are good.

5. Please can you give us an option to get rid of the new notification "button". I know you can move it, but no matter where I move it, it gets in the road of other windows. I just want it off my screen but I can't because there is no option to do so. Once again, options are good.

Overall I like the new style, but please give us the option to change things. Especially the translucent effect. I should be able to pin windows and make it a solid background or something to that effect.

On a personal note and totally unrelated: I am completely colour blind and one thing that really annoys me is the ewar module icons. At the moment they are colour coded (and always have been) and for people who are colour blind it makes it almost impossible to use them. I can not tell the difference of any of the modules as they are at the moment. Please if you're going to change anything please change those icons somehow.

Just my opinion for what it's worth.
Niliame
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#394 - 2014-11-11 08:48:03 UTC
Just no..
Aspecter en Welle
Iris Covenant
The Gorgon Empire
#395 - 2014-11-11 09:23:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Aspecter en Welle
Okey, feedback.

1. Mail window - i don`t see "reply", "forward" and other buttons for work with mails. JPG
2. I don`t see channel name, "attributes" and "communication" words in blue, pink and pink themes.
3. Intuitively not understood icons in neocom. Frendly UI?
4. True black-green UI theme?Roll
5. Multicolored icons in neocome are best. Its simply for find and understanding


P.S. Some new ideas about neocom icons: one, two

ex-RusEVERadio leader

Ireland - terrorists and guiness. Iceland - ice and Eve

Aganola
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#396 - 2014-11-11 10:27:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Aganola
Rain6637 wrote:
The day that spreadsheets became charts.

... AND STUFF ...



THIS!

CCP If you do not hire this guy, at least use his (her?) post to improve on your game!
Stop making Spreadsheats online and make EVE online.

cheers
Malou Hashur
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#397 - 2014-11-11 11:18:31 UTC
It’s been four days since the last Dev post.....

CCP have gone into their “People have pointed out issues with our new shiny feature, so instead of fixing the problems they mentioned, we are going to hide away and pout” mode early this time.

This will be closely followed by their “Well, we will change a few little cosmetic things, but then tough sh!t, you are having it anyway” mode.

Good times

CCP Philosophy ==>>

  1. If it works, break it. If it’s broken, leave it and break something else.

  2. Ignore all Forum comments that raise issues and concerns about our "features", and bring said "features" in anyway.

Malou Hashur
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#398 - 2014-11-11 11:28:43 UTC
CCP Claymore wrote:
We are very conscious of making these changes and that not all players are running quad sli titans. We will be striving to have the best possible performance for min spec machines.


Fixed that for you....

Quote:
We will be striving to have the best possible performance for min spec machines. It will be sh!t, but it’s the best you are getting



CCP Philosophy ==>>

  1. If it works, break it. If it’s broken, leave it and break something else.

  2. Ignore all Forum comments that raise issues and concerns about our "features", and bring said "features" in anyway.

Meditril
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#399 - 2014-11-11 12:16:05 UTC
I am looking forward to this change!
Nolan Kotulan
Nova Tabula Rasa
#400 - 2014-11-11 13:04:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Nolan Kotulan
Rain6637 wrote:
The day that spreadsheets became charts.

[...]


These are the worst UI propositions I have seen in my whole EVE's life.
Too much things and not enough time (currently at work) to explain exactly why, but...

Damn, that is just so bad...
Hope CCP will never follow this kind of... "design"...

Hell, I'll do my own mock-up and post it here if I have time one of these days!

Per aspera ad astra