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People saying homophobic slurs in chat. Will they be dealt with?

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Baneken
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#21 - 2014-10-25 07:33:38 UTC
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Herateis wrote:
Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all.


BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo.


They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game.
So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used.
Derrick Miles
Death Rabbit Ky Oneida
#22 - 2014-10-25 07:38:44 UTC
Baneken wrote:
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Herateis wrote:
Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all.


BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo.


They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game.
So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used.

Some people don't think it's funny to spread bigotry and hate speech.
Syssitia Nikostratos
Apobangpo Worldwide
#23 - 2014-10-25 07:51:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Syssitia Nikostratos
Baneken wrote:
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Herateis wrote:
Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all.


BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo.


They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game.
So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used.


I don't really think anyone's talking about foul language, like curse words. They're talking about hate speech and sexist/racist/homophobic slurs. That's a different thing.

This is not 'think of the children'. It's 'think of a fellow human being'. People of color, women, LGBT people have been beaten/raped/murdered with those words in their ears...throwing them around for lols is an exceptional level of disgusting.

Manners maketh man.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#24 - 2014-10-25 16:05:11 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street.

But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad).


I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum.

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#25 - 2014-10-25 18:22:25 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote:
ShahFluffers wrote:
Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street.

But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad).


I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum.

My points (and various chat channels of mine with that term as a name) still stand. Different people have different levels of tolerance, the GMs/DEVs can only get around to so many reports at any given time, the GMs/DEVs generally punish based on context rather than absolute usage, you can't reliably stop players from being 'tards in a game, and the lore of the game is based on murder/slavery/warfare/(insert other dystopian stuff here) which can often be more offensive than any mere word.


Believe me... I get the point that the other side is making about how we shouldn't tolerate this kind of stuff... but it isn't a one way street. Language and culture has a funny thing where (over time) it can take benign or offensive words/sayings and turn them on their head to mean something completely different. And if efforts are made to stamp it out, you just make the change happen faster (Streisand Effect)... or make it worse for purely "ironic reasons" because some people find it funny how other people can get SO MAD over mere words when words themselves have no real meaning except those we willingly attach to them.

How did you Veterans start?
Bagatur I
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#26 - 2014-10-25 19:19:03 UTC
the game already has a way to deal with it - if his language offends you, then block him and never hear from him another word.
why does CCP have to fix everything?
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#27 - 2014-10-26 05:40:48 UTC
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote:
I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum.


the Brits are just going out for a smoke break.


anyways if it is highly offensive and/or sustained then sure I don't mind CCP going after someone, but for the most part I think it is quite easy enough to ignore someone. personally I have a no ignore policy as who knows maybe they will do something useful in the future (aside from people like "adfklasdlkf" who are just isk spammers, who I luckily haven't seen in ages).

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Kalishka Ashkulf
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2014-10-26 13:33:22 UTC
Herateis wrote:
Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all.


Simply report them to the powers that be. Assuming the "F-word" rhymes with maggot, I personally would see that as a homophobic slur. However, I'm not part of the powers that be haha.

Open a ticket, explain the situation methodically (don't get emotional in your ticket) and carry on with your game. I agree, it shouldn't be tolerated, but unless you report it, it will go unchecked.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for insults and animal puffiness when it comes to words and slagging each other off. However, there is a line in the sand and it's explained in the ToS.

As said, simply report and move on. Don't continue communicating with said fellow players. If you do, you may run the risk of enlisting yourself for a complaint as well.

Why, thank you, Thing!
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#29 - 2014-10-27 01:32:28 UTC
Summer Isle wrote:
I still think having a preemptive blocking feature would be incredibly useful, but most others seem to disagree with me. As much as I don't consider cursing and swearing to be offensive, others do and might find this sort of feature useful, as well.

its a game populated by majority 28-32 year old players, if you find "foul language" offensive, then seriously, your living a cloistered life, because EVE will never be as bad as simply walking down the street within +/- 8 hours of the pub closing
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#30 - 2014-10-27 01:50:31 UTC
Baneken wrote:
Vol Arm'OOO wrote:
Herateis wrote:
Does reporting these people do any good? I see people say both F words, and other such garbage all the time in Local, as if they aren't worried at all.


BTW if you are thin skinned do some research before you join a null alliance - some of them (cough cough - goons) are known for using offensive slurs regularly, even going so far as naming fleets various offensive names - they claim its just them being ironically funny but its not funny at all imo.


They use them specifically to target people like you who don't have better things to do then complain about someone's filthy language in a computer game.
So yeah damn right that's funny to see someone going ballistic and all full blown "think of the children" because they see a bad word being used.


What is funny is when apologists for idiots come out to excuse stupidity. And no I dont go ballistic about these sorts of things - but the op seems to be concerned about it and thus I am sure would appreciate knowing of these things without having to truck all the way out there to find only that he doesnt fit in.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#31 - 2014-10-27 01:53:17 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn wrote:
ShahFluffers wrote:
Offended by the "F-word?" What are we in? Primary school? I've seen and heard MUCH worse just walking down the street.

But yeah... you can totally report it. Just don't expect much punishment to come out of mere trash talking or mildly foul language. The only times I've seen GMs or DEVs enforce their "foul language/content" rule is when it is REALLY bad (like, "whoa" or "omg" bad).


I think the OP means the three letter 'F' word that is used in America to describe homosexuals and not the four letter 'F' word that some people use ad nauseum.

My points (and various chat channels of mine with that term as a name) still stand. Different people have different levels of tolerance, the GMs/DEVs can only get around to so many reports at any given time, the GMs/DEVs generally punish based on context rather than absolute usage, you can't reliably stop players from being 'tards in a game, and the lore of the game is based on murder/slavery/warfare/(insert other dystopian stuff here) which can often be more offensive than any mere word.


Believe me... I get the point that the other side is making about how we shouldn't tolerate this kind of stuff... but it isn't a one way street. Language and culture has a funny thing where (over time) it can take benign or offensive words/sayings and turn them on their head to mean something completely different. And if efforts are made to stamp it out, you just make the change happen faster (Streisand Effect)... or make it worse for purely "ironic reasons" because some people find it funny how other people can get SO MAD over mere words when words themselves have no real meaning except those we willingly attach to them.


Its funny how people make your very argument only from behind the anominity of a computer terminal.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
#32 - 2014-10-27 02:44:30 UTC
It's important to police peoples thoughts and speech.

It's not engineered opinion at all.

Pay no attention to the men behind the curtain.

Remember remember the 5th of November.
Vol Arm'OOO
Central Co-Prosperity Union
#33 - 2014-10-27 13:29:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Vol Arm'OOO
Ireland VonVicious wrote:
It's important to police peoples thoughts and speech.

It's not engineered opinion at all.

Pay no attention to the men behind the curtain.

Remember remember the 5th of November.


BS. Its a question of common courtesy. Some folk think its ok to be rude and spout whatever nonsense pops into their heads at any time. Other folk think that society functions best when you are conscious of your fellow societymates, their feelings, etc. . . .

Sure you have a right to think and say what you want, but if you are a rude asshat, everyone else has an equal right to call you out as a rude asshat.

I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
13kr1d1
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#34 - 2014-10-27 17:56:47 UTC  |  Edited by: 13kr1d1
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
Summer Isle wrote:
I still think having a preemptive blocking feature would be incredibly useful, but most others seem to disagree with me. As much as I don't consider cursing and swearing to be offensive, others do and might find this sort of feature useful, as well.

its a game populated by majority 28-32 year old players, if you find "foul language" offensive, then seriously, your living a cloistered life, because EVE will never be as bad as simply walking down the street within +/- 8 hours of the pub closing



And if you don't like that, you don't have to walk down those alleys at night. It's a choice, just like it's a choice to block people using foul language in the game.

Ireland VonVicious wrote:
It's important to police peoples thoughts and speech.

It's not engineered opinion at all.

Pay no attention to the men behind the curtain.

Remember remember the 5th of November.



The game has word filters and the game has block options, just like World of Warcraft or any other MMO. That doesn't suddenly mean it's okay to use that language. In any other MMO with similar functions, you can still be reported for language that is "offensive" and "foul" and "sexual", etc, and receive a mute all the way up to perma ban for repeated infractions.

Remember that, extra rules and abilities to avoid foul language do NOT make foul language suddenly okay. If there's rules in place against that foul language, you're the one taking the risk using such language in chat channels, regardless of any block or filter functions.

You kinds of people would sound no different if you said "hey, we have legal options to deal with murder, therefore murder's okay and if you can't handle it, lighten up or dont leave your home".

Eve or any other MMO is supposed to be a space accesible to all users, regardless of age or personal beliefs. If YOU dont like THAT, continue to use foul language and accumulate reports until they do hit you with a penalty.

Don't kid yourselves. Even the dirtiest pirates from the birth of EVE have been carebears. They use alts to bring them goods at cheap prices and safely, rather than live with consequences of their in game actions on their main, from concord to prices
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#35 - 2014-10-27 22:08:20 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
13kr1d1 wrote:
Remember that, extra rules and abilities to avoid foul language do NOT make foul language suddenly okay. If there's rules in place against that foul language, you're the one taking the risk using such language in chat channels, regardless of any block or filter functions.

Perspective is a funny thing. What is not foul to me can be foul to someone else and vice versa. Who is right and who is wrong?

Not everyone sees the world in quite the same way.

13kr1d1 wrote:
You kinds of people would sound no different if you said "hey, we have legal options to deal with murder, therefore murder's okay and if you can't handle it, lighten up or dont leave your home".

Except language isn't a zero-sum thing the same way life and death is.

Language changes and is processed different for everyone (again, perspective). It's a giant grey area where meaning can only be derived from context rather than absolute usage (though, there are people out there who can only think in literal/superficial terms).

13kr1d1 wrote:
Eve or any other MMO is supposed to be a space accesible to all users, regardless of age or personal beliefs. If YOU dont like THAT, continue to use foul language and accumulate reports until they do hit you with a penalty.

I find your words hateful and intolerant. For that I will report you.

(see what I did there?)



Anyways... as much as I would like to beat this horse a few more times (mostly because it rials people up) I think it detracts from the whole point behind the New Citizens forum here... so I'll stop.

How did you Veterans start?
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#36 - 2014-10-27 23:31:43 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
I do agree that there should be a line that you can't cross.

However, keep in mind that EVE is global MMO.

You are playing with thousands of people from all over the globe, this also means you have people from all ethnic backgrounds, different religions and different cultures.

Because of this it's very hard to say that word "x" is forbidden, because due to the above, for some reason it can be offensive to one person while the another doesn't see any harm into it.

*Any of the vets remember the "Mate incident" that haunted YT and the forums for a whileBlink*



I found out this is ever so true in RL when on my internship in the States.

Where it is frowned upon to use "the N-word" for people from African decent...while here in Holland (the Dutch translation of said word) is the normal way to refer to someone who comes from or is decendant from an African country.

So while it is a big no-go in one country to use a single word, it's normal in another. This will just aswel reflect in game with chat channels, what is deemed "normal" to some people, others find very offensive.

Hence why CCP will judge reports in a case-by-case situation and wants to know in which context it was used.


Personally, when people annoy me in chats with what they say, I ignore them. If it is very offensive or they continue to annoy me with what they say...I just block them as there is no "missed content" if I do. But that is me and my "let everybody be themself" attitude.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
#37 - 2014-10-27 23:33:30 UTC
I see people missing the point.

It doesn't matter what you believe or think if one side gets to frame the debate ahead of time.

You can't be proven right if you are forced to be silent.

It's the tactic that has ruined the U.S.

Opinions are engineered based on this practice.

Freedom above all else. Lawful good is a myth.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#38 - 2014-10-27 23:45:13 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Ireland VonVicious wrote:
I see people missing the point.

It doesn't matter what you believe or think if one side gets to frame the debate ahead of time.

You can't be proven right if you are forced to be silent.

It's the tactic that has ruined the U.S.

Opinions are engineered based on this practice.

Freedom above all else. Lawful good is a myth.


I'm not saying that you should not speak up.

But if CCP is going to ban every player for saying some word that someone else is offended by...This game will quickly be without any players.

Throw 25.000 logged in characters together, and you are will ALWAYS find someone offending someone else...period.
Hell, as said before, look up the "Mate incident" that happened a couple of years back.

Some guy was offended because someone called him mate, as it was an insult in his country where as the for the other party it was just a word they use for friends / other people.


You can petition it...sure, but don't get your hopes up too much, unles it's something really really bad the person said.

Or

You can just block the guy. It's dealt with it as YOU no longer can be offended by him. If everybody that find him offensive does the same....job done, problem solved, nobody sees what that guy throws in chats, let the asshat throw his ridiculous stuff in chats that nobody sees.

A little bit of a thick skin is required in EVE, but this doesn't mean that you should take all the crap thrown at you.
As suggested before. If you find it offensive, just report the person and then block him.

A. It will solve the issue as you will no longer see what he says in chats.
B. If CCP backs you up, he will be punished. If not, no big deal, you already have blocked him, so you can't be bothered by him anymore.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Lady Areola Fappington
#39 - 2014-10-28 00:56:06 UTC
I just report the slur users, then block them. Best of both worlds. I can deal with cursing, but when you start whipping out slurs, well...


I will say though, the Eve community can be pretty awesome. I'm a outspoken LGBT type person, so people love flinging assorted slurs about sexuality towards me. I was impressed when an anti-ganker called out some dude whipping out LGBT slurs in local. The quote went something like: "Really dude, it's 2014. Calling someone a *** is saying they like the color green."

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Clavain Conjoined
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2014-10-28 03:18:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Clavain Conjoined
Also, keep in mind that it has a lot to do with how the word is used. Saying a word has multiple meanings around the world could be true and is all well and good in a sterile academic argument, but when it's used to say something like "I'm glad that F will burn in hell" well, it's clear that's hate and the multiple meanings are moot.

This has even more (terrible) impact when you know that the slur comes from the British use of the word (small stick), because small sticks are what they used to use to light the fire under a homosexual when (s)he was to be burned to death for their "crime".