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Are High Sec Incursions really that hard?

Author
Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-12-13 22:11:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Bansh Corva
Everywhere I look I'm seeing people say how you need a pimped out pirate battleship or a faction fit tengu and the likes for running high sec incursions.

Really?

I would like to get into them at some point, but that's just not going to happen.

Then I was told the easiest way to get into it is through logistics, jump in a basilisk. So I looked into that and apparently I have to have Logistics 5. It kind of makes sense, I can't run 4 reps cap stable with only Logi 4 unless I have 2 cap transfers on me. Then I can run both transfers and all 4 reps and 2 cap transfers and be 96% cap stable.

Would fleets just laugh me off if I told them this and still insist on Logi 5?

Last question... Anybody reading this who runs Incursion fleets in high sec and is ok with this, and is happy to take me into a fleet as a newb to it, please let me know?

Many thanks.
Goose99
#2 - 2011-12-13 22:15:21 UTC
Bansh Corva wrote:
Everywhere I look I'm seeing people say how you need a pimped out pirate battleship or a faction fit tengu and the likes for running high sec incursions.

Really?

I would like to get into them at some point, but that's just not going to happen.

Then I was told the easiest way to get into it is through logistics, jump in a basilisk. So I looked into that and apparently I have to have Logistics 5. It kind of makes sense, I can't run 4 reps cap stable with only Logi 4 unless I have 2 cap transfers on me. Then I can run both transfers and all 4 reps and 2 cap transfers and be 96% cap stable.

Would fleets just laugh me off if I told them this and still insist on Logi 5?

Last question... Anybody reading this who runs Incursion fleets in high sec and is ok with this, and is happy to take me into a fleet as a newb to it, please let me know?

Many thanks.


Because of contests. Fleets that get dragged down by noobs and cheapfits don't get paid, lol.
Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2011-12-13 22:20:30 UTC
Goose99 wrote:


Because of contests. Fleets that get dragged down by noobs and cheapfits don't get paid, lol.


Ahh I think I do remember reading something on how the fleet who does the best gets the money, or something along those lines.

So you're saying I may as well just forget it until I can afford and fully kit out a pirate battleship or until I get logi 5?
Goose99
#4 - 2011-12-13 22:22:55 UTC
Bansh Corva wrote:
Goose99 wrote:


Because of contests. Fleets that get dragged down by noobs and cheapfits don't get paid, lol.


Ahh I think I do remember reading something on how the fleet who does the best gets the money, or something along those lines.

So you're saying I may as well just forget it until I can afford and fully kit out a pirate battleship or until I get logi 5?


Logi 5 is like 25 days. T3 is around 500 mil, failing that, CS is 150 mil and can still get fleets.
Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#5 - 2011-12-13 22:29:48 UTC
Lol I'm closer to Logi 5 than Command Ships. Even so, the fact of the matter is still "You Must Be This Uber..." or it's just not happening.

That's what I was getting at.

It's ok, can't expect everybody to be able to do everything at once.
Elindreal
Planetary Interactors
#6 - 2011-12-13 22:47:45 UTC
logi IV is acceptable in a basi, not as much in a scimmy.

try some of the big public channels for fleets, yes, it will take time and you should always be wary. check your fc's employment history and such.

meet some people, make some friends (this is an mmo afterall) and finding a fleet becomes much easier without needing a pirate pimped battleship.

also keep tabs on which of the incursions are newest and oldest.
the newest are usually the least populated.
personally, when 1 highsec incursion is left up i don't even bother, the competition is too ridiculous.
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
The Bastion
#7 - 2011-12-13 22:49:39 UTC
Bansh Corva wrote:
I'm closer to Logi 5 than Command Ships.


A logi5, sensibly setup, basilisk is probably the most desirable ship in shield incursion fleets ... followed by a logi4 basilisk.

Wannabe DPS-deliverers, shiny or rusty, are usually dime-a-dozen in incursion areas and the weak-link is usually (not always) the availability of good logi support ... or good FCs.

Bansh Corva wrote:
Even so, the fact of the matter is still "You Must Be This Uber..." or it's just not happening.


That's not a fact at all.

Like most everything in eve the better your skills are the more you're likely to be able to benefit / profit from an activity. Incursions, mostly requiring coordinated group efforts, are no exception.

Yes, there are uber-fleets of seven machariels, 1 webber loki, experienced FCs, three logis, and with perfect offgrid boosters but there are also fleets of less expensive ships out there running the sites. Of course those uber fleets are way better equipped to 'steal' sites, even when the less well equipped fleets have a considerable head-start.

Also you are always able to setup your own fleets and gather a bunch of like-minded folk around you. There are no shortage of options for all skill levels, it's just for you to choose to do what you want to do and get out there to do it.

Perhaps it would be unreasonable, though, to expect an FC to choose a lvl4 logi over a lvl5, or a maelstrom over a machariel. The FCs want their fleet to be as strong and as efficient as they can manage and usually choosing weaker ships or pilots, when better are available, does not achieve that.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.

Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#8 - 2011-12-13 22:57:27 UTC
Thank you both for the constructive info. Nobody has mentioned how difficult the sites really are though.

I'm going to keep my eye open for fleets. If the biggest risk involved is somebody else stealing the site then I'm not too worried about the fleet. I'm as happy to fail and learn as I am to succeed and earn. Unless it means losing a brand new Basi :P
Goose99
#9 - 2011-12-13 23:07:02 UTC
Bansh Corva wrote:
Thank you both for the constructive info. Nobody has mentioned how difficult the sites really are though.

I'm going to keep my eye open for fleets. If the biggest risk involved is somebody else stealing the site then I'm not too worried about the fleet. I'm as happy to fail and learn as I am to succeed and earn. Unless it means losing a brand new Basi :P


Oh yeah, on that note, mind the logi gankers. Somebody invites you to fleet. He flip a can, you cap chain them, get his canflip aggro, his friends warp in to gank your logi. Tears, lulz.Cool
Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#10 - 2011-12-13 23:09:35 UTC
Goose99 wrote:


Oh yeah, on that note, mind the logi gankers. Somebody invites you to fleet. He flip a can, you cap chain them, get his canflip aggro, his friends warp in to gank your logi. Tears, lulz.Cool


Hahaha sounds like fun, except being on the receiving end obviously.
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2011-12-13 23:13:36 UTC
You need those ships for a few reasons:

1. People equate lots of money with skill. They figure if you can afford stupidly expensive ships and modules, you must have been playing for a while, and know what you're doing. (hint: they're wrong)

2. Blitzing. People want to blitz sites, so they can move in to more sites, and make money faster.

3. Related to blitzing, if the incursion is heavily populated, you will have to contest sites. Who is going to win, a fleet with 8 machariels, or a fleet with 8 brutix?
Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-12-13 23:20:09 UTC
Dorian Wylde wrote:
You need those ships for a few reasons:

1. People equate lots of money with skill. They figure if you can afford stupidly expensive ships and modules, you must have been playing for a while, and know what you're doing. (hint: they're wrong)

2. Blitzing. People want to blitz sites, so they can move in to more sites, and make money faster.

3. Related to blitzing, if the incursion is heavily populated, you will have to contest sites. Who is going to win, a fleet with 8 machariels, or a fleet with 8 brutix?


All making complete sense. Except point 1 of course.
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
The Bastion
#13 - 2011-12-13 23:38:50 UTC
Dorian Wylde wrote:
1. People equate lots of money with skill. They figure if you can afford stupidly expensive ships and modules, you must have been playing for a while, and know what you're doing. (hint: they're wrong)


Dorian is correct in that:
1. A well skilled lower-class ship (e.g. maelstrom) may well be able to deliver more than a poorly skilled higher-class ship (e.g. machariel / vargur) and that fact may be hidden from recruiting FCs. Mind you, once someone is well skilled in a T1 ship they are usually also reasonably well skilled for related pirate ships. Altho, as Dorian suggests, the assumption is not perfect it is **generally** safe to correlate skill-intensive ships to intensively skilled pilot. Now I absolutely agree with the premise that shiney-ship does not correlate, at all, with knowing what you're doing. I fly a range of well equipped very shiney ships, but only recently did my first incursion as a DPS person. Despite having been in hundreds of incursions (as logi) I was a bit lost on where / when to focus my fire. Thankfully the FC had used me previously as logi so was happy to coddle my ineptitude for a while ... and my subsequent ability to easily swap from basi to mach just added to the flexibility within his fleet.
2. The ship that a player advertises is not necessarily the ship they are flying, or even that they can fly. If I wanted I could advertise myself as flying a T2 weapon / faction fitted nightmare and link that fit ingame ... even tho I can't even use a medium T1 laser. Generally, however, people are honest(ish) and those that are not are usually found out and word of their dishonesty spreads fast.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.

Goose99
#14 - 2011-12-13 23:43:30 UTC
Bansh Corva wrote:
Dorian Wylde wrote:
You need those ships for a few reasons:

1. People equate lots of money with skill. They figure if you can afford stupidly expensive ships and modules, you must have been playing for a while, and know what you're doing. (hint: they're wrong)

2. Blitzing. People want to blitz sites, so they can move in to more sites, and make money faster.

3. Related to blitzing, if the incursion is heavily populated, you will have to contest sites. Who is going to win, a fleet with 8 machariels, or a fleet with 8 brutix?


All making complete sense. Except point 1 of course.


Point 3 is the only one that matters. 1 and 2 only stops stuck up elitists from taking you. 3 stops everyone. Those days, if your fleet isn't pimp, you don't get paid.Big smile
Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#15 - 2011-12-13 23:57:45 UTC
Substantia Nigra wrote:

2. The ship that a player advertises is not necessarily the ship they are flying, or even that they can fly. If I wanted I could advertise myself as flying a T2 weapon / faction fitted nightmare and link that fit ingame ... even tho I can't even use a medium T1 laser. Generally, however, people are honest(ish) and those that are not are usually found out and word of their dishonesty spreads fast.


So you're saying I might be able to get away with fitting my Mael with Meta4's and not waiting the last 9 days for large 5 to finish? :P
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
The Bastion
#16 - 2011-12-14 00:29:38 UTC
Bansh Corva wrote:
Substantia Nigra wrote:

2. The ship that a player advertises is not necessarily the ship they are flying...

So you're saying I might be able to get away with fitting my Mael with Meta4's and not waiting the last 9 days for large 5 to finish? :P


Nope, not saying that at all.

I do see maelstroms pretty regularly in incursion fleets but it's the rare day that a scout equipped maelstrom will be accepted over a T2 A/C equipped machariel / vargur. It's not rocket science, in general the better ships and better pilots will be preferred ... but we all have to start somewhere.

If you want 'in' on incursions and have the choice between offering a logi4 basilisk and a scout equipped maelstrom ... go with the basi. Logis are generally more in-demand, within both shiny and rusty fleets. If you absolutely **must** go DPS then offer the best you can, work the quieter of multiple hisec incursions, and be prepared to spend periods of time fleetless.


I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.

Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#17 - 2011-12-14 00:36:39 UTC
lol Thanks. Lots of good advice.

But...

Are High Sec Incusions difficult?
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
The Bastion
#18 - 2011-12-14 00:37:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Substantia Nigra
Not for an appropriately equipped fleet.

Level 1 missions are difficult for the absolute noob player flying a noobship. Any incursion site is going to be difficult for a poorly prepared fleet.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.

Elindreal
Planetary Interactors
#19 - 2011-12-14 00:48:20 UTC
Bansh Corva wrote:


Are High Sec Incusions difficult?


fit a proper buffer tank with good resists and have logis whom are on the ball and do not disconnect at inopportune moments and no they are not difficult.

fit a local rep tank and be in a drake fleet with pitiful dps with split tank (both shield and armour ships) then yes, you will die as will your fleet.
Bansh Corva
Perkone
Caldari State
#20 - 2011-12-14 00:56:23 UTC
Elindreal wrote:
Bansh Corva wrote:


Are High Sec Incusions difficult?


fit a proper buffer tank with good resists and have logis whom are on the ball and do not disconnect at inopportune moments and no they are not difficult.

fit a local rep tank and be in a drake fleet with pitiful dps with split tank (both shield and armour ships) then yes, you will die as will your fleet.


Now that is proper answer and made me grin, thank you :P
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