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Gevlon's Second Doozie

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Solecist Project
#21 - 2014-10-13 20:20:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Solecist Project
PotatoOverdose wrote:
None of those entities take all of their friends across the map to leverage their disproportionate force for "fun".

Although one of those entities has been on the receiving end of the "fun" suppository for quite some time now, in a "game preserve". Cool
Oh nono ...

It's not about the entities, sorry ... it's about the people.

I've noticed this a while ago but now it makes sense on a different scale. People in RvB,
who cry for lack of FCs ... as much as everywhere else. Fleetbears, or F1bears.
They're in it for easymode fun, not for challenges.

That's what I meant. This group fo people grew and grew over the last years
and it's this group of people who whines about afk cloakers and about
lack of "content" and about lack of "income".


Basically ... carebears.
These people are actually bad for the game.


I'm just ... connecting dots. I keep reading his blog and ... wow ...
... I kind of feel ashamed now that I never considered reading more about his stuff.

People even told me I should talk to him, because he's nuts but dedicated.


He delivers data.
And it makes SENSE too!


Gonna keep reading...

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2014-10-13 20:26:44 UTC
This is an example of Gelvon's good posting? What?

He starts off with an unsubstantiated assertion that all alliance leaders engage in RMT, and then proceeds to claim that eve cannot be played for fun. If eve is not meant to be fun, then what is it for? Some players enjoy large fleet battles, and to those players the upcoming changes might not be in their interests. On the other hand, as gelvon points out, smaller entities will have more of a chance. Why is it that these entities are not supposed to have fun?

I strongly disagree with any claim that having fun in eve cannot be in conjunction with actions that have lasting consequences. No one would be playing this game if they did not enjoy it, and I promise that very few players have a financial incentive to play eve.

To quote one of the comments that said it better than I did:
Quote:
This very logical and fundamentally wrong.

You can't have a game as large as Eve without an inherently fun aspect in it. Even games that are highly competitive by design have fun aspects to them. Usually in the form of competition having this fisceral "feel-it-with-your-body" kind of feel, which makes matches in a game like, say, Street Fighter both fun to watch and fun to participate in.

I would agree with an argument against null force projection that would go like this: "this creates a game environment which is only fun for those currently at the top". I would further reinforce this argument by saying: "and this also stops being fun for the top tog pretty soon, too. Unless he earns RL cash from it"

However, you seem to go unnecessarily far and take a decidedly anti-fun stance. I find that way too extreme, and also unsustainable when it comes to design of actual game products.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#23 - 2014-10-13 20:28:13 UTC
Grr goons, now with more numbers.
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#24 - 2014-10-13 20:29:40 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Grr goons, now with more numbers.

What specifically to you disagree with in his most recent post, if you don't mind my asking?
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#25 - 2014-10-13 20:34:34 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
*stuff*

Reading comprehension, bro.

"Fun" = dropping a disproportionately powerful force against a smaller one anywhere in eve.

Specifically mentioned here:
Quote:
They also see that these coalitions together gank smaller and upcoming alliances, so they did the best they could: nerfed long-range travel that allows the empires to hit with full force anywhere. Now small but competent groups can fight locally, facing only locally living Sov-holders. They can chase the "for fun" players back where they belong: to highsec to make ISK and to lowsec to roam for their "fun".
Solecist Project
#26 - 2014-10-13 20:36:29 UTC
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
words
lol CODE.

CODE = Goons ... sorry, dismissed.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#27 - 2014-10-13 20:45:02 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Grr goons, now with more numbers.

What specifically to you disagree with in his most recent post, if you don't mind my asking?


He is an avid grr goon poster who will post anything to simply speg about us. Seriously, do you honestly think the average line member is happy with the current state of sov and wants to keep it intact? When at any point have we asked for CCP to make this game safer or to bring in instancing?
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#28 - 2014-10-13 20:52:03 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
baltec1 wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Grr goons, now with more numbers.

What specifically to you disagree with in his most recent post, if you don't mind my asking?


He is an avid grr goon poster who will post anything to simply speg about us. Seriously, do you honestly think the average line member is happy with the current state of sov and wants to keep it intact?

I think the average line member wants to shake things up just enough to create a number of small targets around him to farm without actually disrupting *his* coalition, and without disrupting *his* isk-making operations.

I think the average line member doesn't want N3 and the CFC dissolved. I think they want to have their cake and eat it too. The other guy should disband, but their coalitions is perfectly fine.

If line members, as a whole, didn't want coalitions then they wouldn't exist, simple as that. No, the line member just doesn't want the other guy's coalition to exist.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#29 - 2014-10-13 21:00:13 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Grr goons, now with more numbers.

What specifically to you disagree with in his most recent post, if you don't mind my asking?


He is an avid grr goon poster who will post anything to simply speg about us. Seriously, do you honestly think the average line member is happy with the current state of sov and wants to keep it intact?

I think the average line member wants to shake things up just enough to create a number of small targets around him to farm without actually disrupting *his* coalition, and without disrupting *his* isk-making operations.

I think the average line member doesn't want N3 and the CFC dissolved. I think they want to have their cake and eat it too. The other guy should disband, but their coalitions is perfectly fine.

If line members, as a whole, didn't want coalitions then they wouldn't exist, simple as that. No, the line member just doesn't want the other guy's coalition to exist.


So because we have a close knit community that means the people in charge run big rmt operations and that we all want EVE to be yet another theampark?
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#30 - 2014-10-13 21:13:16 UTC  |  Edited by: PotatoOverdose
baltec1 wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Grr goons, now with more numbers.

What specifically to you disagree with in his most recent post, if you don't mind my asking?


He is an avid grr goon poster who will post anything to simply speg about us. Seriously, do you honestly think the average line member is happy with the current state of sov and wants to keep it intact?

I think the average line member wants to shake things up just enough to create a number of small targets around him to farm without actually disrupting *his* coalition, and without disrupting *his* isk-making operations.

I think the average line member doesn't want N3 and the CFC dissolved. I think they want to have their cake and eat it too. The other guy should disband, but their coalitions is perfectly fine.

If line members, as a whole, didn't want coalitions then they wouldn't exist, simple as that. No, the line member just doesn't want the other guy's coalition to exist.


So because we have a close knit community that means the people in charge run big rmt operations and that we all want EVE to be yet another theampark?


Dude, dafuq does anything you just quoted mention RMT?

All I'm saying is if your close knit community of GSF, Razor, FA, SMA, Lawn, and w/e else doesn't get less close-knit in the future, eve is f*cked. Same goes for N3.

The problem with both of the blocs is that you think the way to fix eve is for the *other* guy's coalition to stop existing. Mention putting their own "close knit" community of 30,000 on the chopping bloc and you may as well open the floodgates.
Falin Whalen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2014-10-13 21:15:50 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Grr goons, now with more numbers.

What specifically to you disagree with in his most recent post, if you don't mind my asking?


He is an avid grr goon poster who will post anything to simply speg about us. Seriously, do you honestly think the average line member is happy with the current state of sov and wants to keep it intact?

I think the average line member wants to shake things up just enough to create a number of small targets around him to farm without actually disrupting *his* coalition, and without disrupting *his* isk-making operations.

I think the average line member doesn't want N3 and the CFC dissolved. I think they want to have their cake and eat it too. The other guy should disband, but their coalitions is perfectly fine.

If line members, as a whole, didn't want coalitions then they wouldn't exist, simple as that. No, the line member just doesn't want the other guy's coalition to exist.


So because we have a close knit community that means the people in charge run big rmt operations and that we all want EVE to be yet another theampark?


Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown Grr Goons EVE-O GD Forum posting.

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#32 - 2014-10-13 21:18:32 UTC
Falin Whalen wrote:

Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown Grr Goons EVE-O GD Forum posting.

Dude, I don't care if you're from goons or pl or nulli or even -A-. Do you honestly think the continued existence of both N3 and the CFC is compatible with the long term health of eve?
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#33 - 2014-10-13 21:19:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Doc Fury
PotatoOverdose wrote:

Dude, dafuq does anything you just quoted mention RMT?

All I'm saying is if your close knit community of GSF, Razor, FA, SMA, Lawn, and w/e else doesn't get less close-knit in the future, eve is f*cked. Same goes for N3.

The problem with both of the blocs is that you think the way to fix eve is for the *other* guys coalition to stop existing. Mention putting their own "close knit" community of 30,000 on the chopping bloc and you may as well open the floodgates.


The RMT thing is hitting a nerve because that's basically all TMC and their PLEX affiliate link sales are when you boil it down. And since that's directly asserted in the article, it's going to be a touchy talking point, because they don't RMT, except when they do.

We can also likely look forward to more concern trolling from the usual suspects. Roll

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Solecist Project
#34 - 2014-10-13 21:20:35 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
So because we have a close knit community that means the people in charge run big rmt operations and that we all want EVE to be yet another theampark?
What do his points have to do with this?

His points were valid. He considered the perspective of the typical player,
of which many seem to be carebears ... which is easily assumable simply
from the huge amount of people.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#35 - 2014-10-13 21:28:38 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
Falin Whalen wrote:

Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown Grr Goons EVE-O GD Forum posting.

Dude, I don't care if you're from goons or pl or nulli or even -A-. Do you honestly think the continued existence of both N3 and the CFC is compatible with the long term health of eve?


Yes because its the mechanics that are causing all of he issues.
Falin Whalen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2014-10-13 21:28:45 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:
The problem with both of the blocs is that you think the way to fix eve is for the *other* guy's coalition to stop existing. Mention putting their own "close knit" community of 30,000 on the chopping bloc and you may as well open the floodgates.

Funny, your block [Grr Goons] seem to think just by breaking up the big power blocks your lives and EVE will be all sunshine and rainbows, and we will all be holding hands singing kumbaya.

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#37 - 2014-10-13 21:34:32 UTC
If EVE is going to survive then the enormous coalitions need to fracture and the map-wide hot-dropping rubbish needs to die.

Thankfully, CCP seems to understand this.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
PotatoOverdose
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#38 - 2014-10-13 21:34:55 UTC
Falin Whalen wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
The problem with both of the blocs is that you think the way to fix eve is for the *other* guy's coalition to stop existing. Mention putting their own "close knit" community of 30,000 on the chopping bloc and you may as well open the floodgates.

Funny, your block [Grr Goons] seem to think just by breaking up the big power blocks your lives and EVE will be all sunshine and rainbows, and we will all be holding hands singing kumbaya.

No, ideally we'll all be balkanaized and everyone will be at their neighbor's throat. Aka ~content~. Quite the opposite of kumbaya.

baltec1 wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:

Dude, I don't care if you're from goons or pl or nulli or even -A-. Do you honestly think the continued existence of both N3 and the CFC is compatible with the long term health of eve?


Yes because its the mechanics that are causing all of he issues.

Riddle me this: If 95% of null is in a coalition in the old system and 95% of null is in a coalition in the new system, who, exactly are you going to shoot? If you aren't going to shoot your neighbor and you aren't going to shoot the renters, who *exactly* are you going to shoot?
Solecist Project
#39 - 2014-10-13 21:35:04 UTC
Falin Whalen wrote:
PotatoOverdose wrote:
The problem with both of the blocs is that you think the way to fix eve is for the *other* guy's coalition to stop existing. Mention putting their own "close knit" community of 30,000 on the chopping bloc and you may as well open the floodgates.

Funny, your block [Grr Goons] seem to think just by breaking up the big power blocks your lives and EVE will be all sunshine and rainbows, and we will all be holding hands singing kumbaya.

1.
There is no "GRR GOONS" block, so this is a bogus statement.
These people do not work together like your people do,
so calling them a "block" is nonsense.

2.
The handholding is already happening and part of the issue.
The contrary is what's desired.


Glad I was of help.

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Regnag Leppod
Doomheim
#40 - 2014-10-13 21:46:12 UTC
PotatoOverdose wrote:

Riddle me this: If 95% of null is in a coalition in the old system and 95% of null is in a coalition in the new system, who, exactly are you going to shoot? If you aren't going to shoot your neighbor and you aren't going to shoot the renters, who *exactly* are you going to shoot?


High-sec, of course