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Need loan.

Author
frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2014-10-11 21:30:21 UTC
Hello guys,

First: I am posting this from a alt for obious reasons.

Lets let the story begin: I have been for 3 years in a nulsec alliance now and am actively involved in the corp management.

And I have seen the hassle of suply and demand on the nul-sec market. Stuff you had to ship in from high or people would sell an item for 500% times it price.

For the last month I have been seeding stuff from ships to MTU and Adaptive nano platings.
I have build a spreadsheet with over 90 items that I update twice a week to get a good few on the local market.

My idea is getting a loan of about 10bil and suply 3 semi bussy stations here, the jumpfreight service is reasonably cheap and very quick (they have collateral shipped).

With this money I can seed items in the market and make a margin of 20-25% after freight and taxes.
I think I can put this 10bil on the market in 2-3 weeks and being sold due my know how what these stations need and what they want.

What you get in return?
A 10% return in 2 weeks.
My spreadsheet where I update the local market margin and the profit and you see the profit from here on how many I sold and how I used your money.
Inside information on the business (api and some more specific details).



I know this won't have any collateral since I do not have the money for that on this moment. So feel free to mail me and have a chat about it and ask me a few questions.

A nulsec corp ceo and no 5bil liquid?

Indeed, I haven't been caring much as I should've about my wallet. I like to pvp and do alot of stuff for the corp so you won't see me actively ratting or mining or other carebearing moneymaking things.
But let one thing be sure: your money will be used for this project and this project only.


How far am I with this project?
Corp members has put almost 5bil together, enough to get this project kickstarted.

Charlie Nonoke
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
#2 - 2014-10-11 22:05:18 UTC
This should be good.
Give me a second, while I grab some kernels and heat up the pan.
flakeys
Doomheim
#3 - 2014-10-12 06:33:29 UTC
frame job wrote:
Hello guys,

First: I am posting this from a alt for obious reasons.





Then without collateral i am gonna ignore this post for Obvious reasons.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2014-10-12 06:42:49 UTC
flakeys wrote:
frame job wrote:
Hello guys,

First: I am posting this from a alt for obious reasons.





Then without collateral i am gonna ignore this post for Obvious reasons.


If you would've taken 5 min to read the whole post you would see that you see where what how and by who I am seeding. But why would I have to get this posted by my main right away? Less people knowing about who and what is less chance getting ****** over by a third party.
Ria Nieyli
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#5 - 2014-10-12 07:01:25 UTC
20-25% margin after taxes and shipping is quite a big number.
And if your corpmates have put up 5b already, why can't they put up the next 5b as well?
frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2014-10-12 07:21:14 UTC
Ria Nieyli wrote:
20-25% margin after taxes and shipping is quite a big number.
And if your corpmates have put up 5b already, why can't they put up the next 5b as well?

Corp didn't do anything the 5bil was only from corp members themselves.
If I would invest corp money how would I explaine that to the other CEO guys? Yea I used the money for my own good?
And we are using that money for stuff as SRP and a capital program.

A little example for you:
One of the most basic items I started my sheet with: the MTU
Buying in Jita for 4.5mil
When I set the first 10 on the market for 6mil they sold almost instant.
Next batch for 100 sold for 7.5mil in about a day.

Shipping isn't very much since I can rent a whole freighter at reduced price.
frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2014-10-12 10:06:14 UTC
Have had a few mails from intrested people but no real investors yet. So still looking for the 5bil. I do not have a minimum. Nor a maximum.
flakeys
Doomheim
#8 - 2014-10-12 10:26:51 UTC
frame job wrote:
flakeys wrote:
frame job wrote:
Hello guys,

First: I am posting this from a alt for obious reasons.





Then without collateral i am gonna ignore this post for Obvious reasons.


If you would've taken 5 min to read the whole post you would see that you see where what how and by who I am seeding. But why would I have to get this posted by my main right away? Less people knowing about who and what is less chance getting ****** over by a third party.


I don't see who is offering this besides his alt , i don't see for wich Alliance/corp and i don't see wich region as to know how deep nullsec and what risk.So no i don't see ''the obvious'' you mention.

So , send me a mail with the names of the characters involved and also send a mail from your main character so i can see who is the one behind this offer and what region you are seeding.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2014-10-12 10:41:24 UTC
I am not looking for a discussion but why am I just now posting the spreadsheet names and all that kind for stuff here?
If I do that I can post the JF route time and pilot to in that case.

What I want to say it: Investors get acces since if I would invest I want to know to where and how my money would be used.

Its major nulsec alliance with a corp that consists of 150-ish people. We are pvping mostly but we also do indie. We build capitals and titans corp funded where we sell to the alliance and to corp members for reduced prices so we can contribute.
Cista2
EVE Museum
#10 - 2014-10-12 11:18:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Cista2
This has got to be the poorest titan-level industrialist in EVE.

My channel: "Signatures" -

frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2014-10-12 11:25:58 UTC
Or the smartest.

The corp builds titans.
I want to suply these markets.

Corp stays out of this because it wouldn't be fair to use corp bugdet for private reasons.
flakeys
Doomheim
#12 - 2014-10-12 11:34:28 UTC
frame job wrote:
I am not looking for a discussion.



Neither was i , i was asking you to privately send me some VERRY basic info .

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

Tinu Moorhsum
Random Events
#13 - 2014-10-12 11:42:40 UTC
frame job wrote:
Hello guys,

First: I am posting this from a alt for obious reasons.
...



I appreciate your problem. A friend and I ran a nullsec corp for about 5 years and there were many times that I wished that EVE had a functioning banking system.

We also had the same problem that you do with finding collateral. Corp assets needed to be employed in order to keep our heads above water. Alliance taxes can sometimes be very heavy, partuclarly for a small corp.

We eventually solved this in an organisational way.

1) grow corp to at least 100 members.

2) set taxes to 10% or 15% and actively ENCOURAGE them to get out and grind isk some of the time when mandadory ops are not running. People who live in nullsec often get confused by mixed messages. On the one hand you're expected to be well represented on the kill board and available for ops at the drop of a hat. On the other hand, your corp moved to nullsec to take advantage of the easy isk.... This needs to be balanced. Excessive attention to killboard stats will make your entire corp poor and unable to operate efficiently. Excessive attention to ratting etc. will make your corp rich but you will be seen as freeloading and lazy. Try to strike a balance on this point. If your corp doesn't have 10bil in liquid assets then you may be focusing too much on killboard stats. One of the ways we found to address this that made it fun as well as functional was to hold corp mining/ratting ops with the proceeds going to corp. The mining ops were very popular and people liked this for the team building and it gave most of the guys a strong feeling of satisfaction to contribute to corp in this way. You'd be amazed how much isk it brings in if you have 45 guys mining for 2 hours. We did them once every few weeks for a couple of hours.

3) We created an alts corp for some players who wanted to live in a wormhole and use those characters exclusively to grind isk. Taxes on that corp were also 15% and that money paid for POS fuel and anything left over flowed back into the main corp.

4) We assigned "projects" to people. Hauling, POS tending and providing manufacturing/invention slots were obvious ones. In your case, if you have 90 items to seed in the market and say 60 players available to do it then assign everyone 1 or 2 items to seed. In this concept corp does some of the hauling (use courier contracts) for cost price and buys all of the items for 10% above Jita sell. Then you can put it on the market and and a few things happen. (1) You spread the wealth around in your corp (2) corp taxes this activity by working it into the buying costs = more isk in wallet (3) your market is seeded without corp leaders needing to do all the work (4) your corp gains a reputation for providing an essential service.

We did something very much along those lines, using buy orders as a means of communication. We put up buy orders for items we wanted to have moved and we could control the amount of isk we had sunk into it by tweaking the number and volume of open buy orders. Train margin trading. Corp mates found it an easy way to make money and it spread the work load around. You'll find if you do this that other corp's players will cue in and start filling your buy orders as well. If you're offering a good price then you can organise and somewhat control the market so that it's not being used to gouge.

Anyway, I found this easy because it took organisation (something that I'm good at) as opposed to work (which I'm not as good at LOL). I saw my job as organizing it and getting people enthousiastic so they filled orders.

All of this is to say that if you think out of the box then you might not need a 10bil isk loan that (frankly) nobody is going to give you without collateral. You'll probably be able to make a start with some of these ideas just based on the 5bil that corp mates put into the scheme already.

Good luck.

T-
Ria Nieyli
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2014-10-12 11:44:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Ria Nieyli
frame job wrote:
Or the smartest.

The corp builds titans.
I want to suply these markets.

Corp stays out of this because it wouldn't be fair to use corp bugdet for private reasons.


On a semi-related note, what's your Titan bro price? You mentioned that you sell them at reduced prices and it made me wonder...
frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2014-10-12 14:14:09 UTC
Tinu Moorhsum wrote:
frame job wrote:
Hello guys,

First: I am posting this from a alt for obious reasons.
...



I appreciate your problem. A friend and I ran a nullsec corp for about 5 years and there were many times that I wished that EVE had a functioning banking system.

We also had the same problem that you do with finding collateral. Corp assets needed to be employed in order to keep our heads above water. Alliance taxes can sometimes be very heavy, partuclarly for a small corp.

We eventually solved this in an organisational way.

1) grow corp to at least 100 members.

2) set taxes to 10% or 15% and actively ENCOURAGE them to get out and grind isk some of the time when mandadory ops are not running. People who live in nullsec often get confused by mixed messages. On the one hand you're expected to be well represented on the kill board and available for ops at the drop of a hat. On the other hand, your corp moved to nullsec to take advantage of the easy isk.... This needs to be balanced. Excessive attention to killboard stats will make your entire corp poor and unable to operate efficiently. Excessive attention to ratting etc. will make your corp rich but you will be seen as freeloading and lazy. Try to strike a balance on this point. If your corp doesn't have 10bil in liquid assets then you may be focusing too much on killboard stats. One of the ways we found to address this that made it fun as well as functional was to hold corp mining/ratting ops with the proceeds going to corp. The mining ops were very popular and people liked this for the team building and it gave most of the guys a strong feeling of satisfaction to contribute to corp in this way. You'd be amazed how much isk it brings in if you have 45 guys mining for 2 hours. We did them once every few weeks for a couple of hours.

3) We created an alts corp for some players who wanted to live in a wormhole and use those characters exclusively to grind isk. Taxes on that corp were also 15% and that money paid for POS fuel and anything left over flowed back into the main corp.

4) We assigned "projects" to people. Hauling, POS tending and providing manufacturing/invention slots were obvious ones. In your case, if you have 90 items to seed in the market and say 60 players available to do it then assign everyone 1 or 2 items to seed. In this concept corp does some of the hauling (use courier contracts) for cost price and buys all of the items for 10% above Jita sell. Then you can put it on the market and and a few things happen. (1) You spread the wealth around in your corp (2) corp taxes this activity by working it into the buying costs = more isk in wallet (3) your market is seeded without corp leaders needing to do all the work (4) your corp gains a reputation for providing an essential service.

We did something very much along those lines, using buy orders as a means of communication. We put up buy orders for items we wanted to have moved and we could control the amount of isk we had sunk into it by tweaking the number and volume of open buy orders. Train margin trading. Corp mates found it an easy way to make money and it spread the work load around. You'll find if you do this that other corp's players will cue in and start filling your buy orders as well. If you're offering a good price then you can organise and somewhat control the market so that it's not being used to gouge.

Anyway, I found this easy because it took organisation (something that I'm good at) as opposed to work (which I'm not as good at LOL). I saw my job as organizing it and getting people enthousiastic so they filled orders.

All of this is to say that if you think out of the box then you might not need a 10bil isk loan that (frankly) nobody is going to give you without collateral. You'll probably be able to make a start with some of these ideas just based on the 5bil that corp mates put into the scheme already.

Good luck.

T-


Growing another 200 people we are not feeling like because then its to massive while we like to know eachother.

But this is not a problem because the corp is totaly out of this!

Most of them do not feel like contributing in this project and nor feeling to invest in it. I can understand this so I seek other ways to gather funds.
Dwissi
Miners Delight Reborn
#16 - 2014-10-12 15:37:44 UTC
You will hate me for this reply - but here it goes anyway:

You say your corporation isnt interested in supporting this idea - if that would happen to me i would have serious afterthoughts about my decision of joining them in the first place or their willingsness to stay in that area.

If there isnt even interest from your mates to support a local market why would anyone else finance that? You miss the political part here - people are basically not interested in seeding money into a competing corporation/alliance in the first place - and you are keeping your real identy hidden which doesnt make things easier because even if one would be ok with the political entanglement you are appearing with an unrelated alt.

Markets in null are a strategical thing and not a regular business endevour as in high sec where people cant be evicted from stations they trade in.

Proud designer of glasses for geeky dovakins

Before someone complains again: grr everyone

Greed is the death of loyalty

frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2014-10-12 16:02:44 UTC
Dwissi wrote:
You will hate me for this reply - but here it goes anyway:

You say your corporation isnt interested in supporting this idea - if that would happen to me i would have serious afterthoughts about my decision of joining them in the first place or their willingsness to stay in that area.

If there isnt even interest from your mates to support a local market why would anyone else finance that? You miss the political part here - people are basically not interested in seeding money into a competing corporation/alliance in the first place - and you are keeping your real identy hidden which doesnt make things easier because even if one would be ok with the political entanglement you are appearing with an unrelated alt.

Markets in null are a strategical thing and not a regular business endevour as in high sec where people cant be evicted from stations they trade in.

I totaly understand it and I do not hate your reply. You are giving me a change to exlplaine myself.

First, most of the corp are people that doesn't care about this because they are pvp'ers or miners. The people that did see good money and they have invested total of the 5bil so far.

Second. My real indentity isn't and won't be hidden from people that want to invest. Just as they get acces to the api and spreadsheet to see their profits. And so they will know where I am operating and who I am. You are free to contact me any moment with questions and maby even tips? If you are missing an item you would like to see or you think has a good profit.

Ofcourse politics.. Honestly what would most people care about such little investment compared.


But a little update here.
I have build 50 Templars yesterday and an hour ago the last one got sold. It was build for 20.4mil and sold for a wopping 30mil. Aready am building more.
flakeys
Doomheim
#18 - 2014-10-12 16:14:55 UTC
frame job wrote:
Dwissi wrote:
You will hate me for this reply - but here it goes anyway:

You say your corporation isnt interested in supporting this idea - if that would happen to me i would have serious afterthoughts about my decision of joining them in the first place or their willingsness to stay in that area.

If there isnt even interest from your mates to support a local market why would anyone else finance that? You miss the political part here - people are basically not interested in seeding money into a competing corporation/alliance in the first place - and you are keeping your real identy hidden which doesnt make things easier because even if one would be ok with the political entanglement you are appearing with an unrelated alt.

Markets in null are a strategical thing and not a regular business endevour as in high sec where people cant be evicted from stations they trade in.

I totaly understand it and I do not hate your reply. You are giving me a change to exlplaine myself.

First, most of the corp are people that doesn't care about this because they are pvp'ers or miners. The people that did see good money and they have invested total of the 5bil so far.

Second. My real indentity isn't and won't be hidden from people that want to invest. Just as they get acces to the api and spreadsheet to see their profits. And so they will know where I am operating and who I am. You are free to contact me any moment with questions and maby even tips? If you are missing an item you would like to see or you think has a good profit.

Ofcourse politics.. Honestly what would most people care about such little investment compared.


But a little update here.
I have build 50 Templars yesterday and an hour ago the last one got sold. It was build for 20.4mil and sold for a wopping 30mil. Aready am building more.



And yet you ignored two of my requests for just that.Now you are either a scammer or clueless at this point in my opinion.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.

frame job
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2014-10-12 16:23:35 UTC
No you are just someone who I dislike thats all.
Dwissi
Miners Delight Reborn
#20 - 2014-10-12 16:35:32 UTC
As i am not a fan of forums fights and trolling let me put my 2 pieces of advice in here:

1. Clean up your spelling - you ask for serious money and your postings should reflect your seriousity
2. Offer potential investors a recognized 3rd party to broker the api info if you are so afraid of revealing your main character

Proud designer of glasses for geeky dovakins

Before someone complains again: grr everyone

Greed is the death of loyalty

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