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Gila or Stratios - what ship should I choose?
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Altair Taurus
#1 - 2014-09-25 13:09:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
Hi!

I'd like to run hi-sec and low-sec Anomalies and DED complexes in cruiser-class ship because of optimal access to these sites. After Kronos release I read the best vessels in this class are Gila and Stratios (excluding T2 and T3 cruisers because I cannot fly them). So which one I should choose taking into account DPS, tank, escalations into more dangerous sites and possible pure exploration activity?
Leoric Firesword
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2014-09-25 14:22:28 UTC
You'll scan sites faster in a Stratios.

that's the easy part to answer.

The hard part is: Where are you running these sites?

If in Amarr space I'd say the Stratios because it gets the optimal bonus to medium lasers, letting you snipe from great distances or brawl.

If in any other space I'd say the Gila, selectable damage type between thermal and kinetic and OMG medium drones.

I have both and love the Strat in Amarr space, do sites in all other space in the Gila.
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#3 - 2014-09-25 14:28:56 UTC
They will both perform quite well. In low sec the covert cloak on the stratios will come in very handy for safer traveling and hiding should you need to warp to a safe and wait out stuff. You could fit a prototype on the gila, but you won't be able to warp cloaked.

That said, they have very different play styles. The gila will be using some form of missiles, HAMs and rapid lights being common, with a pair of medium drones. The stratios on the other hand will be using heavies and sentries with optional laser turrets. They can both be quite tanky, but in theory the gila can use its entire mid slots for tank (and prop mod) leaving the lows free for damage mods where the stratios would have to split the lows for damage mods and tank.
Altair Taurus
#4 - 2014-09-25 14:32:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
That is a good point! I will fly mainly in non-Amarr space. Yet I have two questions:

1. Can both ships do 5/10 and 6/10 DEDs in low-sec?
2. CovOps Cloaking Device - is this real Stratios advantage over Gila in low-sec travels?

Yes, I read about Gila's crazy 500% damage bonus to medium drones. Now "Augmented" Hammerheads wreak havoc on the battlefield! In contrary Stratios use Sentry drones to apply damage. BTW, Is it true faction drones were buffed recently and now are on par with T2 drones?
Leoric Firesword
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2014-09-25 15:16:34 UTC
Altair Taurus wrote:
That is a good point! I will fly mainly in non-Amarr space. Yet I have two questions:

1. Can both ships do 5/10 and 6/10 DEDs in low-sec?
2. CovOps Cloaking Device - is this real Stratios advantage over Gila in low-sec travels?

Yes, I read about Gila's crazy 500% damage bonus to medium drones. Now "Augmented" Hammerheads wreak havoc on the battlefield! In contrary Stratios use Sentry drones to apply damage. BTW, Is it true faction drones were buffed recently and now are on par with T2 drones?


1. I'm pretty sure the strat can do 5/10 in lowsec, I haven't tried but I got one done in highsec. Never attempted a 6/10 in either, but I wouldn't be worried about a Gila being able to do them.

2. Yes and no. If you're REALLY good with the cloak+mwd trick you'll be fine, if not, a covops helps a bunch.

Yeah faction drones are pretty close to T2, it's either they have more tank but less pew or more pew but less tank. Can't remember which. I'm too cheap to fly faction most of the time.
Altair Taurus
#6 - 2014-09-25 15:42:45 UTC
Well, it looks like a hard choice! I compiled two example fits using EFT against Gurista rats in hi-sec space:

[Gila, DED]
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II

Kinetic Deflection Field
Thermic Dissipation Field
Omnidirectional Tracking Link I, Tracking Speed Script
Large Shield Extender
Large Shield Extender
10MN Afterburner

Rapid Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Light Missile
Rapid Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Light Missile
Rapid Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Light Missile
Rapid Light Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Light Missile
Sisters Core Probe Launcher, Sisters Core Scanner Probe

Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I

Hammerhead II x2
'Augmented' Hammerhead x2

[Stratios, DED]
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Armor Kinetic Hardener
Armor Thermic Hardener
Medium Armor Repairer

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link I, Optimal Range Script
Omnidirectional Tracking Link I, Tracking Speed Script
10MN Afterburner

Focused Medium Pulse Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Sisters Core Probe Launcher, Sisters Core Scanner Probe

Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Sentry Damage Augmentor I

Hobgoblin II x5
Federation Navy Garde x4
Federation Navy Ogre x4
Salvage Drone I x5

Are they any good? Do I move in right direction?
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#7 - 2014-09-25 17:18:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Aerie Evingod
You probably won't need an omni directional on the gila with medium drones, replacing it with a drone navigation computer will allow your drones to get on target faster. In low sec you will probably want a mwd instead of an ab.

Edit: faction missiles are expensive, if you can't fit T2 probably switch to regular missiles.
Altair Taurus
#8 - 2014-09-25 17:33:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
OK, Omnidirectional Tracking Link replaced by Drone Navigation Computer in my fit! OTL is for sentries if I am correct. Of course I set up faction missiles to increase damage but in fact lion's share of Gila's damage is done by medium drones so missile damage is negligible anyway. MWD installation is possible on both ships with my skills.

Aside of those changes everything looks good in above fits? I am not sure what type of missile is best for Gila: light, rapid light, heavy or heavy assault? As I understand drones should destroy larger ships while missiles should get rid of frigates and destroyers.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#9 - 2014-09-25 17:55:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Zhilia Mann
Altair Taurus wrote:
1. Can both ships do 5/10 and 6/10 DEDs in low-sec?


Both can do 5/10s but it's a bit touch and go in the Stratios. The Stratios can manage BR and Gurista 6/10s and possibly Angel 6/10s. The Gila can do all those plus Sansha properly fit. Neither really has much of a shot at the Serpentis 6/10.

Edit: that Strat fit looks thin for 5/10 final rooms. It might work (it's been a looooooong time since I ran the Guristas version) but it would be dicey. Overload the tank and pray I guess. If nothing else I'd sacrifice a DDA for a suitcase when entering the last room to buy you more time if things turn south.
Altair Taurus
#10 - 2014-09-25 19:01:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
Well, to barely match Gila damage output it is necessary to install three DDA on Stratios compromising its tank. I'd rather choose Gila but it's also a good idea to have CovOps cloak during low-sec adventures... Straight
Altair Taurus
#11 - 2014-09-25 19:02:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
Double post.
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#12 - 2014-09-25 19:41:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Aerie Evingod
The omni directional does affect mobile drones, but it's impact is not nearly as large as on sentries. Medium drones won't have to hard of a time hitting most targets. As drones are your main source of damage you can choose whatever missiles you want, but heavies and heavy assaults will not apply their damage to frigates as well as lights/rapid lights. The long reload is annoying on rapid lights but unless you run into fitting issues they are preferable to regular lights.
Altair Taurus
#13 - 2014-09-25 21:24:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
Thanks for advice. Fortunately I can fit Meta-4 RLMLs without any problems according to EFT.
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2014-09-25 22:24:55 UTC
Key thing is not to treat the fits like they are set in stone, try the sites, there is a limited amount of their types, and make changes accordingly.

Depending on the approach (sentries?, blitzing?) you may get away with less tank for example, or remove armor rigs due to speed :)

Also i read something about some mwd restrictions being lifted with the last updates, dunno if it affects guristas...
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2014-09-25 22:31:06 UTC
Aerie Evingod wrote:
The omni directional does affect mobile drones, but it's impact is not nearly as large as on sentries. Medium drones won't have to hard of a time hitting most targets.


Depends one ones patience and site, meds can clear 20+ frigs faster than lights, but only if they hit consistently enough, same with geckos since they have med tracking, the optimal thing being 2 omnis.
Pham Tzu
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2014-09-29 03:24:15 UTC
Here's a more tanky Stratios fit I find useful:

[Stratios, Plate, Drones only]
Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier
Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Reactive Armor Hardener
Medium Armor Repairer II

Large Peroxide Capacitor Power Cell
Cap Recharger II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II, Tracking Speed Script
F-90 Positional Sensor Subroutines, Targeting range Script
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I

Small Tractor Beam II (Deactivated)
Drone Link Augmentator II
Drone Link Augmentator II
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Sisters Core Probe Launcher, Sisters Core Scanner Probe

Medium Anti-Explosive Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II

Hobgoblin II x5
Warrior II x5
Vespa II x5
Warden II x4
Gecko x2
Salvage Drone I x5


Substitute other modules for lower skills.

At nearly full core skills this is still very tight for CPU - I need an implant to make it work. The Fed Navy DDA's are more for their CPU efficiency than damage.

I compromised on an omni-tank instead of faction specific because I didn't want to give up a low slot to use two hardeners.

The cap battery makes the cap much more forgiving.

I'm amazed this boat can fit a big plate. It has just enough extra grid and CPU compared to other cruisers. I couldn't do this practically on an Ishtar without using a smaller plate.

Pyfa says:

EHP - 35k
Armor rep - not spectacular, but lasts more than 8 minutes from full cap with the MWD turned off.
Targeting range - 110km
Drone Range - 108km
DPS for Wardens - about 425
DPS for Geckos - about 560
Top speed - 1348 m/s

The plate and rigging steps on the max velocity. Not as powerful or as fast as a similar fit on an Ishtar, but cloaking and faster scan probing will spoil you.

Tractor and Probe launcher can't both be online at the same time. Tractor is great for when you want to dive into a fur ball and grab your loot and get out. No flying past and turning around. It's also gives you an edge if a ninja shows up, though your reduced speed and dps'ing from range will make that a challenge for you.
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#17 - 2014-09-29 11:12:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
Pham Tzu wrote:
Here's a more tanky Stratios fit I find useful:

I'm amazed this boat can fit a big plate. It has just enough extra grid and CPU compared to other cruisers. I couldn't do this practically on an Ishtar without using a smaller plate.




I am using Stratios with big plate fitted for some time, basically because it can also run the covert facilities they added in oddysey. It can survive the blast and the npcs.

Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
Altair Taurus
#18 - 2014-09-30 10:34:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
Pham Tzu wrote:
Here's a more tanky Stratios fit I find useful:


Thanks for in depth description of your preferable fit but EFT says I cannot fit Stratios like that due to powergrid limitations. Anyway Stratios as "Sentry Sniper" vel "mini-Domi" is a cool idea so I wait for more accessible options in this area.

PS. Gecko drone - what is it?
Tarpedo
Incursionista
#19 - 2014-09-30 22:04:44 UTC
Altair Taurus wrote:
PS. Gecko drone - what is it?

It's "collectible" expensive (30M+) and powerful drone. From my experience they are way too fragile to use them on distances beyond range of remote repair modules.
Altair Taurus
#20 - 2014-09-30 22:44:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
I see. So Geckos are rather more suitable for drone BS than Stratios. Anyway I have already done my first DED 3/10 plex! Only 3.3 mil ISK earned because of lack of valuable Overseer's drop but it was very fun to blow up more than a hundred frigs! Lol
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