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Unnerf tracking enhance and warp sped
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Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC
#1 - 2014-09-25 01:33:16 UTC
CCP PLSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
ROAM 40 jump in talos warship so long y u do disss

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Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#2 - 2014-09-25 01:35:51 UTC
CCP Pls

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Petya Gladiator
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3 - 2014-09-25 02:04:06 UTC
PLzzz also nerf ecm.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2014-09-25 04:01:15 UTC
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
CCP PLSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
ROAM 40 jump in talos warship so long y u do disss

solution:
Dont fight so far away

Method:
Stop bluing half of EVE and have some actual fun for once
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#5 - 2014-09-25 05:16:31 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave
#6 - 2014-09-25 09:28:47 UTC
Petya Gladiator wrote:
PLzzz also nerf ecm.

Plaza just use eccm.

as for op the tools are in the game to get a frieghter to warp faster then a cruiser use them.

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2014-09-25 13:52:41 UTC
CCP PLSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS NOT!

-1
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#8 - 2014-09-25 14:04:05 UTC
less blues means shorter travel time to fights lol.....

or don't hit up null bear space/bot space. These tend to disappoint I found in the past.

Also the warp rigs are worth running these days. Granted some snooty/tanky/other liked rigs would have to go but....sometimes you have to make choices based on need. 40 jumps of long boring time or warp speeds to make those go faster would be such a choice.


Why the TE rebuff op? It was kind of nerfed to not be an all one that was kind of too good for being all in one.
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC
#9 - 2014-09-25 14:07:48 UTC
Zan Shiro wrote:

Why the TE rebuff op? It was kind of nerfed to not be an all one that was kind of too good for being all in one.


It was a decision based solely on the Talos and Machariel being OP and it killed a whole fitting style outside of Lasers (kiting with close range weapons and long range ammo) together with Medium Autocannons.

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Milton Middleson
Rifterlings
#10 - 2014-09-25 14:57:01 UTC
This might sound crazy, but: what if you used long-ranged weapons to kite? Sort of obvious in retrospect. Something about balance and tradeoffs.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#11 - 2014-09-25 15:03:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Zan Shiro
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Zan Shiro wrote:

Why the TE rebuff op? It was kind of nerfed to not be an all one that was kind of too good for being all in one.


It was a decision based solely on the Talos and Machariel being OP and it killed a whole fitting style outside of Lasers (kiting with close range weapons and long range ammo) together with Medium Autocannons.



TE hit all turret races. Gallente while not to the extent of minmatar use falloff with their hybrids for example. This was covered when the nerf went into effect. Yes it it minmatar a bit harder but that was a train many saw coming down the tracks as TE/ambit combos were used to the point they could be looked at as being abused. The kiting was to many just getting a bit out of hand.

I'd have to scare up old eft's and rerun graphs but some of the old dps graphs had minmatar have x-over points just a bit eschewed from the other guns. Barrage with ambit/TE was looking damn good in these graphs.

TE was the lesser of 2 evils as iirc, in recent patching ccp had already unnerfed a nerf they put in place in projectile ammo. Prior to dominion (or was it tyrannis?) projectile ammo was nerfed and arguably hurt minmatar a lot. They fixed this in dominion (or tyrannies?) and later went for TE. Which seems to be not as hurtful to minmatar.


Put another way, ccp nerfed the ammo and broke minmatar even more in many opinions. this only left TE.

Now could ccp change this? Maybe. There is the honeycombing skill (think its layering now, right?) that could maybe get some armour tankers a bit faster. This was imo the issue with minmatar's uber kiting back in the day. We could say well close on them to counter. Was kind of hard in the old days when plates had their full mass to make you fatter and slower basically.


edit: and they did change fleet boosting, cs has 2 boosts, t3 has 3 so its not like the old days where you and to bring dedicate skirmish and its on the roam/fleet to put a skirmish link in with the armour since skirmish was given out a lot in this area imo.

I am on the fence here tbh. I do miss some of my better kiting fits...but I know I pushed the spirit of "fair play" with some of them on the minmatar ships lol.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#12 - 2014-09-25 15:16:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Zan Shiro
Milton Middleson wrote:
This might sound crazy, but: what if you used long-ranged weapons to kite? Sort of obvious in retrospect. Something about balance and tradeoffs.



ccp makes arty a problem fitting wise in a few case. Wolf for example actually has the grid to run them better than jaguar. Why I like arty wolf better. Sure it looks at wet paper bags with envy tank wise.....arty on jaguar is usually less desirable as an option however. Not just me here either lol....my arty wolf fit I borrowed some of the common arty wolf floats floating around after they got some good reports in action lol.
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC
#13 - 2014-09-25 15:28:05 UTC
Milton Middleson wrote:
This might sound crazy, but: what if you used long-ranged weapons to kite? Sort of obvious in retrospect. Something about balance and tradeoffs.


I get what you mean, however I stay with my point that the Tracking Enhancer nerf at least overdid it. Railguns loaded with Spike shouldnt be the only mean to project damage past 15k, if you actually have to make tradeoffs for it.
The TE nerf was a result of medium long range weapons being underpowered and two hulls in the meta at the time being overpowered and it left a whole weapon system and fitting concept useless, thats why it shuld b reverted.

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Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#14 - 2014-09-25 16:17:42 UTC
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Railguns loaded with Spike shouldnt be the only mean to project damage past 15k, if you actually have to make tradeoffs for it.


Are you really so bad that you can only do this with railguns?

You should stop whatever you're doing and train missiles immediately. You obviously fail at turrets.
Milton Middleson
Rifterlings
#15 - 2014-09-25 16:46:03 UTC
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Milton Middleson wrote:
This might sound crazy, but: what if you used long-ranged weapons to kite? Sort of obvious in retrospect. Something about balance and tradeoffs.


I get what you mean, however I stay with my point that the Tracking Enhancer nerf at least overdid it. Railguns loaded with Spike shouldnt be the only mean to project damage past 15k, if you actually have to make tradeoffs for it.
The TE nerf was a result of medium long range weapons being underpowered and two hulls in the meta at the time being overpowered and it left a whole weapon system and fitting concept useless, thats why it shuld b reverted.


My point was that the TE nerf hit a fitting concept that shouldn't really exist. 'Short-ranged' weapons for true kiting allow you to bypass most of the notional downsides of a long-ranged setup without losing any of the considerable upsides. And now that medium LR turrets aren't uniformly terrible (railguns might be the best choice, but you can definitely project damage past 15km with other stuff), you can't really argue that it's somehow necessary for the TE nerf to be undone.
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC
#16 - 2014-09-25 17:00:42 UTC
Im not saying that Blasters should be able to do Railgun damage at medium to long range, which they dont and they didnt. What Im saying is, Im gonna repeat myself here, that the TE nerf was overdone.



Also the ship warp speed change for Battleships and BCs was ****. It makes sense, no question there, its simply not fun and even EvE should also be about fun.

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rsantos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2014-09-25 17:22:00 UTC  |  Edited by: rsantos
Drones Online! If its good and isn't using drones its OP!
Milton Middleson
Rifterlings
#18 - 2014-09-25 18:42:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Milton Middleson
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Im not saying that Blasters should be able to do Railgun damage at medium to long range, which they dont and they didnt. What Im saying is, Im gonna repeat myself here, that the TE nerf was overdone.


Why do kiting blaster ships need to exist in any capacity?


Quote:

Also the ship warp speed change for Battleships and BCs was ****. It makes sense, no question there, its simply not fun and even EvE should also be about fun.


That's incredibly short-sighted. The end conclusion of that is everything teleporting everywhere because traveling boring. And conversely, it's not fun for me if my frigate can't overtake a battlecruiser warping gate-to-gate.

Frankly, people citing the warp speed changes as the death of BC roams are ignoring reality. Firstly, roaming BCs went away with Retribution/Odyssey when cruisers became good. Secondly, people complaining about the agonizing wait of warping around in a battlecruiser are obviously going with their gut rather than looking at the numbers, because a 50 AU warp takes a whole nine seconds longer. More likely, their sense of going slow comes from comparing post-Rubicon BCs to post-Rubicon frigates (who now complete that 50 AU warp in half the time rather than with a mere eight seconds to spare).
Duchess Starbuckington
Doomheim
#19 - 2014-09-25 18:51:39 UTC
Yes let's bring back Winmatar and Battlecruisers-Online.

I don't think.

Troll somewhere else.
Omega Crendraven
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2014-09-25 19:38:33 UTC
i support
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