Crime & Punishment

I find it hilarious that you all talk about these things and have the gall to sugest such absurd and asinine ideas without having a bit of knowledge or foresight about how it will actually in reality effect you the PvPer or the general economy itself.

Some points going forward:

1. You do realize that 80% to 90% of all Industry is done in Highsec yes? Including Mining.

2. People do not want to mine in Lowsec, Or they would. This is mostly due to the fact that Mining ships are "Defensless". And Mining in Low sec is a guaranteed death sentence (Which falls on you PvPers). So why would a miner do it? They wouldn't.

3. The EvE economy is fueled by Highsec Miners and Industrialists. CCP has stated this on Numerous occasions. Without the Hoighsec "Carebears". The Economy would collapse. You would be paying 1 billion ISK for a single round of ammo.

Only 5% - 20% of minerals, ships, and Goods on the market come from 0.0 and Lowsec, according to CCPs Manufacturing, Marketing and Industry Charts.

4. PvP Emergent Game-play is the real factor in a miners or industrialists decision not to go to low or null.



Lets look at number 1:

CCP has already confirmed that the vast majority of industry in EvE takes place in Highsec. The goal of the latest industrial patches was to attempt to shift the focus to Null and Lowsec, But failed Miserably because Industry in and of itself, is not the issue.

The issue is the Emergent game-play itself. Specifically, the PvPers. And the way industry happens from the back end IE: Mining.

A miner must get into a defenseless ship, in order to have a mineral income sufficient to supply a markets demands for minerals, which are then used to build ships, ammo etc with. An individual with any intelligence is not going to take said ship into a sector of space where the chance of loosing it is almost 100%.

Even if you offered ore that was worth 1 billion ISK a unit that an NPC station would buy. Very few would take you up on it.

Why?

Because retrospectively, PvPers would 100% Camp these materials and gank every single miner who came within 1 AU of it. Making the addition, Pointless. (Where the focus is concerned,( "Getting miners out of highsec").

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So Reward, has nothing to do with how one should approach this issue. Because the reward in this case to a miner, is NEVER worth the risk, due to the Multiplier of Emergent PvP game-play.

This is why the vast majority of everything is made in an area of space that has a worthwhile risk (The occasional suicide gank) Rather then in an Area of space where the risk is: "You will die almost 100% of the time".

The other reason is because mining takes "Time".. A LONG time.... To gather sufficient minerals to build even a single ship, your talking hours, if not days. (Depending). Null, and Low do not offer the "Time" availability to do this. Sure you can ninja mine, but it will take you 10X the amount of time to gather the same minerals the high-sec miner does.

Why? Again Because of "Emergent" PvP Game-paly. Miners make easy to kill and juicy targets. PvPers want easy to kill and Juicy targets (For the most part).



Point 2:


People do not mine in Low or Null (usually) because it is time consuming, and too risky. In lowsec Combat and PvP is part of survival, so it is asinine to expect someone to go to said space, knowing they have no ability to defend themselves in the ship "Required" to mine ore in the vast quantities needed to supply a stable market.

Give Miners ships with Fat tanks and the ability to pump out DPS, and Miners will start going into low and Null to mine. But then many PvPers would have an issue with this, because then it would be a risk to them to try and kill them. It is blatantly clear that many pvpers only enjoy PvP when they are not at risk.

For example look at the Old Battle Hulk, Used by many miners in lowsec and null once it was discovered that it could kill a battle-cruiser if fitted properly. PvPers sent an outrage of 1000's of posts to the forums "Demanding CCP Nerf the hulk so it couldn't kill them anymore and they could gank in peace again"....

I mean really people..... Really....



Point 3

The economy in EvE is a fluid monstrosity, fueled by players from everywhere right?.... Wrong.

80% Of everything created, Built or made in EvE, is exported from highsec. CCP already confirmed this, and again was the reason for some of the industrial changes which those of us who are actual Industrialist and deal witht he EvE economy, marketing and such things every day, told CCP would not solve the Issue, we even told them what issues it would create, and yet CCP went ahead with it. Lo and Behold...

We told you so never says it enough.

What did we tell CCP?

* It would not make miners and industrialists move because industry was not at the core the issue stopping them from going to null and low to mine and do such.

* It would cause prices to skyrocket (which it has).

* PvPers would still ***** about how highsec miners need to get into 0.0 and lowsec. (Which they do this thread is proof).

> Continued

Ouch!

I clicked the link you provided, and read enough to be able to endorse what you said in your post. A quick check of Wiki reinforced the 'disputed' nature of the content of the speech.

That was shoddy of me, I know, but come on, hardly worth a facepalm?

James 315 is a writer, and a far better one than either you or me. For any artist it must be true that 'There's nothing new under the Sun'; they simply find new and interesting ways to represent stuff. Whether or not James 315 was influenced by Native American speechmaking or the scribbles of a screenwriter doesn't really matter; he used the idea appropriately, in the context of Eve Online.

'Everything is connected' was not even an original idea when voiced by Chief Seattle/Ted Perry/Charley's Aunt/Currin Trading. It is as old as the hills; older, in fact.

Still, pleased to see you're paying close attention, La Rynx.

Fly Safe!

Oh yes, even more awesome.

There are times, once in a while, when all I want out of my game time is to chill out in a major way. Sometimes when I'm in that mood I fire up the old EvE jukebox song set I saved off into iTunes and point a modestly tanked retriever at some hisec rocks, keep a causal eye on local and dscans, and relax.

So what?

Anyone who thinks that activity (as opposed to rampant afk mining) is what's wrong with the game is welcome to their opinion, and welcome to see if they can find me and convince me it's part of what's wrong with the game.





On the other hand, I don't expect to be safe doing it...so there's that.

And that's the difference.

Its good to hear my AFK mining is now ok with the New Order.

Fixing this for you.

10 PRINT "HELLO WORLD"
20 WAIT 5
30 GOTO 10

Take it from a pro coder :P

I know this post is a bit old, but its a shame I can only give it one 'like'.

James 315 himself is a bigger threat to EVE than any miner. He doesn't exist in the community for any real reason other than griefing players... particularly new players. He doesn't go out and create content. He spend nearly the entirety of his EVE time writing articles that humiliate players whom are already on the cusp of leaving due to their experiences.

This is not a knock on ganking, baiting, or any such players in particular. It's a knock on people who wouldn't even play the game if they couldn't find a way to **** off other players.

He is literally a cancer to this game. Sorry to burst anyone's bubble . The maybe ~50 players who've had their gameplay expanded due to him does not outweigh the many more who have lost their motivation to play over having their characters smeared forever due to a humiliating article on a troll website.

You really gotta take it easy man. This much rage about a video game can't be good for your health.