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Dear ccp - couldnt burner missions offer worthwhile rewards?
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Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2014-08-29 10:55:58 UTC
as the title says.

ive not gotten a burner mission yet but from reading the forums i can see that the bounty for the rat is 5mill isk. this is pitons compared to what some poeple are spending on ships to kill the burner.

Its also not far above the value for bs rats in nullsec belts but its a much much harder ship kill.

also the named rats in nullsec drop faction loot ant a higher rate and more of it (so i hear) and they are pitifully easy to destroy.

doesnt make sense. doesnt seem balanced.

greater risk should = greater rewards.

pls discuss
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2014-08-29 11:01:14 UTC
Not sure hull cost vs single mission is valid as a basic marauder will run over a billion.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2014-08-29 11:52:48 UTC
sry could u explain?
Imperial Sardaukar
Albireo Solem
Pandemic Horde
#4 - 2014-08-29 12:17:00 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
sry could u explain?


Take level 4 missions in a Golem for example. Ship+Fits cost around 1.3 bil and a normal level 4 mission pay is around 13-17mil + 7500-8500LP and takes around 20 minutes to do.

Now take level 4 burner missions.. in a frigate that costs around 250mil (with bling bling) that makes you 5 mil (as you say) and arund 5500/LP per mission... for 2-3 minutes.

I would say this is a much better investment.

Just my 2 cents.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2014-08-29 12:39:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Bastion Arzi
well u dont HAVE to use a marauder for level 4's do you? really?

they are mostly done in t1 bs afaik. that makes the reward for burner missions look a little silly considering the cost of ur frig.
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#6 - 2014-08-29 12:42:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Owen Levanth
Bastion Arzi wrote:
well u dont HAVE to use a marauder for level 4's do you? really?

they are mostly done in t1 bs afaik. that makes the reward for burner missions look a little silly considering the cost of ur frig.


You also don't have to use a blingy ship in burner missions. There are a lot of people who did them just in T2-Assault-frigs with standard T2/meta fits.

Edit:

Run 1-2 standard L4 missions and you can replace a lost frigate + fit. Easy.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2014-08-29 13:22:18 UTC
dont u need webs at 16km for some of them?
Lady Rift
His Majesty's Privateers
#8 - 2014-08-29 13:31:58 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
dont u need webs at 16km for some of them?



no they are all soloable with a t2 ship and t2 mods.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2014-08-29 13:32:43 UTC
okay...
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#10 - 2014-08-29 13:50:54 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
well u dont HAVE to use a marauder for level 4's do you? really?

they are mostly done in t1 bs afaik. that makes the reward for burner missions look a little silly considering the cost of ur frig.


You dont HAVE to run a pimped out ship for burners EITHER.

We just like to do things quickly 'round these parts.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2014-08-29 14:29:43 UTC
ye ye thats already been discussed thanks for the reiteration
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2014-08-29 14:32:00 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
Bastion Arzi wrote:
well u dont HAVE to use a marauder for level 4's do you? really?

they are mostly done in t1 bs afaik. that makes the reward for burner missions look a little silly considering the cost of ur frig.


You dont HAVE to run a pimped out ship for burners EITHER.

We just like to do things quickly 'round these parts.

I find it funny that these burner missions were supposed to be 1v1 missions against an NPC and yet the NPC can neut you out, can scram you and everything under the sun but you can't do that back is a real problem. NPC can scram me and turn off my MWD but not the other way around? enemy can neut me out but I can't neut them out? Come on CCP, its wildly unfair.
LUMINOUS SPIRIT
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#13 - 2014-08-29 18:22:35 UTC
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote:
Cipher Jones wrote:
Bastion Arzi wrote:
well u dont HAVE to use a marauder for level 4's do you? really?

they are mostly done in t1 bs afaik. that makes the reward for burner missions look a little silly considering the cost of ur frig.


You dont HAVE to run a pimped out ship for burners EITHER.

We just like to do things quickly 'round these parts.

I find it funny that these burner missions were supposed to be 1v1 missions against an NPC and yet the NPC can neut you out, can scram you and everything under the sun but you can't do that back is a real problem. NPC can scram me and turn off my MWD but not the other way around? enemy can neut me out but I can't neut them out? Come on CCP, its wildly unfair.


double web is all you really need.
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2014-08-29 20:50:08 UTC
oh right daredevil it is then
GOB the Magician
Enlightened Industries
Goonswarm Federation
#15 - 2014-08-30 02:12:28 UTC
isk isn't everything
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#16 - 2014-08-30 11:11:40 UTC
I'm just pretending this did not happen. Got my crap pushed back in by a bloodraider burner last night. Me in wolf and two alts in T1 suicide frigs.

Back to EFT ;)

BTW the rewards have scaled a bit. They are no longer as ridiculously low as in day 1. Still, according to devpost the pilot loss rate is still significant. On day 1 for every burner killed podpilots lost a bit over 7 ships. On day 2 the ratio was already 6 losses per each burner killed.

I think they are fine. It's still just a PvE content but its a challenging PvE content.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2014-08-30 14:11:48 UTC
Carniflex wrote:
I'm just pretending this did not happen. Got my crap pushed back in by a bloodraider burner last night. Me in wolf and two alts in T1 suicide frigs.

Back to EFT ;)

BTW the rewards have scaled a bit. They are no longer as ridiculously low as in day 1. Still, according to devpost the pilot loss rate is still significant. On day 1 for every burner killed podpilots lost a bit over 7 ships. On day 2 the ratio was already 6 losses per each burner killed.

I think they are fine. It's still just a PvE content but its a challenging PvE content.

Unfair mary-sue type NPC content is not "challenging" its really a good example of artificial difficulty by making enemies have extremely high thresholds for everything they can do AND have EWAR immunity
imbaRabbit
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#18 - 2014-08-30 14:28:12 UTC
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote:
Unfair mary-sue type NPC content is not "challenging" its really a good example of artificial difficulty by making enemies have extremely high thresholds for everything they can do AND have EWAR immunity


Stop saying that they have complete EWAR immunity. You're doing that all over the forum.

ECM works just fine. Griffin with five racials should buy enough time for your friend to finish him EASILY off.
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2014-08-30 15:13:56 UTC
imbaRabbit wrote:
Vlad Vladimir Vladinovsky wrote:
Unfair mary-sue type NPC content is not "challenging" its really a good example of artificial difficulty by making enemies have extremely high thresholds for everything they can do AND have EWAR immunity


Stop saying that they have complete EWAR immunity. You're doing that all over the forum.

ECM works just fine. Griffin with five racials should buy enough time for your friend to finish him EASILY off.

Some EWAR immunity is still immunity, being neut, TD, SD and scram immune is insane for these overzealous frigates and certainly doesn't reflect an officer/faction fit ship that CCP claims it does
infra52x
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2014-09-01 22:08:59 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
as the title says.

ive not gotten a burner mission yet but from reading the forums i can see that the bounty for the rat is 5mill isk. this is pitons compared to what some poeple are spending on ships to kill the burner.

Its also not far above the value for bs rats in nullsec belts but its a much much harder ship kill.

also the named rats in nullsec drop faction loot ant a higher rate and more of it (so i hear) and they are pitifully easy to destroy.

doesnt make sense. doesnt seem balanced.

greater risk should = greater rewards.

pls discuss



You mention greater risk vs reward... Well, killing faction rats in null is a greater risk than doing a burner mission in high sec... Also, burners missions are optional as are running drone exploration complexes which lots of folks don't bother to run anymore due to pathetic rewards... Bottom line is, if there is pve that you don't feel like its worth doing, then don't do it.. If you are asking ccp to buff the rewards for a highsec npc to be comparable to a nullsec faction npc, you are on crack..
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