EVE General Discussion

I just found an actual signature.

Utter nonsense for a couple of reasons.

#1. "EVE is a pvp game" is used here in such a way that it suggests 'ship v ship' combat. When people say EVE is a pvp game, they mean that EVE is a game of interaction and much of that interaction is conflict. For example, As an explorer I 'pvp' against every other explorer as I endeavor to find valuable items then trade those items for other things (like isk). Same with market pvp, competition between builders and such.

#2. The above quoted post seems suppose that there are only 2 ways to get isk, 'grinding' or buying plex. It's as if the various totally passive isk generation methods don't exist at all lol. Very many PVPrs I know use these passive methods in order to spend all their time PVPing. In fact, it's only a foolish PVPr that 'grinds' anything, shooting rats or rocks are the poor man's way of earning isk.

PLEX offers zero benefit over and above smart game play, where as in a p2w game paying trumps EVERY other possible advantage.

I used ship vs ship as an example because it was the easiest to work with. It can be applied to other aspects as well. Sell plex for isk to use as starting capital to market trade vs starting small and spending hours, days, weeks, even months accumulating the trading capital that 2 or 3 plex can get you instantly.

Using RL cash to buy plex to run a locus mining fleet that allows you to make huge profits vs taking a huge chunk out of your profits and using isk to buy the plex off the market.




Yes there are way to get isk passively. The difference is, the player that buys plex can use them too.



Even the gold ammo in WoT (which is considered P2W) gets trumped by smart game play. Comparing one to the other is not a proper comparison.

Not in the slightest, actually. Nothing PLEX offers makes any difference in how much time you have. Again, your entire idea rests on the nonsensical notion that you need vast amounts of ISK to practice. You don't. It's that simple. If you expend tons of ISK while practicing, it only means that you are doing something very wrong and you're not learning from it. You are throwing away money on something that could (and indeed should) be essentially free, and you're failing to spot the bigger lesson: that you're throwing away money.

…and you were wrong. Fancy that. It's called moving the goal posts and it's a bad thing. I don't care what you were thinking about. I care about what you actually said. What you said was “They spend the entire time practicing because they just buy plex and sell it in game for the isk they need to afford practicing” — in other words, you were talking about was selling the PLEX and then stupidly wasting that ISK on something that makes no difference (or, worse, that incurs negative learning).

Because that's what you're describing: a pointless waste of ISK for no good purpose. They don't “need ISK to afford practicing”, they just need time. Selling a PLEX does not give you that time — in fact, when you do so, you give someone else that time that you need.

So you agree then that PLEX is not a factor. Good. Because otherwise, you are just misrepresenting what I said, again.

…and that has nothing to do with selling PLEX since ISK is not a factor in training.

I'm a casual solo and don't feel myself forced. Anyway solo or not you play with the others in one way or another, just enjoy the moments.

It doesn't need to be "vast" amounts of isk. It simply needs to require isk. That you will need to spend isk to buy new ships and modules that is lost while PvP'ing. Which for most it does. Time spend earning isk in game (any amount) is time not PvPing. Instead of spending time earning isk in game, you can spend that time PvPing by buying a plex and selling it on the market for isk.



Don't confuse your incapability to grasp the message with me not stating what I was thinking. I've made it perfectly clear to anyone above a 3rd grade reading level.

…and that has nothing to do with selling PLEX since ISK is not a factor in training.[/quote]

Not "training" if you mean character training. Practicing. As in the player at the keyboard actually engaging in PvP. Which has everything to do with selling Plex for isk. For most, it'll cost isk to replace lost ships and fits (and maybe even implants) when PvPing. This isk must come from somewhere. For some, they will engage in some other activity (missions, mining, trading), and time spent doing these other activities is time not spent PvPing. Since this time spent earning isk could be spent pvping if that person simply sells a plex on the market for isk, plex does give you an advantage.

Not that either. And since no vast amounts are needed, PLEX instantly ceases to be a factor.

This is categorically false since the majority of money-making activities in the game can be done in parallel with something else (and with each other). Hell, once you get good enough at it, you can even earn money from shooting other players.

The message was “They spend the entire time practicing because they just buy plex and sell it in game for the isk they need to afford practicing” (emphasis mine) — in other words, you were talking about was selling the PLEX and then stupidly wasting that ISK on something that makes no difference (or, worse, that incurs negative learning). What you were thinking is irrelevant — that is what you said and that is what I responded to.

I mean training as in practicing; I have been all along; I have never indicated otherwise. You know this full well. PLEX is not a factor in that training. You can try to reinterpret what I'm saying as much as you like, but it won't change: PLEX is not a factor. ISK is not a factor.

Again, this is if you're doing it wrong and consistently failing to learn from your mistakes — in other words, the kind of learning you're describing is worse than the one that doesn't involve PLEX. That alone kills any notion of P2W.

You are effectively trying to say that:

Person A buys a PLEX and blows 700M+ on learning how to explode for 3 hours in a style that earns him several ALODs.
Person B does not buy a PLEX and learns how to explode for 3 hours.

…and from this, you are trying to come to the conclusion that player A is gaining more experience. The mere suggestion of it is part of why I'm laughing in your face over your continued ignorance of all things EVE.

ccp figured out solo players are more likely to quit the game is why

Perfectly explains all the Goons quitting. Way too much solo play in dullsec.

The gift that keeps on giving.