These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Crime & Punishment

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

How High Sec Should Be, An Opinion Forum
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#61 - 2014-08-14 15:02:47 UTC
Cidanel Afuran wrote:
Christopher Mabata wrote:
This forum is designed to pose a simple question to the masses:

How do you think High Sec Should Be in the coming future?

Now hold on a second before you answer that and hear me out.

Ive played eve for nearly 5 years between me and my alt accounts, I have been a newbro, a miner, a mission runner
I've been down on my luck ISK wise, Ive been space rich for a time
I've been a pirate, a Ganker, A scammer, a Null Block Soldier on the front lines

And thats why im putting this post up. I want to hear from other players like me who have seen more than one side of eve how they think the future of high security space should look.

Please None of these posts we all know about those opinions
"105% Safe"
"Remove it completely"
"Desolate wasteland"

I see the need for high sec so newbros can learn the mechanics of the game, but lets face it the last expansions since crucible have been about our rise to power over empire space. And thats why im putting this here and not Features and Ideas, High sec is about crime and punishment so rather than proposing anything im asking for feedback. I want to know what people really think. and what they think high sec should come to be


I feel like punching someone in the face every time I read the term 'newbro'. Please, please stop using it.



newbro, bro, dude, dudebro, bob, for the love of bob, content, content creator, conflict driver, and (last but not least) Leto Thule
Desivo Delta Visseroff
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#62 - 2014-08-14 15:15:25 UTC
Anything below 0.9 should be considered Lowsec. There, everyone's problems are solved.

Now, can I get some stuffs from anyone (rage) quitting??

I was hunting for sick loot, but all I could get my hands on were 50 corpses[:|]..............[:=d]
Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#63 - 2014-08-14 15:31:18 UTC
Serendipity Lost wrote:

newbro, bro, dude, dudebro, bob, for the love of bob, content, content creator, conflict driver, and (last but not least) Leto Thule


Stop calling my house and breathing heavily into the phone in between bites of extra-crispy chicken. I know it's you.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#64 - 2014-08-15 12:13:24 UTC
I can't count the number of people I have met in HiSec, mining, running Incursions, etcetc, who are nothing more than NullSec "money maker" alts. This is a problem, and it shows that the risk:reward ratios are broken and out of whack. Part of the problem is "top down" economies in NullSec which should be reversed to "bottom up".

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#65 - 2014-08-15 13:06:15 UTC
It will correct itself (maybe not in a bad way). Now that null is settled and run by tax collecting overlords it gets more boring by the day. Folks are leaving the game. Rising plex prices are pushing folks out of the game. There are becoming enough reasons to walk away from a character you've been training for 5+ years to go play something else. 'This isn't fun anymore' is a huge motivator.
Maekchu
Doomheim
#66 - 2014-08-15 13:11:33 UTC
I'm locked out of this part of space. I have no opinion on this matter.
Cidanel Afuran
Grant Village
#67 - 2014-08-18 15:27:31 UTC
Serendipity Lost wrote:
Cidanel Afuran wrote:
Christopher Mabata wrote:
This forum is designed to pose a simple question to the masses:

How do you think High Sec Should Be in the coming future?

Now hold on a second before you answer that and hear me out.

Ive played eve for nearly 5 years between me and my alt accounts, I have been a newbro, a miner, a mission runner
I've been down on my luck ISK wise, Ive been space rich for a time
I've been a pirate, a Ganker, A scammer, a Null Block Soldier on the front lines

And thats why im putting this post up. I want to hear from other players like me who have seen more than one side of eve how they think the future of high security space should look.

Please None of these posts we all know about those opinions
"105% Safe"
"Remove it completely"
"Desolate wasteland"

I see the need for high sec so newbros can learn the mechanics of the game, but lets face it the last expansions since crucible have been about our rise to power over empire space. And thats why im putting this here and not Features and Ideas, High sec is about crime and punishment so rather than proposing anything im asking for feedback. I want to know what people really think. and what they think high sec should come to be


I feel like punching someone in the face every time I read the term 'newbro'. Please, please stop using it.



newbro, bro, dude, dudebro, bob, for the love of bob, content, content creator, conflict driver, and (last but not least) Leto Thule


god damnit
Heinrich Erquilenne
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#68 - 2014-08-18 17:28:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Heinrich Erquilenne
I'd change lowsec to make it a bit closer to what you want (trade hubs and stuff like that): more sentries nuking stuff hard on gates and stations. The rest should stay free for all. Then you might see your lowsec trade hubs and see more people running missions. Idiots will still get probed or warp to sun when they take 10% shield damage. But it would be a place you might consider live, build stuff and trade in. There are many potential lowsec systems with a lot of stations and ok missions but lowsec is just like our real life Bagdad. Anywhere else is a better place to live in, and that includes null and the healthy standings policy people follow most of the times. As it is it's just a kill farm zone for bored small pvp corps. Which means a dead zone since the main content driver in eve is the economy.
Ssabat Thraxx
DUST Expeditionary Team
Good Sax
#69 - 2014-08-18 21:12:27 UTC
First of all, we need to stop penalizing people for engaging in PVP in lowsec. Why the hell does my security status go down for PVPing in what I thought was a section of space where that is what's "supposed to" go on. The "tags for sec status," while better than nothing, is still woefully lacking, IMO. So you engage in PVP in lowsec, you become unable to go to hisec, so you have a friend or an alt bring you the tags, etc. It gets pretty costly after a while of doing this. Last 2 times I did it, between the tags themselves and the fee, it came out to around 145M isk. 145M isk once a week or so, or I can go ratting (booorrrrinnnng) and wait god knows how long before I get the tags I need on my own. It's STUPID, CCP.

*crying* LEAVE LOWSEC ALONE!!

Also, a couple of ideas Ive seen in this thread were really good, imo. One was to boot people out of NPC corps after a set amount of time, in the same manner that the "Rookie Help" channel disappears for you once youveplayed 30 days or whatever it is.

The other idea I liked was having NPC corps constantly qat war with each other. Right now, there's a lot of pro's and fewer cons to just remaining in an NPC corp.

Worst CCP idea yet: Putting hisec DED sites in Lowsec system. I'd willing to bet that it brought far fewer hisec carenears 9into lowsec than it just pissed off those of us who already live there. Epic fail, epic waste of my time. Now I can add 5000000 wormholes to the worthless crap I have to scan down now.

The probolem with hisec is that lowsec sorta sux.



\m/ O.o \m/

"You're a freak ..." - Solecist Project
Heinrich Erquilenne
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#70 - 2014-08-19 00:41:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Heinrich Erquilenne
Ssabat Thraxx wrote:
First of all, we need to stop penalizing people for engaging in PVP in lowsec. Why the hell does my security status go down for PVPing in what I thought was a section of space where that is what's "supposed to" go on. The "tags for sec status," while better than nothing, is still woefully lacking, IMO. So you engage in PVP in lowsec, you become unable to go to hisec, so you have a friend or an alt bring you the tags, etc. It gets pretty costly after a while of doing this. Last 2 times I did it, between the tags themselves and the fee, it came out to around 145M isk. 145M isk once a week or so, or I can go ratting (booorrrrinnnng) and wait god knows how long before I get the tags I need on my own. It's STUPID, CCP.


Actually, no. Lowsec is the typical buffer zone but it turned out to be a complete design failure. By design you're not supposed to do hardcore pvp there, unless you're ready to pay the price for it. You can but it has a cost and it's not a minor one. FFA pvp is supposed to happen in nullsec. No penalties. Enjoy jita while nuking anyone you want. At least it seems to be the original plan.

But currently the only kind of people you'll find in nullsec are:
- noobs (been there, done that)
- doing logistics stuff to get it to null
- buying cheap crap someone sells there for some odd reason
- pvp corp making the place a hell to live with station and gatecamping 24/7.

It seems that the original intent was making lowsec a place to learn the ropes with increased risks before going to nullsec. But it's just a place small pvp corps chose to occupy and camp all day which isn't really good for the economy side of things. Big entities moved where the money is (nullsec), they had the level of leadership to make smart "friend and foes" policies, because, let's face it, killing on sight people living in your system all the time isn't sustainable, and lowsec is just a wasteland no one can use for any purpose except logistics and the occasional explorer.

The issue about lowsec isn't pvp it's that everyone will try to shot at you all the time. It's the choke points offering no level of safety at all except the most basic and dull ones anyone can safely ignore. You can't own the place and anyone can come here and engage people effectively near choke points. That's why many people stay in highsec or will just go to null. At least there you know who is your firend and who isn't and you can chose when to fight and when to GTFO. Too many hostiles and not enough profits, that's lowsec. I'm strongly insisting on profits. You're telling it yourself, you can't make a living in lowsec. If you try to make highsec more like lowsec you're going to kill the main content driver which is money. So, don't even ask for it that's a terrible idea. People will never leave highsec for low because of choke points and KOS practices, one of them being the worst content killer in lowsec. They may just move to null instead, that would be a lot better for them.
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#71 - 2014-08-19 14:29:06 UTC
Generally, I would leave it as is. It's a place for risk-averse players to operate in relative, but not absolute, safety. If people want to live in hisec for their entire EvE careers, I think they should be able to, and do so while making a relatively good, yet not astronomical, profit. (No pun intended.) These radical proposals I hear about making it a rookie-only area, reducing it all to losec, etc. I think go way too far.

With that in mind though, I would propose a few tweaks:

1. Mission payouts. I would have mission payout scale inversely with the security status of the agent's home system. This would make the best hisec mission hubs the 0.5 systems, not the 1.0 systems. I think this change alone would do a lot to spread people out, at least in hisec. (Admittedly, I haven't seriously missioned for about 6 years, so if this is already the case, please ignore.)

2. Ore Distribution. I would remove all +5% and +10% ores from 1.0 and 0.9 systems, and +10% ores from 0.8 and 0.7 systems. This would make the best mining systems the 0.5 and 0.6 systems (doubly so because of better ores and higher grade ores) and would, like my proposed change #1, spread people out.

3. Wardecs. If Corp B wardecs Corp A and a player leaves Corp A, I think that player should still be a valid target for Corp B for a period of 7 days, or until the war is over, which ever comes first. CCP made a similar change with new corps anchoring towers to help deter corp-hopping to avoid wardecs, and I think this would dovetail with that nicely. It would likely be a bit trickier to code ("valid target" would be defined by corp history in addition to current corp), but I think it would make the hisec experience better overall.

4. NPC Corps. I think that encouraging people to leave NPC corps would go a long way towards improving the hisec experience. After some set time (say, one year), all players in NPC corps should experience a progressively worsening tax on all wallet transactions, refining amounts, and job installation costs that maxes out two years after it starts (so after 3 years in an NPC corp). Not so much that it becomes impossible to stay there (cap it at, say, 25%), but enough that it would hurt income for any player trying to make ISK enough to seriously encourage them to form their own corp. (To prevent players from simply jumping into a player corp for a day to reset the counter, the timer should be based on total time spent in an NPC corp, not current stint in an NPC corp.)

Thoughts?

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#72 - 2014-08-19 14:39:05 UTC
Interesting ideas. I've always adhered to the idea that NPC corps should be for newer players, not the older more experienced ones. A scalar tax rate dependent upon a character's age might correctify that situation. Of course i'm going to stick with my guns on the idea that after a certain amount of SP a player is no longer eligible for NPC corps. If you're in this game long enough you need to commit to the ideals of this game... once you pass a certain point you should either a) get a big boy job in a player corp, or b) be considered a vagrant who has nothing to contribute to the community at large aside from hilarious killmails.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Solecist Project
#73 - 2014-08-19 14:44:04 UTC
Everyone will obey to the CODE.

People will control all relevant gates for autopiloters.

Patrols will cruise through highsec to ensure that there is no one...
... NO ONE ...
sitting around at gates, stations or belts without a permit.

Miners, mission runners, haulers, explorers, scanners, gankers ...

NO exceptions!

That ringing in your ears you're experiencing right now is the last gasping breathe of a dying inner ear as it got thoroughly PULVERISED by the point roaring over your head at supersonic speeds. - Tippia
Ssabat Thraxx
DUST Expeditionary Team
Good Sax
#74 - 2014-08-19 15:46:30 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Generally, I would leave it as is. It's a place for risk-averse players to operate in relative, but not absolute, safety. If people want to live in hisec for their entire EvE careers, I think they should be able to, and do so while making a relatively good, yet not astronomical, profit. (No pun intended.) These radical proposals I hear about making it a rookie-only area, reducing it all to losec, etc. I think go way too far.

With that in mind though, I would propose a few tweaks:

1. Mission payouts. I would have mission payout scale inversely with the security status of the agent's home system. This would make the best hisec mission hubs the 0.5 systems, not the 1.0 systems. I think this change alone would do a lot to spread people out, at least in hisec. (Admittedly, I haven't seriously missioned for about 6 years, so if this is already the case, please ignore.)

2. Ore Distribution. I would remove all +5% and +10% ores from 1.0 and 0.9 systems, and +10% ores from 0.8 and 0.7 systems. This would make the best mining systems the 0.5 and 0.6 systems (doubly so because of better ores and higher grade ores) and would, like my proposed change #1, spread people out.

3. Wardecs. If Corp B wardecs Corp A and a player leaves Corp A, I think that player should still be a valid target for Corp B for a period of 7 days, or until the war is over, which ever comes first. CCP made a similar change with new corps anchoring towers to help deter corp-hopping to avoid wardecs, and I think this would dovetail with that nicely. It would likely be a bit trickier to code ("valid target" would be defined by corp history in addition to current corp), but I think it would make the hisec experience better overall.

4. NPC Corps. I think that encouraging people to leave NPC corps would go a long way towards improving the hisec experience. After some set time (say, one year), all players in NPC corps should experience a progressively worsening tax on all wallet transactions, refining amounts, and job installation costs that maxes out two years after it starts (so after 3 years in an NPC corp). Not so much that it becomes impossible to stay there (cap it at, say, 25%), but enough that it would hurt income for any player trying to make ISK enough to seriously encourage them to form their own corp. (To prevent players from simply jumping into a player corp for a day to reset the counter, the timer should be based on total time spent in an NPC corp, not current stint in an NPC corp.)

Thoughts?


+1, I think those are all really good ideas! My favorite is #4, although I would reduce the timer from A yr to something more like 6 months. You should rly go poke around F&I forum, where I shall bump your ideas Big smile

\m/ O.o \m/

"You're a freak ..." - Solecist Project
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#75 - 2014-08-19 16:47:58 UTC
Once they institute permits for bacon, the CODE. will meet it's match.
Until then, bump away.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Solj RichPopolous
Silent Havok.
H A R D L I N E R S
#76 - 2014-08-21 02:43:13 UTC
High sec should be a bleak dismal place of little to no monetary value. Everyone who makes it their main source of income should be forced into serfdom to pay for the most basic of necessities.

No other game allows people to stay in the starting area to progress. its insanity. CCP got to protect that bulk of the subby income though.