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EVE(L) Stabb. Remove from game? Maybe?

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Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#81 - 2014-08-06 23:40:50 UTC
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:

If the guy is AFK, he can't warp. The people you fail to catch are obviously at the keyboard to warp out.

Semi-afk mate. Right now you can warp-in your 500k, x4 stab ship to de-plex, turn up sound to max and go bake a cake or something, come back when you hear annoying beeping to warp away.

Frostys Virpio wrote:
This is exactly like AFK cloaker.

And sorry, but that is not the same, afk cloaker don't get the cookie just for being there and a loud notification when someone enters system. Semi-afk fw de-plexing is more akin to semi-afk lvl4s domi farming than to null afk cloaker dilemma.


It is the same because it's a mechanic people hate because they are too lazy to counter it. How damn hard is it to have friend to gets more points on that 500k frigs or to just alpha it off with a trasher? It's not like a 4 stabs frig will have any kind of EHP.
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#82 - 2014-08-07 07:33:01 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:

If the guy is AFK, he can't warp. The people you fail to catch are obviously at the keyboard to warp out.

Semi-afk mate. Right now you can warp-in your 500k, x4 stab ship to de-plex, turn up sound to max and go bake a cake or something, come back when you hear annoying beeping to warp away.

Frostys Virpio wrote:
This is exactly like AFK cloaker.

And sorry, but that is not the same, afk cloaker don't get the cookie just for being there and a loud notification when someone enters system. Semi-afk fw de-plexing is more akin to semi-afk lvl4s domi farming than to null afk cloaker dilemma.


It is the same because it's a mechanic people hate because they are too lazy to counter it. How damn hard is it to have friend to gets more points on that 500k frigs or to just alpha it off with a trasher? It's not like a 4 stabs frig will have any kind of EHP.

Around 3,5k ehp, but that is not the point.
According to your logic it's the same to margin scamming too then, 'cause "it's a mechanic people hate because they are too lazy to counter it"?
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#83 - 2014-08-07 14:20:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Cearain
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:

If the guy is AFK, he can't warp. The people you fail to catch are obviously at the keyboard to warp out.

Semi-afk mate. Right now you can warp-in your 500k, x4 stab ship to de-plex, turn up sound to max and go bake a cake or something, come back when you hear annoying beeping to warp away.

Frostys Virpio wrote:
This is exactly like AFK cloaker.

And sorry, but that is not the same, afk cloaker don't get the cookie just for being there and a loud notification when someone enters system. Semi-afk fw de-plexing is more akin to semi-afk lvl4s domi farming than to null afk cloaker dilemma.


It is the same because it's a mechanic people hate because they are too lazy to counter it. How damn hard is it to have friend to gets more points on that 500k frigs or to just alpha it off with a trasher? It's not like a 4 stabs frig will have any kind of EHP.



Thrashers don't fit in novice plexes.

Stabs don't prevent a cheap but effective shield tank and to run defensive plexes. You don't need weapons so all your cpu and powergrid can go to cheap stabs and shield tank. FW occupancy needs plex timer rollbacks and better intel tools for pvpers, if ccp wants to pretend it is a pvp war and not a pve war.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#84 - 2014-08-07 17:16:40 UTC
Ashlar Vellum wrote:


It is the same because it's a mechanic people hate because they are too lazy to counter it. How damn hard is it to have friend to gets more points on that 500k frigs or to just alpha it off with a trasher? It's not like a 4 stabs frig will have any kind of EHP.

Around 3,5k ehp, but that is not the point.
According to your logic it's the same to margin scamming too then, 'cause "it's a mechanic people hate because they are too lazy to counter it"?[/quote]

CCP themself asked for feedback on margin trading so I assume they might be looking for way to change it be it because of the scams or for other reasons I don't know of but as long as it is like it is, there isn't much to say about it just like stabs.

Cearain wrote:


Thrashers don't fit in novice plexes.

Stabs don't prevent a cheap but effective shield tank and to run defensive plexes. You don't need weapons so all your cpu and powergrid can go to cheap stabs and shield tank. FW occupancy needs plex timer rollbacks and better intel tools for pvpers, if ccp wants to pretend it is a pvp war and not a pve war.


Removing stabs won't fix the issue anyway as long as rollback and better intel aren't in. That's where the whole problem is. Remove stabs and people will fly unfit ships to reduce their cost as much as possible. You won't be getting any more fights, only a few turkey shoot where the other guy save his pod and take a new frig while you have the entire warzone to scout again to find your next farmer kill.

PLEX won't create fights as long as they don't require a fight for payout. Make plexing give you a pool of LP from wich you get some as a bonus for the ones you get from militia kills. If let's say a small give you 5k LP now, put that LP in a pool and your next 20 LP kill is actually bonused by 25% to give you 25 LP instead and leaving your pool at 4995. The % bonus if to be balanced to make it worthwhile but the idea is to stop people from only orbitting a button because that does not generate fights anyway.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#85 - 2014-08-07 17:28:05 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:


Removing stabs won't fix the issue anyway as long as rollback and better intel aren't in. That's where the whole problem is. Remove stabs and people will fly unfit ships to reduce their cost as much as possible. You won't be getting any more fights, only a few turkey shoot where the other guy save his pod and take a new frig while you have the entire warzone to scout again to find your next farmer kill.

PLEX won't create fights as long as they don't require a fight for payout. Make plexing give you a pool of LP from wich you get some as a bonus for the ones you get from militia kills. If let's say a small give you 5k LP now, put that LP in a pool and your next 20 LP kill is actually bonused by 25% to give you 25 LP instead and leaving your pool at 4995. The % bonus if to be balanced to make it worthwhile but the idea is to stop people from only orbitting a button because that does not generate fights anyway.


I think you and I and ccp agree on the first paragraph. We just need to keep pushing them to get it done. I agree that ruling out stabs and generally the changes they are doing with npcs are just more of bandaid to cover the problem than a cure.
Plex timer rollbacks and better intel of where plex timers are being run are, the cure.

As for the second paragraph I am not opposed to something like that. But already people get lp for kills of enemy militia directly. People killng alts in the other militia is generally the concern. Also missions already tends to dwarf the lp gains from plexing.


I really think that if they did the rollbacks and gave good intel on where timers are being run you would generally get 1-2 pvp fights per plex captured. Maybe even 3-4 pvp fights per plex captured. It would be a pvp nirvana - ccp just needs to figure out the coding.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#86 - 2014-08-07 18:00:43 UTC
Cearain wrote:


As for the second paragraph I am not opposed to something like that. But already people get lp for kills of enemy militia directly. People killng alts in the other militia is generally the concern. Also missions already tends to dwarf the lp gains from plexing.


I really think that if they did the rollbacks and gave good intel on where timers are being run you would generally get 1-2 pvp fights per plex captured. Maybe even 3-4 pvp fights per plex captured. It would be a pvp nirvana - ccp just needs to figure out the coding.


You assume people won't warp off when they see someone on d-scan within 1 AU if they only intend on farming. If you can keep making LP out of not fighting, people will min/max it. That is why I want them to fix the issue, not apply a plaster on the current crack while it just start cracking elsewhere. Timer rollback and the intel tool won't force fight per say tho. Plexers who only want to farm LP out of plexing will still only run plex and run away from fights.

As long as the reward is not tied to ship exploding, ship explosion won't be the thing the farmer look for because it easyer to farm somethign that don't require explosion by not making explosions.

As long as killing your own alt for plex pool bonused LP payout can't turn a profit, I don't care if you explode your alt ship, you are losing the ISK war against yourself. Loopholes for market shenanigans might need to be closed but it's the only direction to go if you want explosions everywhere.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#87 - 2014-08-07 18:18:21 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Cearain wrote:


As for the second paragraph I am not opposed to something like that. But already people get lp for kills of enemy militia directly. People killng alts in the other militia is generally the concern. Also missions already tends to dwarf the lp gains from plexing.


I really think that if they did the rollbacks and gave good intel on where timers are being run you would generally get 1-2 pvp fights per plex captured. Maybe even 3-4 pvp fights per plex captured. It would be a pvp nirvana - ccp just needs to figure out the coding.


You assume people won't warp off when they see someone on d-scan within 1 AU if they only intend on farming. If you can keep making LP out of not fighting, people will min/max it. That is why I want them to fix the issue, not apply a plaster on the current crack while it just start cracking elsewhere. Timer rollback and the intel tool won't force fight per say tho. Plexers who only want to farm LP out of plexing will still only run plex and run away from fights.

As long as the reward is not tied to ship exploding, ship explosion won't be the thing the farmer look for because it easyer to farm somethign that don't require explosion by not making explosions.

As long as killing your own alt for plex pool bonused LP payout can't turn a profit, I don't care if you explode your alt ship, you are losing the ISK war against yourself. Loopholes for market shenanigans might need to be closed but it's the only direction to go if you want explosions everywhere.



Right now the only reason people can make an impact doing plexes and running from all the fights is because if someone comes they can just warp off a system or 2 and start a new plex where no one will even know where they are. Then when they are done they can return to the plex they ran and pick up where they left off. If ccp gave us intel on where plexes were being run combined with a timer rollback, then 5-7 pvp pilots would be able to keep all the rabbit plexers at bay on an entire front. Rabbit plexers would find they can not finish a plex unless they want to fight and so would start fitting their ships to fight or move on to something else.

The inability to hide and seek rabbit plex would be a sea change for the occupancy war. CCP just needs to figure out the code for this and fw plexing will change forever.

CCP claims they are already pushing the envelope as far as lp per kill to the point where any more might lead to people profiting from killing their alts.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Tear Jar
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#88 - 2014-08-07 19:59:23 UTC
Jaime Gomes wrote:
Hello everyone.

I was a FW pilot for about 6 months and i returned to Black Rise after i joined Waffles. Since i left, many welcome changes were added: the range between the beacon and the button was decreased and inability to use cloaking devices in proximity to it (although debatable since it was fun to trap people and....... you can imagine) are such examples.

However i believe the most important change was not implemented or even addressed: stabbed ships.

It is known that when you dscan a plex the likelihood of that small t1 frigate being stabbed is pretty high and most cases it is confirmed when you point the thing and slips trough your fingers.

It is indeed frustrating but the worst are the hours wasted(sometimes per day) trying to find a 1v1 or even a 1v2 and in the end you get 0. Since i got back i also noticed a rise in small gang fleets of 4 and 5 pilots where all of them are fitted with stabbs (including destroyers).

However lets see this from a "carebears" perspective:

Many players, during the week, do missions/mine and/or trade in HS but at weekends they go alone or with friends to fw areas were they know they have the possibility of a fight. They pay for a couple ships, modules, ammo and they are set to go in search for epic loot. They are prepared to go cgc, lose sec status and even get some kill rights against them.

Conclusion: stabbed ships do not produce any content to the game and in the end the only thing they cause is people to log off or simply stay away from activities that otherwise should be very fun to do alone or with other players.

Either way bla bla bla bla TL/DR cry me a river:


Possible solutions:

1. Remove stabbs from the game - although even I am not to kind of the idea since its fundamental to many pilots living in losec to restock their armory and markets. That would limit how you would do it and incite to a certain degree more gate camping.

2. Do not allow a pilot to go into a plex with stabbs fitted and/or with the said module in the cargohold.

Thanks for the attention. Feel free to leave a comment.


Maybe we just need a better way to broadcast that we have warp stabilizers. That way people will stop trying to bother me while I farm plex.
JAF Anders
Adenosine Inhibition
#89 - 2014-08-07 20:05:29 UTC
I'd like it if 'stabs had a better tradeoff. At the moment, I don't think that the current drawbacks of warp core stabilizers are of much of a detriment to those using them.

I'd much rather see a decrease in the acceleration to warp or a signature radius bloom rather than a scan resolution penalty.

The pursuit of excellence and stabbed plexing alts.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#90 - 2014-08-07 20:28:39 UTC
JAF Anders wrote:
I'd like it if 'stabs had a better tradeoff. At the moment, I don't think that the current drawbacks of warp core stabilizers are of much of a detriment to those using them.

I'd much rather see a decrease in the acceleration to warp or a signature radius bloom rather than a scan resolution penalty.



I think warp core stabs are used legitimately to avoid getting caught by gate camps. This change would likely make them less effective against gate camps (where multiple people are trying to point and blap you at once) while not really making them less effective when used in plexes where its usually only one player.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#91 - 2014-08-07 20:49:52 UTC
You just need to decide what your goal is. Stopping them from making isk how they want is pretty much not your business. You can fit to catch them, and if they really are unfit except for stabilizers you will kill them. If killing soft spot targets is what you enjoy, go and do. No need to make it easier on you. Who is more risk adverse, the guy making his isk by dangling his unfit ship in space depending on you being unwilling to fit to catch him to live, or the guy who will only engage unfit ships and can't be bothered to risk himself by playing mouse in a combat ship?

If you are looking to PvP, fit your ship for combat. Soon enough someone just like you who is hunting plexers will be along, and they won't have stabilizers on their ship either, and PvP combat will ensue ending in an explosion.

Meanwhile you make the same isk as the rabbit plexer, so it's win-win. You either got the fight you were looking for, or you made some easy isk.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#92 - 2014-08-07 21:30:04 UTC
Mike Voidstar

I agree that you need to decide on your goal. The problem I have with the current mechanics is that if your goal is to win as much of the occupancy war as you can for your faction, then putting alts in stabbed ships is the best way to do it.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#93 - 2014-08-07 21:41:45 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Mike Voidstar

I agree that you need to decide on your goal. The problem I have with the current mechanics is that if your goal is to win as much of the occupancy war as you can for your faction, then putting alts in stabbed ships is the best way to do it.

This statement is 100% false. The best way is to put your alt into an unfit ship and forget about him. Getting podded by neutrals only helps since you can sell the kill rights for enough isk to get a new JF full of untanked hulls from Jita. If you have stabs, then there's no way to make isk off of kill rights, and you actually have to pay attention to your alt.

Amateurs!

How can one stop these unfit deplexing alts from ruining this game? Undock and attack the system they are plexing. I know... the HORROR!! You might even need 3-4 FRIENDS to have enough coverage of the system to flip the system to your side.

inb4 typical response:
FRIENDS!?!! WHY SHOULD I NEED FRIENDS IN AN MMOG? ESPECIALLY WHEN I'M TRYING TO CAPTURE AN ENTIRE SOLAR SYSTEM ON MY OWN! THIS GAME IS SOOO UNBALANCED!! MY EVELIFE WAS RUINED DUE TO THESE FAILED MECHANICS!
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#94 - 2014-08-07 22:23:45 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Mike Voidstar

I agree that you need to decide on your goal. The problem I have with the current mechanics is that if your goal is to win as much of the occupancy war as you can for your faction, then putting alts in stabbed ships is the best way to do it.


I fail to see a problem. Evasion works, nothing to see here.

If your goal is best accomplished that way, then go and do.

This is like complaining that the best way to use a screw is with a screwdriver when you would rather just hammer it in. You can, but it won't be as effective and the results are likely not what you intended.

I agree, it's stupid. If these are military installations then anyone in the militia they are attached to should not have to scan them, they should be available in the space menu that has local waypoints, asteroids, planets and stations. Some way of knowing which are under attack should be there as well, maybe highlight them in that window.

But that they should not be able to fit stabilizers is just as stupid. Not every fight need be based on tank vs. Dps.
Commander Siverai Arcetura
Cladeistic Tendancies
#95 - 2014-08-08 01:19:49 UTC
Please keep stabs, I love the tears when the full stab itty 5 undocks, gets bumped and cant warp off becuase my hictor is on grid
>:D
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#96 - 2014-08-08 02:39:36 UTC
Mike Voidstar wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Mike Voidstar

I agree that you need to decide on your goal. The problem I have with the current mechanics is that if your goal is to win as much of the occupancy war as you can for your faction, then putting alts in stabbed ships is the best way to do it.


I fail to see a problem. Evasion works, nothing to see here.

If your goal is best accomplished that way, then go and do.

This is like complaining that the best way to use a screw is with a screwdriver when you would rather just hammer it in. You can, but it won't be as effective and the results are likely not what you intended.

I agree, it's stupid. If these are military installations then anyone in the militia they are attached to should not have to scan them, they should be available in the space menu that has local waypoints, asteroids, planets and stations. Some way of knowing which are under attack should be there as well, maybe highlight them in that window.

But that they should not be able to fit stabilizers is just as stupid. Not every fight need be based on tank vs. Dps.



I think we agree more than we disagree. I do not blame players for playing the game as ccp designed it, even if the design is misguided.

We just had a campaign announced on the forums and fairly well known called "burn huola." Pvpers from all 4 factions came. But we were lucky to get 100 pilots from each side to show up. Total pilots showing up in fw was less than 1000 per side. Total active pilots in Faction war..... 20,000!

Its a pve mechanic. CCP still needs to give us the intel and timer rollbacks. At that point its a different game. It becomes a pvp game.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#97 - 2014-08-08 03:41:34 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Mike Voidstar wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Mike Voidstar

I agree that you need to decide on your goal. The problem I have with the current mechanics is that if your goal is to win as much of the occupancy war as you can for your faction, then putting alts in stabbed ships is the best way to do it.


I fail to see a problem. Evasion works, nothing to see here.

If your goal is best accomplished that way, then go and do.

This is like complaining that the best way to use a screw is with a screwdriver when you would rather just hammer it in. You can, but it won't be as effective and the results are likely not what you intended.

I agree, it's stupid. If these are military installations then anyone in the militia they are attached to should not have to scan them, they should be available in the space menu that has local waypoints, asteroids, planets and stations. Some way of knowing which are under attack should be there as well, maybe highlight them in that window.

But that they should not be able to fit stabilizers is just as stupid. Not every fight need be based on tank vs. Dps.



I think we agree more than we disagree. I do not blame players for playing the game as ccp designed it, even if the design is misguided.

We just had a campaign announced on the forums and fairly well known called "burn huola." Pvpers from all 4 factions came. But we were lucky to get 100 pilots from each side to show up. Total pilots showing up in fw was less than 1000 per side. Total active pilots in Faction war..... 20,000!

Its a pve mechanic. CCP still needs to give us the intel and timer rollbacks. At that point its a different game. It becomes a pvp game.



Yes, but why should it matter?

I know there is this impression that EVE is all about PvP, but the truth is that there are more interested in the pretty lights and playing a game than being hunted, scammed, and harrased.

I am happy to see FW become more of a PvE thing and that it has evolved to frustrate the living he'll out of the more predatory segment of the playerbase. It's about time a low cost alternative PvE where the pilots don't care about their cheap ships became available. The shoe is on the other foot, usually it's the PvE guy in an expensive ship being killed by some jackwagon in a cheap destroyer-- and somehow it's their own fault despite the many ways PvE is handicapped to specialized PvP fits.

Regardless, rules may change but there is no reason for it. Fit to hunt your prey. If you are looking for a fight, the guy with 3 or 4 stabs isn't it. If you are looking for easy kills then your ship can easily afford the sacrifices needed to fit the extra points to catch them. If you are looking to defend your systems from those attacks hire a dedicated scanner and just patrol for it... Even if you don't catch them you will run them off if you are constantly dropping in on them. Hell, if the same guy can keep finding my missions all weekend in a high sec hub with 70+ people running missions it should be a snap to do the same thing in the arid wasteland of lowsec.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#98 - 2014-08-08 04:25:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Zan Shiro
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Mike Voidstar

I agree that you need to decide on your goal. The problem I have with the current mechanics is that if your goal is to win as much of the occupancy war as you can for your faction, then putting alts in stabbed ships is the best way to do it.

This statement is 100% false. The best way is to put your alt into an unfit ship and forget about him. Getting podded by neutrals only helps since you can sell the kill rights for enough isk to get a new JF full of untanked hulls from Jita. If you have stabs, then there's no way to make isk off of kill rights, and you actually have to pay attention to your alt.

Amateurs!

How can one stop these unfit deplexing alts from ruining this game? Undock and attack the system they are plexing. I know... the HORROR!! You might even need 3-4 FRIENDS to have enough coverage of the system to flip the system to your side.

inb4 typical response:
FRIENDS!?!! WHY SHOULD I NEED FRIENDS IN AN MMOG? ESPECIALLY WHEN I'M TRYING TO CAPTURE AN ENTIRE SOLAR SYSTEM ON MY OWN! THIS GAME IS SOOO UNBALANCED!! MY EVELIFE WAS RUINED DUE TO THESE FAILED MECHANICS!





Why I wonder why they even sign up for fw sometimes. Its organized pvp. Implies some team effort. If they wanted more casual half assed lone wolf pvp not doing piracy or gank in empire RvB says hi. That as I see it is about casual and do your own thing as you make it. Want your team play, be a motivator in the side you are on. Want to be lone wolf....undock and pick off single other color members you find and blow off the chat chatter if an anti social type.


Also have said in the past for these peeps welcome to eve pvp. It gets worse. Null ratters who safe up, playing hide and seek games in a wh (who wll also safe up). Nullify t3, carrier ratters with oh crap cyno on standby....etc. Its eve pvp, you have to want the kill more than they want to not be killed. And besides the want...you need to bring the tools and people to make it happen.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#99 - 2014-08-08 14:28:08 UTC
Zan Shiro wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Mike Voidstar

I agree that you need to decide on your goal. The problem I have with the current mechanics is that if your goal is to win as much of the occupancy war as you can for your faction, then putting alts in stabbed ships is the best way to do it.

This statement is 100% false. The best way is to put your alt into an unfit ship and forget about him. Getting podded by neutrals only helps since you can sell the kill rights for enough isk to get a new JF full of untanked hulls from Jita. If you have stabs, then there's no way to make isk off of kill rights, and you actually have to pay attention to your alt.

Amateurs!

How can one stop these unfit deplexing alts from ruining this game? Undock and attack the system they are plexing. I know... the HORROR!! You might even need 3-4 FRIENDS to have enough coverage of the system to flip the system to your side.

inb4 typical response:
FRIENDS!?!! WHY SHOULD I NEED FRIENDS IN AN MMOG? ESPECIALLY WHEN I'M TRYING TO CAPTURE AN ENTIRE SOLAR SYSTEM ON MY OWN! THIS GAME IS SOOO UNBALANCED!! MY EVELIFE WAS RUINED DUE TO THESE FAILED MECHANICS!





Why I wonder why they even sign up for fw sometimes. Its organized pvp. Implies some team effort. If they wanted more casual half assed lone wolf pvp not doing piracy or gank in empire RvB says hi. That as I see it is about casual and do your own thing as you make it. Want your team play, be a motivator in the side you are on. Want to be lone wolf....undock and pick off single other color members you find and blow off the chat chatter if an anti social type.


Also have said in the past for these peeps welcome to eve pvp. It gets worse. Null ratters who safe up, playing hide and seek games in a wh (who wll also safe up). Nullify t3, carrier ratters with oh crap cyno on standby....etc. Its eve pvp, you have to want the kill more than they want to not be killed. And besides the want...you need to bring the tools and people to make it happen.



FW pvp is semi organized. But the occupancy war is mostly pve. By that I mean the vast majority of plexes are taken with nothing but a fight with npcs. Everybody in FW is on the same team to some extent. But if people want to blob a single system and call that pvp there is null sec. Some players especially in Gallente think fw is all about blobbing a single system to kick the enemy out. They basically agree that fw is sort of like null sec junior. But many others in fw want fw pvp to be different than blobbing a system like they do in null sec. They want constant fighting spread throughout the warzone. This would provide the quality small and medium pvp platform that eve sorely lacks.

The lack of this platform is so sorely missed that that players in RVB actually tried to fill that gap without the devs help. The problem with rvb is that it is too artificial. Its like playing pick up basketball games with your friends as opposed to the more real games for a team in a league. It's like a step up from sisi. You are just fighting to fight with no context at all.

Those who set up RvB did a great job and I commend them. I did rvb myself and had allot of fun. So I am not diminishing what the players did based on what they can do. And if you haven't tried it I highly recommend it. But those who set it up are not the devs. They do not have the tools the devs have. The devs have the power to change the actual mechanics of the game and so should be able to do a better job. I hope the devs look at the actions of the players in creating rvb and try to understand the message. What where they trying to accomplish by creating that?

XG's answer to d-plexers in a empty frigate is to take a system. But then what? People will come and hide and seek o-plex it and then what do you do? Get lots of alts yourself in stabbed frigates and deplex like the gallente do? I am sorry but I think FW can and should be much better than that. FW shouldn't be about who can field the most alts, it should be about who is better at pvp throughout the warzone. The timer rollbacks and better intel about where plexes are being taken would make fw what it should be.

And yes fw should be something for more casual players. If eve is such a big part of your life there is null sec.

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
Fourteen Maken
Karma and Causality
#100 - 2014-08-08 15:56:21 UTC
Just go into an empty plex in a fast agile frigate, kill rat, move 30km away from the beacon, align to safe spot, stop. right click in space hold your mouse over warp to button and sit there watching overview... no need to even bother with dscan or warp core stabs or any of that just click the mouse when someone comes in and nothing can catch you. you can even troll them and burn away in alignment to decide if you want to take the fight or not by watching their speed and guessing at their fit.

Stabs are sometimes useful for getting through gate camps. but fk gate camps.