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Multi Boxing for Unfair game play is bannable. Close Thread please

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E-2C Hawkeye
HOW to PEG SAFETY
#81 - 2014-08-07 17:47:53 UTC
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
While I sympathize and happen to think that tools like isboxer should be banned, CCP does not feel the same way and draw a clear distinction between multiboxing and botting. Your friend was botting, which is a no-no. Get isboxer, get fleet of miners, mine all you like and only visit your computer every 15min or so to do stuff. Its sickening, but its the rules. Thankfully there is also the New Order of Hisec, and their own set of rules to bring balance to hisec mining.


You may not use your own or any third-party software, macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game.

written clear as day. this was copied and past from eve website http://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula/


Since isboxer on its own isn't using macros or stored rapid keystrokes, CCP has said it is a-ok. Isboxer does send your input to multiple windows at a time, but since it is you doing it, they don't have a problem with it. Since it is their rules governing your behavior, they are free to make exceptions whenever they like.

IS boxer is third party software used to manipulate the game. No getting around it other than CCP allows it. Fact is they benefit from the subs so they choose to allow it.

Eve is the property of CCP. Vote with your feet and or wallet if you don’t agree with their hypocrisy.
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#82 - 2014-08-07 17:48:47 UTC
Barzai Mekhar wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
Barzai Mekhar wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:

This is a little bit confusing. I Bold some keywords that were written by GM Lelouch. Now the question remains. Do you need to be on different computers when Multi boxing as stated before. Also the rules need to be rewritten to clarify that more clearly to sum up any confusions and to stop reoccurring.


Well, obviously multiboxing is only allowed when done excatly the way described, using MULTIPLE computer with MULTIPLE screens. Multiple computers with a single screen are a bannable offence. This is very clear from the context, while phrases like

"Lastly, multiboxing is allowed, and programs designed for multiboxing in mind which allow a player to manually issue the same command to multiple game clients at the same time are allowed."

are very vague and easily misinterpreted.


Problem is players are not using MULTI computers and are still playing the game which is the reason of this post. rules need to be the same as stated in OP. If you are going to ban bot-ing then players need to be ban for same computer multi boxing. 90% of multi boxers are doing is buying another screen or having one screen and logging into all 10 accounts. the program issues the same command to all 9 account while he controls one account which is breaking there rules. That isnt fair to others that are getting banned


It always makes me happy when people get exactly what I'm saying.

Synergy was a specific example. <- sorry bro but it was an example of a Multi boxing program. They just used that one since it was the most popular

A general ruling not specifying the need for multiple computers was also given.

General ruling > specific example.
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#83 - 2014-08-07 17:50:48 UTC
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:
While I sympathize and happen to think that tools like isboxer should be banned, CCP does not feel the same way and draw a clear distinction between multiboxing and botting. Your friend was botting, which is a no-no. Get isboxer, get fleet of miners, mine all you like and only visit your computer every 15min or so to do stuff. Its sickening, but its the rules. Thankfully there is also the New Order of Hisec, and their own set of rules to bring balance to hisec mining.


You may not use your own or any third-party software, macros or other stored rapid keystrokes or other patterns of play that facilitate acquisition of items, currency, objects, character attributes, rank or status at an accelerated rate when compared with ordinary Game play. You may not rewrite or modify the user interface or otherwise manipulate data in any way to acquire items, currency, objects, character attributes or beneficial actions not actually acquired or achieved in the Game.

written clear as day. this was copied and past from eve website http://community.eveonline.com/support/policies/eve-eula/


Since isboxer on its own isn't using macros or stored rapid keystrokes, CCP has said it is a-ok. Isboxer does send your input to multiple windows at a time, but since it is you doing it, they don't have a problem with it. Since it is their rules governing your behavior, they are free to make exceptions whenever they like.

IS boxer is third party software used to manipulate the game. No getting around it other than CCP allows it. Fact is they benefit from the subs so they choose to allow it.

Eve is the property of CCP. Vote with your feet and or wallet if you don’t agree with their hypocrisy.


Please Read OP. It contains CCP response and what they allow and dont allow.
xalongskam
Star Holdings
#84 - 2014-08-07 17:50:56 UTC
O2 jayjay wrote:
Tippia wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
Please respond with better arguments. I have bold and underline the most important part of that statement and you completely ignored it.
You mean the part that proves you wrong? The part where it clearly and unambiguously says “Lastly, multiboxing is allowed”?

Yeah. You completely ignored that one. So let's make it clear:

Multiboxing is allowed.

This has always been their policy and it remains their policy. You will never find them saying anything else unless you massively mangle what they say by wilfully misquoting and misinterpreting those official statements.

Quote:
that is an old Multi boxing program
…which is allowed since…


…wait for it…

“Lastly, multiboxing is allowed”.


It seems you dont understand the part where you have to use different computers. I got the fact that Multi boxing is allowed on different computer but as many other are posting you can log in on the same computer and multi box is acceptable. which in all actuality isnt. As posted earlier, A GM said as long as different computer were used, CCP didnt have a problem with Multi boxers. I will update the OP to clearly explain this.




Dude, use some common sense.
1. The post we are discussing was said to be OUTDATED.
2. Why would CCP care how many computers you use? It does not affect their game in any way. You are paying them to be able to play. They don't care how much you pay for your electricity or how often you go to your local computer store to buy a new machine.

You are obviously just trying to find a point that you can make, since the original point of your thread was already disproven.

On the other hand, if your friend was banned for using botting software, that's a whole different thing. Just compare it to what I said above:
1. The rule that botting is forbidden is NOT OUTDATED.
2. Botting affects the game very much by injecting ISK and items into the economy that otherwise wouldn't be there.




In the end your call that "every rule breaker should be banned" is nonsense. This is because
1. Multiboxing on 1 computer is no break of a rule, once more, this post is said to be OUTDATED.
2. Botting with let's say 5 accounts is as bad as for example breaking rule 18 (by copy-pasting a petition for example) and therefore you should be permabanned in both cases right? I believe that's also why theft and murder are punished the same way in rl, because in both cases you are "breaking the rules", OH WAIT ...

Also rule 26: We reserve the right to ban any user from the game without refund or compensation.

Deal with it.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#85 - 2014-08-07 17:52:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:
IS boxer is third party software used to manipulate the game. No getting around it other than CCP allows it.
There's also no getting around the fact that there's nothing to suggest that they would disallow it.
There is no rule against using third-party software to manipulate the game, after all (unless you only mean “manipulate” in the sense of “modify”, but there's a specific rule for that and it doesn't care one whit about third-party software anyway).

Quote:
Vote with your feet and or wallet if you don’t agree with their hypocrisy.
Tbh, the only hypocrisy here is the OP's being upset over his friend being banned for legitimate reasons and wanting others to suffer the same fate without having broken any rules.
vOv
Yarda Black
The Black Redemption
#86 - 2014-08-07 17:56:30 UTC
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#87 - 2014-08-07 17:56:49 UTC  |  Edited by: De'Veldrin
Tippia wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tippia, can i have this ones femur when your done?
I'm making a cane and i think it would suite for a handle.

You can have the whole thing. Just boil it good and apply some lye or something afterwards because I think there might be something hideously wrong with it.


@ Tippia: Sadly, you cannot fix stupid.

@ the OP: While it does suck that ... ahem your uh "friend" got banned - actually, you know what? It doesn't. Botting is not and never has been allowed by CCP. Good on them for banning "your friend". Personally, I hope it was a perma ban for multiple infractions.

That said, CCP has repeatedly, clearly, and decisively said that Multi-boxing is allowed. ISBoxer is allowed to be used to manage those multi-boxing sessions, so long as they do not automate game play (which is what bots do, for the record).

Please, give in to your outrage over this and unsubscribe - the game will be better off, and no one here will miss you.

Reported for discussing moderation, bans, and for being a dumb ass repetitive thread on a topic that has been discussed to ******* death.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#88 - 2014-08-07 17:59:34 UTC
xalongskam wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
Tippia wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
Please respond with better arguments. I have bold and underline the most important part of that statement and you completely ignored it.
You mean the part that proves you wrong? The part where it clearly and unambiguously says “Lastly, multiboxing is allowed”?

Yeah. You completely ignored that one. So let's make it clear:

Multiboxing is allowed.

This has always been their policy and it remains their policy. You will never find them saying anything else unless you massively mangle what they say by wilfully misquoting and misinterpreting those official statements.

Quote:
that is an old Multi boxing program
…which is allowed since…


…wait for it…

“Lastly, multiboxing is allowed”.


It seems you dont understand the part where you have to use different computers. I got the fact that Multi boxing is allowed on different computer but as many other are posting you can log in on the same computer and multi box is acceptable. which in all actuality isnt. As posted earlier, A GM said as long as different computer were used, CCP didnt have a problem with Multi boxers. I will update the OP to clearly explain this.




Dude, use some common sense.
1. The post we are discussing was said to be OUTDATED.
2. Why would CCP care how many computers you use? It does not affect their game in any way. You are paying them to be able to play. They don't care how much you pay for your electricity or how often you go to your local computer store to buy a new machine.

You are obviously just trying to find a point that you can make, since the original point of your thread was already disproven.

On the other hand, if your friend was banned for using botting software, that's a whole different thing. Just compare it to what I said above:
1. The rule that botting is forbidden is NOT OUTDATED.
2. Botting affects the game very much by injecting ISK and items into the economy that otherwise wouldn't be there.




In the end your call that "every rule breaker should be banned" is nonsense. This is because
1. Multiboxing on 1 computer is no break of a rule, once more, this post is said to be OUTDATED.
2. Botting with let's say 5 accounts is as bad as for example breaking rule 18 (by copy-pasting a petition for example) and therefore you should be permabanned in both cases right? I believe that's also why theft and murder are punished the same way in rl, because in both cases you are "breaking the rules", OH WAIT ...

Also rule 26: We reserve the right to ban any user from the game without refund or compensation.

Deal with it.


Yes i saw the part where it said that it was out dated. I have stated that that part confused me but deleted it from the OP. Also I didnt copy and paste a pention and this isnt a pention. this is a post in the General discussion which I am making very valid points. Another thing if your post about CCP not caring about Multi boxing because they make isk (which isnt the case since players will multi box incursions by themselves and plex all accounts. then why the perma ban for a player botting? wouldnt a 30 day ban get the point across? and if he was mining then take away all the ore that player mined with the 30 day ban. perma ban = no more $$ for CCP from that sucriber which makes less profit. If that is outdated then that means the EUAL is still in effect which you cannot use a program that will manipulate currency/ game play/ ect.
Bloody Slave
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#89 - 2014-08-07 17:59:41 UTC
Tippia wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
It seems you dont understand the part where you have to use different computers.
It seems you don't understand that there is no part. It doesn't exist. It's something you've dreamt up.
At no point is anything of the kind said. The number of computers does not matter.


Quote:
I got the fact that Multi boxing is allowed
No, you didn't, or you wouldn't be off on this hallucination-born tangent of yours where the number of computers is in any way relevant to the proceedings.

Quote:
A GM said as long as different computer were using CCP didnt have a problem with Multi boxers.
Nope. That is not what the GM said. It is something you've made up because your ignorant claims were so thoroughly demolished upon their first contact with reality and you are desperate to claw out some tiny shred of a morsel that could — at least at cursory glance — be misinterpreted as you being a teeeeensy bit right about somehting.

None of that will happen.


Tippia, you are not making any sense for him/her.

This is, clearly, a problem with:

1) Language;

2) Age;

3) Disability; or

4) all of the above.

Just report for discussing ban and move on.

If your balls are hurt and bleeding don't sit in a pool full of piranhas (note to myself: don't complain in GD)
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#90 - 2014-08-07 18:02:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Since the OP has edited the OP to add in even more blatant lies, I suppose it's best to address those head on.
O2 jayjay wrote:
To stop any confusion, Multi boxing on seperate computers is allowed according to GM Lelouch but on the same computer isn't.
Wrong. You know that it's not allowed to misrepresent CCP officials right?
That is not what GM Lelouch said at all, and you know it. Instead, it is you incorrectly reinterpreting a positive statement into a negation that was never even remotely suggested.

Quote:
Please dont post about CCP allowing Multi boxing on the same computer.
Why not? Because it would prove you wrong and shatter your fantasy world?

The fact remains: multiboxing is allowed. The number of computers used is not a factor. You are lying about what a GM has said in an official capacity, and this can end as badly for you as it did for your friend. You going up in flames over something that idiotic just because your buddy was rightfully banned for botting is not a good way to go.

Accept the fact that you are wrong and let it rest.
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#91 - 2014-08-07 18:03:04 UTC
De'Veldrin wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tippia, can i have this ones femur when your done?
I'm making a cane and i think it would suite for a handle.

You can have the whole thing. Just boil it good and apply some lye or something afterwards because I think there might be something hideously wrong with it.


@ Tippia: Sadly, you cannot fix stupid.

@ the OP: While it does suck that ... ahem your uh "friend" got banned - actually, you know what? It doesn't. Botting is not and never has been allowed by CCP. Good on them for banning "your friend". Personally, I hope it was a perma ban for multiple infractions.

That said, CCP has repeatedly, clearly, and decisively said that Multi-boxing is allowed. ISBoxer is allowed to be used to manage those multi-boxing sessions, so long as they do not automate game play (which is what bots do, for the record).

Please, give in to your outrage over this and unsubscribe - the game will be better off, and no one here will miss you.

Reported for discussing moderation, bans, and for being a dumb ass repetitive thread on a topic that has been discussed to ******* death.


Report this post all you want but you also broken several Forum rules. Dont worry i am a nice person and instead of reporting you for rude insulting comments i will keep pushing for a rewrite of rules and my friend to get unbanned. Also i never said he was bot-ting and was accused of bot-ing and yes he is perma ban.
Valeria Ghost
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#92 - 2014-08-07 18:03:22 UTC
Quote:
It does not say “you may only install a single copy on, and access the system from, a single computer [for each account]”. Since they've given me the right to download and install, they would have to explicitly exclude the right to do it multiple times under certain circumstances, and they simply don't. The closest thing is the bit at the end, where each install is only really meant to be used with one account, but again, that just means you can use multiple installs (and you will have all the licenses required because otherwise you won't have enough accounts to use them all) on the same computer.


OP go back to the bottom of the first page, read the above paragraph. It clearly says there that you do not need multiple computers to play multiple accounts but that you would need multiple installs (but they can be on the same computer). and for all you know all multiboxers are using multiple installs.

now shut up, thanks.
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#93 - 2014-08-07 18:04:15 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Since the OP has edited the OP to add in even more blatant lies, I suppose it's best to address those head on.
O2 jayjay wrote:
To stop any confusion, Multi boxing on seperate computers is allowed according to GM Lelouch but on the same computer isn't.
Wrong. You know that it's not allowed to misrepresent CCP officials right?
That is not what GM Lelouch said at all, and you know it.

Quote:
Please dont post about CCP allowing Multi boxing on the same computer.
Why not? Because it would prove you wrong and shatter your fantasy world?

The fact remains: multiboxing is allowed. The number of computers used is not a factor. You are lying about what a GM has said in an official capacity, and this can end as badly for you as it did for your friend. You going up in flames over something that idiotic just because your buddy was rightfully banned for botting is not a good way to go.

Accept the fact that you are wrong and let it rest.


LOL you accuse me of changing the GM comments when i copied and past it along with the link in the OP. LMFAO okay bro
Barzai Mekhar
True Confusion
#94 - 2014-08-07 18:05:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Barzai Mekhar
O2 jayjay wrote:
Barzai Mekhar wrote:

Synergy was a specific example.

<- sorry bro but it was an example of a Multi boxing program. They just used that one since it was the most popular


Ugh. Normally, this is the point at which I'd start talking slowly, but my experience with typing slower has not been successful.

Your remark makes no sense as being a "specific" example and an "example of a Multi boxing program" are not mutually exclusive. Ok, as "specific" seems to confuse you, "mutually exclusive" is probably not a good choice either. Uhm.

Synergy ok.
Other multiboxing tools without automat... sorry, that do not run by them selfes also ok.
You can run 5 accounts on one machine, on five machines, or on 5 virtual machines that are distributed over 2 hardware boxes.
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#95 - 2014-08-07 18:05:17 UTC
Valeria Ghost wrote:
Quote:
It does not say “you may only install a single copy on, and access the system from, a single computer [for each account]”. Since they've given me the right to download and install, they would have to explicitly exclude the right to do it multiple times under certain circumstances, and they simply don't. The closest thing is the bit at the end, where each install is only really meant to be used with one account, but again, that just means you can use multiple installs (and you will have all the licenses required because otherwise you won't have enough accounts to use them all) on the same computer.


OP go back to the bottom of the first page, read the above paragraph. It clearly says there that you do not need multiple computers to play multiple accounts but that you would need multiple installs (but they can be on the same computer). and for all you know all multiboxers are using multiple installs.

now shut up, thanks.


going back to the first page to read this so call comment. BRB
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#96 - 2014-08-07 18:05:30 UTC
In the original Greek "Tippia" means "patient, almost to a fault".

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#97 - 2014-08-07 18:07:21 UTC
O2 jayjay wrote:

Report this post all you want but you also broken several Forum rules. Dont worry i am a nice person and instead of reporting you for rude insulting comments ..


Jump, if you're feeling froggy. Go on, click that "Report" button. CLICK IT!!!

At least have the courage of your convictions.

But trust me, you have not yet seen me be rude or insulting. Thus far, all I have been is honest.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#98 - 2014-08-07 18:07:27 UTC
O2 jayjay wrote:
LOL you accuse me of changing the GM comments when i copied and past it along with the link in the OP.

No. I accuse you of lying when you say that GM comments contain restrictions that are not there.

The whole idea that you are not allowed to use a single computer is something you made up. By claiming that a GM said it, and then providing a quote where nothing of the kind is said, means you are misrepresenting a CCP official, and that is a very very very very bad thing to do.
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#99 - 2014-08-07 18:15:30 UTC
Yarda Black wrote:
10 seconds on the internet and over 2 years old:

http://joethemultiboxer.com/2012/04/politics-and-multiboxing-in-eve-online/


This did nothing but support my argument. thank you

the GM clearly says he wouldn't say its okay but Certain GM will ban?! That didn't clear anything up and make it a grey area. more of a luck area. it would depend on what GM you got LOL
O2 jayjay
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#100 - 2014-08-07 18:17:39 UTC
Tippia wrote:
O2 jayjay wrote:
LOL you accuse me of changing the GM comments when i copied and past it along with the link in the OP.

No. I accuse you of lying when you say that GM comments contain restrictions that are not there.

The whole idea that you are not allowed to use a single computer is something you made up. By claiming that a GM said it, and then providing a quote where nothing of the kind is said, means you are misrepresenting a CCP official, and that is a very very very very bad thing to do.


its in the OP post bro. click the link and look for yourself