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Idea to stop all (most) botting
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KHALEES1
Iron Warriors Legion
Ferrata Victrix
#1 - 2011-12-07 18:16:28 UTC
I've been thinking about the problem of botting recently and come up with an idea. You know those "Captcha" things you get on websites now to stop bots creating accounts? WELL:

Have every pilot who's logged in challenged with a 3-digit numerical "Captcha" code every 3 hours. If the code is not entered within 10 minutes, the client logs off and will not be allowed to log back into the character selection screen again without entering a "Captcha" code.

You could attach rules to this to prevent accidents, such as it will not challenge a player who is being targetted by NPC's (to prevent botters/mission runners getting killed) and it will not challenge a player while it is on-grid with other active ships. This should minimize the inconvenience to honest players but effectively render bots useless.

There is still the problem of market-manipulation bots that could just be undocked and do their manipulation from say the Jita undock (where there will always be other player ships present) so it doesn't catch them, but perhaps something else could be programmed in to stop them.

What do you all think?

RMT'ing is killing the game and just making the power-blocs ever more powerful, and it needs to stop. Given the absolute click-fest that playing Eve is anyway, I for one would not mind having to enter a 3-digit code every three hours to see it stopped.
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2011-12-07 18:23:35 UTC
This has been discussed to death and is a terribad idea for two reasons:

1. You can program a bot to answer the captchas. There's reams of information on programming bots around capchas on the intertubes.
2. This would irritate players more than the current botting does. It's like cutting off your head because you need a hair cut.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
KHALEES1
Iron Warriors Legion
Ferrata Victrix
#3 - 2011-12-07 18:58:52 UTC
De'Veldrin wrote:
This has been discussed to death and is a terribad idea for two reasons:

1. You can program a bot to answer the captchas. There's reams of information on programming bots around capchas on the intertubes.
2. This would irritate players more than the current botting does. It's like cutting off your head because you need a hair cut.


Okay :(
Jicc
Happy fragles
#4 - 2011-12-07 19:13:01 UTC
This terrifies me because not only people not protesting about captcha in web pages but they willingly want to import it to games. I simply dont belive what i read.
And to be honest, i would use bot just for this single reason to not write that damn captcha.
Migeta
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2011-12-07 20:13:01 UTC
the best way is to use a humen gm player whos inmortal and he manualy bans bots...
Schnoo
The Schnoo
#6 - 2011-12-07 20:31:05 UTC
Only known solution (or attempt at that) is software like Warden http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warden_(software).
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#7 - 2011-12-07 20:48:54 UTC
step 1)
legalise botting by making it a ingame feature via scriptable drone ships. Drone ships are disposable, you don't get GCC when you shoot them but you loose sec status.

they are good for basic things like hauling or mining. However they are not as good as efficient as a player controlled ship.

step 2)
modify game mechanics to be less repeatable / predictable. All NPCs should get proper AI, not the joke what we have now + adapt to the situation.


if you play the X series you get an idea of a possible implementation - just make it fit into the eve universe

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
Jicc
Happy fragles
#8 - 2011-12-07 21:37:29 UTC
And that would be correct answer for this topic: dont waste time to fight bots, make game not as much repititive.
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#9 - 2011-12-07 22:00:06 UTC
At this point, bots can read those things better than I can.
X
Presidente Gallente
Best Kept Dunked
OnlyFleets.
#10 - 2011-12-07 22:50:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Presidente Gallente
Just imagine you are in the middle of a combat and EVE wants a captcha code. This idea is epic fail and will kill the game faster than bots do. It's quite similar to movie DVD's where you have to go through these stupid anti-piracy charts and commercials to tell you not to copy a DVD. Nice idea, because the one who bought the movie will be punished while the ones downloading the movie will never be harassed by this ****.
DHuncan
Long John Silver.
#11 - 2011-12-07 23:31:52 UTC
The idea of 'captcha' is actually good. Whats the haste of taking it down? It may need a little work but is good. What if instead time based 'captcha' the 'report boot' feature trigers the 'captcha'? This is gettin closer but still needs to be worked a little to prevent abuse and missuse. Consecuences for fake accusations perhaps?

What did you say about CODE?
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#12 - 2011-12-07 23:58:27 UTC
DHuncan wrote:
The idea of 'captcha' is actually good. Whats the haste of taking it down? It may need a little work but is good. What if instead time based 'captcha' the 'report boot' feature trigers the 'captcha'? This is gettin closer but still needs to be worked a little to prevent abuse and missuse. Consecuences for fake accusations perhaps?

Bots can read captchas fine. There is not a single captcha out there than a human can read and a bot can't.
Frolicking Fairy
Gladiators of Rage
Fraternity.
#13 - 2011-12-08 05:59:53 UTC
just look at the behavior of the toon, if you see them ratting for horu on end with no isgn of slowing, and dotn even get up to take a minute break sometime its most likely a bot, and if it does it for weeks on end guess what, its a bot. the only issue is coming up with the thresholds.
Jicc
Happy fragles
#14 - 2011-12-08 07:30:42 UTC
People should never be forced to proove that they are not camels. If company have problem with bots, thats they problem. Pushing it to user because they are too lazy or too greedy to do something by themselves is very vrong practice imo.
Rina Asanari
CitadeI
#15 - 2011-12-08 12:45:17 UTC
DHuncan wrote:
The idea of 'captcha' is actually good. Whats the haste of taking it down? It may need a little work but is good. What if instead time based 'captcha' the 'report boot' feature trigers the 'captcha'? This is gettin closer but still needs to be worked a little to prevent abuse and missuse. Consecuences for fake accusations perhaps?


I'd be waiting for the fleet fights where the first action of an attacker would be to summarily CAPTCHA the defenders, rendering them vulnerable just because their display and input is clobbered with the CAPTCHA dialog.
Teen Borg
Frozen Dart
#16 - 2011-12-08 13:35:35 UTC
for the love of God, no!
DHuncan
Long John Silver.
#17 - 2011-12-08 17:45:53 UTC
Rina Asanari wrote:
DHuncan wrote:
The idea of 'captcha' is actually good. Whats the haste of taking it down? It may need a little work but is good. What if instead time based 'captcha' the 'report boot' feature trigers the 'captcha'? This is gettin closer but still needs to be worked a little to prevent abuse and missuse. Consecuences for fake accusations perhaps?


I'd be waiting for the fleet fights where the first action of an attacker would be to summarily CAPTCHA the defenders, rendering them vulnerable just because their display and input is clobbered with the CAPTCHA dialog.



I sayd consecuences for fake accusations.

What did you say about CODE?
Yeep
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2011-12-08 18:28:28 UTC
DHuncan wrote:
Rina Asanari wrote:
DHuncan wrote:
The idea of 'captcha' is actually good. Whats the haste of taking it down? It may need a little work but is good. What if instead time based 'captcha' the 'report boot' feature trigers the 'captcha'? This is gettin closer but still needs to be worked a little to prevent abuse and missuse. Consecuences for fake accusations perhaps?


I'd be waiting for the fleet fights where the first action of an attacker would be to summarily CAPTCHA the defenders, rendering them vulnerable just because their display and input is clobbered with the CAPTCHA dialog.



I sayd consecuences for fake accusations.


If you can tell whats a fake accusation and what isn't (you can't) why not use that same method to just detect the bots in the first place?