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Deleting Sentries
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Paynus Maiassus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2014-07-28 16:50:38 UTC
In a recent thread about "what is your dream version of Eve" one of my entries was that sentry drones would just be deleted. After writing that I talked with a few friends and they generally said, you know, that's not a half bad idea. Well Mittens just commented that while he wasn't really serious about deleting super carriers, he actually might seriously consider deleting sentries or at least removing them from carriers.

So it seems like this idea is not just a Maiassus dream sheet, but actually something that others have considered as well and might actually do the game good. Therefore I am starting a thread on it to see other players' reactions. What are your thoughts on deleting sentry drones from Eve? Of course the associated skill would also be deleted and the SP returned. Anyone have feelings on this?
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#2 - 2014-07-28 16:56:02 UTC
definitely remove them from capitals ... maybe a slight damage nerf to sentries in general

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#3 - 2014-07-28 16:58:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Fer'isam K'ahn
-1 (at least for supcap)

Basically remove all long range weapons or none.

And didn't they get nerfed twice now ? Mine were.
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#4 - 2014-07-28 17:20:58 UTC
theres no need to delete them,
they may seem over powered, but their the only weapons system in the game that can be targeted and destroyed without needing to shoot the ship its self, making them very vulnerable to those who shoot them.

any time I see an Ishtar fleet pottering around the first thing I shoot is its drones. they usually either drop more, which in turn die, or they bail and I kill the drones anyways to stop the picking them back up.

drone boats generally don't have alternatives, once their out of drones, their generally a sitting brick waiting for the mortar

if you cannot figure out how to shoot drones, then you might wanna go back to using drakes
Rayzilla Zaraki
Yin Jian Enterprises
#5 - 2014-07-29 00:27:00 UTC
Can you show me on the doll where the Sentry Drone touched you?

Gate campers are just Carebears with anger issues.
Paynus Maiassus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2014-07-29 00:29:32 UTC
Rayzilla Zaraki wrote:
Can you show me on the doll where the Sentry Drone touched you?


Well, I guess you live under a rock.

It's not like people have been wondering about how to counter slowcats and wrecking balls or anything.
Vayn Baxtor
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2014-07-29 00:41:42 UTC
The game should be more about pewing upfront than just shooting from long range and running away the moment anything crosses the 99.9km mark. So somewhere, yeah, sentries would also be part of the things I'd want changed.

Quote:
Can you show me on the doll where the Sentry Drone touched you?


But if anything I could actually wish, I'd leave EVE as it is just for the sake of somebody who could invent new meme quotes. That one there is so frakking overused.

Using tablet, typoes are common and I'm not going to fix them all.

Falin Whalen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2014-07-29 01:27:21 UTC
I have to laugh at everybody. Initially when carriers were going to be re-balanced, CCP put forth the idea to have carriers not use drones along with dreads, just fighters, but everyone had a fit and CCP backed down. Now here we are later, only realizing now, how much foresight CCP had back then, while we try to figure out how to balance a wrecking ball fleet that can just trash everything in it's path and the only counter is "bring more suppers than them".

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 
Bullet Therapist
FT Cold Corporation
#9 - 2014-07-29 01:42:26 UTC
Vayn Baxtor wrote:
The game should be more about pewing upfront than just shooting from long range and running away the moment anything crosses the 99.9km mark. So somewhere, yeah, sentries would also be part of the things I'd want changed.

Quote:
Can you show me on the doll where the Sentry Drone touched you?


But if anything I could actually wish, I'd leave EVE as it is just for the sake of somebody who could invent new meme quotes. That one there is so frakking overused.


I agree that the current meta is a little too rangey-kitey, at least for my liking. I've always been a fan of melee bloodbaths Big smile. I think that changing carriers so that they can field only fighters and changing the bonuses of the Ishtar are probably in order at this point. I'd also love to see afterburners get a reduction to their mass penalty and short ranged weapons receive a reduction in CPU and powergrid costs Big smileBig smileBig smile but that's just wishful thinking.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#10 - 2014-07-29 01:49:48 UTC
Falin Whalen wrote:
I have to laugh at everybody. Initially when carriers were going to be re-balanced, CCP put forth the idea to have carriers not use drones along with dreads, just fighters, but everyone had a fit and CCP backed down. Now here we are later, only realizing now, how much foresight CCP had back then, while we try to figure out how to balance a wrecking ball fleet that can just trash everything in it's path and the only counter is "bring more suppers than them".



Problem is, fighters are awful.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#11 - 2014-07-29 01:57:13 UTC
Just make them require a role bonus to use them(similarly to cov ops cloaks), that Carriers and Cruisers will not have.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Sara Tosa
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#12 - 2014-07-29 07:33:31 UTC
Vayn Baxtor wrote:
The game should be more about pewing upfront than just shooting from long range and running away the moment anything crosses the 99.9km mark. So somewhere, yeah, sentries would also be part of the things I'd want changed.

so we remove engines?
Fer'isam K'ahn
SAS Veterinarians
#13 - 2014-07-29 08:46:07 UTC
Sara Tosa wrote:
so we remove engines?

Yes, this is one of those clever thought through threads and redneck suggestions like 'hit you head on the lamp hanging too low - cut either head or feet off until you fit under - problem solved - now let me get that axe for your '.
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#14 - 2014-07-29 09:35:08 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:
theres no need to delete them,
they may seem over powered, but their the only weapons system in the game that can be targeted and destroyed without needing to shoot the ship its self, making them very vulnerable to those who shoot them.

any time I see an Ishtar fleet pottering around the first thing I shoot is its drones. they usually either drop more, which in turn die, or they bail and I kill the drones anyways to stop the picking them back up.

drone boats generally don't have alternatives, once their out of drones, their generally a sitting brick waiting for the mortar

if you cannot figure out how to shoot drones, then you might wanna go back to using drakes


Mobile Fitting unit, cargohold full of drones (or a hauler full of them).

T2's are expensive to lose, but having a bazillion T1's to throw away is fine.
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#15 - 2014-07-29 09:36:34 UTC
Falin Whalen wrote:
I have to laugh at everybody. Initially when carriers were going to be re-balanced, CCP put forth the idea to have carriers not use drones along with dreads, just fighters, but everyone had a fit and CCP backed down. Now here we are later, only realizing now, how much foresight CCP had back then, while we try to figure out how to balance a wrecking ball fleet that can just trash everything in it's path and the only counter is "bring more suppers than them".


MMM. SUPPER.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#16 - 2014-07-29 11:42:21 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:


Problem is, fighters are awful.

You miss the recent huge buffs to them then?
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2014-07-29 11:48:23 UTC
Vayn Baxtor wrote:
The game should be more about pewing upfront than just shooting from long range and running away the moment anything crosses the 99.9km mark. So somewhere, yeah, sentries would also be part of the things I'd want changed.

Quote:
Can you show me on the doll where the Sentry Drone touched you?


But if anything I could actually wish, I'd leave EVE as it is just for the sake of somebody who could invent new meme quotes. That one there is so frakking overused.



So you want a game where skill is compeltely irrelevant and almost no tactics can be applied? Range allows maneuver space, maneuver space and mobility for positioning are all taht is remaining in tactics.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Anhenka
The New Federation
Sigma Grindset
#18 - 2014-07-29 11:53:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Anhenka
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:


Problem is, fighters are awful.

You miss the recent huge buffs to them then?


Did they change any of the primary reasons why fighters were awful? As in, travel time to get to target, massive volume, high expense, and horrible tendencies to lose all the fighters on a target when someone launches a bomb wave at them?

Oh yeah man, I love where they removed all those downsides, making them a viable and useful weapon system for something aside from WH shenanigans and nullsec farming.
Vayn Baxtor
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2014-07-29 12:05:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Vayn Baxtor
Quote:
So you want a game where skill is compeltely irrelevant and almost no tactics can be applied? Range allows maneuver space, maneuver space and mobility for positioning are all taht is remaining in tactics.


I won't get into definition-wars. I'll just say that I disagree with "spamming warp-in/out tactics".

Nope. Some range is okay, but not the current "beyond reach" stuff. It is too easy to apply "artillery sniping" and just warping off.

Likewise, seeing more AB and actual dogfights upfront would be nice. But that too is something that has go through every aspect of the game. I've already had a thread indirectly about this subject. EVE is not made for such, and a lot of things aren't as genuine as everybody thinks.

Plus, this thread is about sentries.

Quote:
so we remove engines?

Did I write that in that post? Roll No. P

Using tablet, typoes are common and I'm not going to fix them all.

Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#20 - 2014-07-29 19:54:40 UTC
Anhenka wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:


Problem is, fighters are awful.

You miss the recent huge buffs to them then?


Did they change any of the primary reasons why fighters were awful? As in, travel time to get to target, massive volume, high expense, and horrible tendencies to lose all the fighters on a target when someone launches a bomb wave at them?

Oh yeah man, I love where they removed all those downsides, making them a viable and useful weapon system for something aside from WH shenanigans and nullsec farming.



Exactly what this guy said. Yes, fighters can hit things now, but why bother risking it?
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