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If you haven't got anything good to say....

First post
Author
Vyl Vit
#1 - 2011-09-12 10:58:21 UTC
...don't say anything at all. This forum is already groaning under the weight of rampant and acerbic criticism. To read along one might get the idea this game sucks so badly it's amazing all the critics have played it at all, let alone as long as they have. Yet, we have, and there must be some reason why. Mea culpa. I've been in there tossing my BS-filled wit around with everyone else, but now I'd like to try to retrieve the baby before it goes out the window with the bathwater.

This is the best game, hands down, the best and you can deny it all you want you know it's true. CCP has designed something here, the artists, computer whizzes down to the stock clerk, that will stand in digital history regardless of how much the high and mighty "I can do better than this" screamers claim it's full of junk. The plain fact is, it isn't. It's a game with good integrity, unsurpassed graphics, thought provoking content, and artwork that is head and shoulders above the vast majority of other digital offerings.

After all the uproar on this forum about Incarna I began feeling like I was logging onto this horrendous waste of my hard earned dollar. I was looking for rapscallion ripoffs over both my shoulders and not really looking at what I was doing at all. So, I took another look with a fresh set of eyes. And, it's still there; the EVE that's grabbed my imagination since '07. It's beautiful. It's responsive. It's challenging. It's demanding, and rewarding, and as someone said just yesterday, "It's the game I hate to love."

Regardless of all the spiteful, hateful and downright ill-considered verbiage that has passed the past few months, in the main CCP you've done a stellar job, and I have every confidence you'll continue to do the best you can with our baby EVE. Yes, most of us whether we'll admit it or not, have adopted your creation as our own. It's our child. May its future be bright and expansive.

Paradise is like where you are right now, only much, much better.

Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
#2 - 2011-09-12 10:59:39 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
This is the best game, hands down, the best and you can deny it all you want you know it's true.
I agree.

/c

★★★ Secure 3rd party service ★★★

Visit my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar'

Twitter @ChribbaVeldspar

Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3 - 2011-09-12 11:00:01 UTC
yes, lets never critisize anything in the game that we dislike and hope that they get magically fixed

...grow up

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Vyl Vit
#4 - 2011-09-12 11:04:42 UTC
Skippermonkey wrote:
yes, lets never critisize anything in the game that we dislike and hope that they get magically fixed

...grow up


Well, "Skipper." If you don't think there's enough criticism on this forum already...and you're saying I should grow up...sonny boy, you got a long way to go.

Paradise is like where you are right now, only much, much better.

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#5 - 2011-09-12 11:07:13 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
...don't say anything at all.
Lolno.

Without criticism, there is no moving forward.

If you haven't got anything good to say, say it — it needs to be said.
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#6 - 2011-09-12 11:07:34 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
Skippermonkey wrote:
yes, lets never critisize anything in the game that we dislike and hope that they get magically fixed

...grow up


Well, "Skipper." If you don't think there's enough criticism on this forum already...and you're saying I should grow up...sonny boy, you got a long way to go.

somebody does something that you dont like, you let them know.

somebody messes up something you liked and you were paying for, you bloody well make a loud noise about it

yes, i love EVE, but im not going to sit back and allow CCP to make changes that ruin it go unchallenged

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Meryl SinGarda
Belligerent Underpaid Tactical Team
#7 - 2011-09-12 11:09:15 UTC
You know, I experimented earlier.

I opened up a new account just for the hell of it. Spent an hour or so creating a character and then jumped in as if I was just starting the game. The feeling wasn't entirely there, but I just about recaptured what it was like for me the first time I ever logged in. (even considering the recent changes)

This is why I keep telling people that the game is still here. And yet, the whining continues. Although, it does seem to be tapering off a bit.
J Kunjeh
#8 - 2011-09-12 11:09:31 UTC
I'm not sure the OP was suggesting we should never CONSTRUCTIVELY complain on the forums. I think what he's saying is that there's far too much wasteful WHINING going on here that isn't helpful in any way. I agree.

"The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)" (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5) 

Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#9 - 2011-09-12 11:09:54 UTC
You do realize a lot of the "whining" is coming from those who feel the same way you do? However most of us aren't just going to sit idle and see the game we love be neglected and wither away, The thing people don't seem to understand is that while the vocal minority might sound like people who don't give a **** and just whine, its actually the opposite we care enough to voice our opinions in hopes CCP "gets the hint". Sadly CCP seems determined to "stay the course" so the rage continues..

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden

Cyzlaki
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2011-09-12 11:12:13 UTC
I wouldn't go as far to say it's the best game ever, but it's certainly one of the only games I'm still playing after several years.
Rainus Max
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Brothers of Tangra
#11 - 2011-09-12 11:15:25 UTC
If we dont critisize or complain about issues then the game wouldn't have evolved in the way it has. Eve would be a Dev's paradise and we would have lost everything that makes the game fun.

If CCP didn't want us point out flaws, problems etc then why set up the CSM, why have devs that actively talk to you in the forums?


"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction." - Albert Einstein

Gibbeous Moon
Heimdal Freight and Manufacture Inc
#12 - 2011-09-12 11:15:41 UTC
I we don't point out errors in the game, strategic mangement decisions then how is CCP going to know the weight of the issue or that there is an issue at all.

It may be the best game out there. But, I can tell you that if these problems aren't addressed then it won't be for long.

it is because that this is the best game that we're so vocal. If we weren't vocal then we wouldn't care.
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#13 - 2011-09-12 11:15:55 UTC
"This is the best game, hands down, the best and you can deny it all you want you know it's true. CCP has designed something here, the artists, computer whizzes down to the stock clerk, that will stand in digital history regardless of how much the high and mighty "I can do better than this" screamers claim it's full of junk. The plain fact is, it isn't. It's a game with good integrity, unsurpassed graphics, thought provoking content, and artwork that is head and shoulders above the vast majority of other digital offerings."

Amen to that. even with its bugs, nothing else like it around. Way too much politics by some. If one tires of a game - leave gracefully, no need to try make it miserable for other players.

Well said, Vyl Vit. +10



MatrixSkye Mk2
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2011-09-12 11:19:41 UTC
Quote:
Without criticism, there is no moving forward.


There is a heap of difference between criticism and the emorage bullshit that goes on on these forums.

U NOT GONNA DO WUT I SAY THEN I QUIT MY 10 ACCOUNTS (fine print: when their subscription expires in 2 years. in the mean time i reserve the right to ***** and whine on how ccp aint doin wut i say)

Successfully doinitwrong™ since 2006.

CCP Fallout
C C P
C C P Alliance
#15 - 2011-09-12 11:20:26 UTC
While I understand your sentiment, I don't necessarily agree with your method. A thread like this one will usually, if not always, come away with a lot of trolling :D

One of the best things any user can do, if they have issue or concerns with a particular thread, is to use the report button and provide a detailed reason as to why the thread should be reviewed and/or moderated. This will help us on the Community team spot problematic threads much more quickly.

CCP Fallout Associate Community Manager EVE Online @ccp_fallout

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#16 - 2011-09-12 11:25:23 UTC
J Kunjeh wrote:
I think what he's saying is that there's far too much wasteful WHINING going on here that isn't helpful in any way.
Well, if the whiner-whiners stopped whining quite so much, we'd see a whole lot less of that…
Gibbeous Moon
Heimdal Freight and Manufacture Inc
#17 - 2011-09-12 11:28:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Gibbeous Moon
MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote:
Quote:
Without criticism, there is no moving forward.


There is a heap of difference between criticism and the emorage bullshit that goes on on these forums.

U NOT GONNA DO WUT I SAY THEN I QUIT MY 10 ACCOUNTS (fine print: when their subscription expires in 2 years. in the mean time i reserve the right to ***** and whine on how ccp aint doin wut i say)




Yes, good point Mind you in my RL forums in a non-Eve universe, far, faw away, the first accounts to get banned are those who write like four year olds with Caps Lock failure issues.

In these cases I think that CCP could do the community a huge benefit as well as increasing the intellectual average age of the New Eden denizen by helping them with their intent to quit by hastening thei exit.


edit. Due to appalling espresso deprivation induced spelling errors
Barricade Dark
#18 - 2011-09-12 11:46:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Barricade Dark
“The people to fear are not those who disagree with you, but those who disagree with you and are too cowardly to let you know”

-Napoleon Bonaparte

CCP needs disagreements far more than it needs sheep who follow them blindly. Our disagreements and our vocal confrontation is what drives this endevour like any other to positive change. If we simply accepted everything CCP offered without oppossition Eve Online would be nothing more than a credit card donation handling service.

As a hobbyiest I love this game, really for me its not so much a game as it is my favorite pass time. By no means does it make my voice the voice of expertise, but sure as **** isn't nothing. If CCP didn't want our opinions they wouldn't have a public forum where the data is captured (see games workshop).

I agree with the OP that their is lack of constructive criticism of the game on the forums, but than again you can't deny the passion of the community. As such CCP should simply say thank you for every insult and troll as its a representation of the communities affection for the game. If the forums where silent and we didn't have our trolls.... well that would be the day Eve died.

soo... bye bye miss American Pie, drove my chevy to the levy but the levy was dry... so on and so forth.
Di Mulle
#19 - 2011-09-12 12:02:33 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
...don't say anything at all.



If you feel so bad about critics in forums - perhaps leave forums, leave the game, do it silently ?

I don't like my own tone in a previous sentence, but your categorical wish to dictate others what they should think and do kind of justifies it.

Actually, both approaches are equally bad.

Don't tell me what to do and I will not tell you where to get lost.
<<Insert some waste of screen space here>>
Xavier Quo
Ashfell Celestial Corporation
Ashfell Federation
#20 - 2011-09-12 12:19:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Xavier Quo
There is no other vaguely modern game where you can fly around part of a galaxy, before it looked like that was because eve was unbeatable as it was always one step ahead.

Now those steps ahead haven't been taken for a while & it looks like they are taking its uniqueness for granted, relying on it more and more. Huge mistake.

Plus it's even more irritating as it's likely that most of CCP probably feels similar to us, yet the 3-5 people at the top are determined to go through with their own blinkered vision at the total and utter expense of their admirable legacy. That the cracks have started to show now maybe too late or not, maybe no-one at the top of CCP is prepared to accept that some decisions they've made in the past were mistakes, never mind big ones, who knows. Winter is coming.

Even as a general optimist, it is VERY hard to be optimistic right now. Maybe dust will be amazing with some kind of genius mechanic like paying dust players in ISK to enable them to buy better equipment etc (we have lots of isk spare, best people are not necessarily the most well off, capsuleers can cherry pick the best & fund them, keeps f2p dust model going <- I like)

But even just a turret missing a ship or a frigate strafing a planet outpost would have put a stupid childish grin on my face, instead we get a catwalk animation. Even the music was awfully made. Sad
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