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Crime & Punishment

 
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Since when can corp members attack other corp members?

Author
Renegade Heart
Doomheim
#41 - 2014-07-24 05:25:29 UTC
The mechanic allows corporations to implement internal disciplinary procedures. If a rogue corpmate needs punishing, you can punish him, without concord interfering.

Player corporations are serious business!
Netan MalDoran
Cathedral.
Shadow Cartel
#42 - 2014-07-24 06:42:57 UTC
If you don't screen recruits well enough, you guys deserve it. Besides, this isn't an isolated incident, people do it all the time.

While your at it, make corp theft impossible. JK

"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!

Falcon's truth

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#43 - 2014-07-24 06:56:15 UTC
Tengu Grib wrote:
So you want to get rid of corporate espionage? One goes, the other goes with it. If CCP were to patch awoxing then the awoxers would just take their time and steal everything that isn't tied down and empty the wallet. Course sometimes they do that as it is. Eve is a PVP game of intrigue and espionage, awoxing is part of that. Deal with it.
Nope, espionage and theft is fine, since generally people don't worry as much about that. They can keep most of their own stuff away from thieves. Awoxing is different. It prevents them actually playing the game the way they want to play.

Tengu Grib wrote:
Then member A should talk to his CEO as ultimately it is the CEO's responsibility who is being allowed into the corporation. If the CEO doesn't take responsibility, then you should probably find a new corporation anyways. Awoxing reveals the true nature of poorly managed corporations. If anything awoxers are doing a service by identifying badly operated corporations.
Yes, so he does find a new corporation. It's called an NPC corporation. So all victims of awoxers, go ahead and join NPC corporations, you can't get awoxed there.

Tengu Grib wrote:
I intend to, and to the second part, if you don't want to play with others because you might get blown up, why are you playing Eve at all? That's the whole point of Eve, you can be blown up at any time. (Not necessarily you specifically, but in general)
Are you a moron? Like really? I play with others, hence my membership of a null corporation. I'd like other people to play with others too, but many high sec players are put off, because the second they dip their toe out of their comfort zones, some ****** beats them into the ground and runs off laughing. How can you POSSIBLY expect newbies to take the plunge when every time they try they get beaten down?

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Luwc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#44 - 2014-07-24 06:57:50 UTC
Michele Bachmann wrote:
is this real life


Or just a fantasy

http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#45 - 2014-07-24 07:00:24 UTC
Renegade Heart wrote:
The mechanic allows corporations to implement internal disciplinary procedures. If a rogue corpmate needs punishing, you can punish him, without concord interfering.

Player corporations are serious business!
LOL
It's got nothing to do with discipline. Back in the day, it was the way to practice fight with each other. Now we have duels and limited engagements that do that job (which by the way also works for webbing freighters). It's been kept in because a handful of people who make it their job to make newbies cry would ***** and whine about it if it ever got changed, yet those exact same people already cry that those newbies are risk averse.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#46 - 2014-07-24 08:53:54 UTC
Puppy Eating wrote:
So Fleetmates can't attack each other, but Corpmates can?



Correct.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk

Tora Bushido
The Marmite Mercenaries
BLACKFLAG.
#47 - 2014-07-24 10:57:40 UTC
Eve is broken. People are allowed to use ammo and ammo kills people. Can we fix this so no one can kill each other any more ? Eve would be so much safer aka boring aka dead aka wow aka I love saying aka.

DELETE THE WEAK, ADAPT OR DIE !

Meta Gaming Level VII, Psycho Warfare Level X, Smack Talk Level VII.

Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#48 - 2014-07-24 11:05:58 UTC
Gustav Mannfred wrote:
I want warn you of an exploiting player, who joins your corp, scans you down and can legally attack you without concord. He first joined my corporation, then he scanned me down in Barkrik and came with a paladin and attacked me without concord came and killed him.

So, I lost a Vargur with almost one billion isk worth of fitting.

However, for me, it seems like an exploit, because, normally to attack another player, you need to be in the same corporation and same fleet, in order to attack another one without getting concorded. That guy swiches from corporation to corporation and hunts for mission runners. This is for me also abusing the game mechanics to gain isk. We werent in a duel and i didnt had a suspect or criminal flag, that allowed him to legally attack me.


Is that normal, that corp members can legally attack each other even without beeing in the same fleet? What is more, I also didnt got a duel flag to him. So my first thought, when he started shooting me, was to kick him off of the corp, so that then concord attacks. But it was already too late. When i kicked him off when he started shooting me, would then concord have attacked him?


A guy with two first names from a corp that is named "bring back can flipping" rants about being shot by a corp mate?

Seems legit!

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP

Dally Lama
Doomheim
#49 - 2014-07-24 12:21:17 UTC
OP, petition CCP. More and more players of all kinds are speaking out against how stupid CONCORD evasion is in high-sec. Add to the pile :)
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#50 - 2014-07-24 12:38:09 UTC
Like a fine woman with a robust mustache... this thread has what it takes to make me tingle.

Just to clarify some actual confusion a few posts up:

Corpmates can shoot corpmates.

Corpmates in the same fleet as corpmates can shoot corpmates in said fleet.

NON corpmates can NOTshoot corpmates.

NON corpmates in the same fleet can NOT shoot non corpmates in said fleet.

Mammy Thule moves like a mynx and can cook like nobodies business.

Anyone can shoot anyone anytime, it's just that sometimes concord gets involved. (keeping this in mind - OP where do you normally hang out?)
Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#51 - 2014-07-24 13:54:07 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Are you a moron? Like really? I play with others, hence my membership of a null corporation. I'd like other people to play with others too, but many high sec players are put off, because the second they dip their toe out of their comfort zones, some ****** beats them into the ground and runs off laughing. How can you POSSIBLY expect newbies to take the plunge when every time they try they get beaten down?


Lucas, name calling is a bad thing, especially when you are calling out respected citizens of C&P like Tengu Grib. Dont do that.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment

Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#52 - 2014-07-24 13:56:52 UTC
Serendipity Lost wrote:

Mammy Thule moves like a SULTRY mynx and can cook like nobodies business.


Fixed that for you.

Also, how did you get out of jail so fast? I figured the penalties for skulking around nursing homes, looking in windows, while naked, covered in peanut butter would have been a tad stiffer?

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment

Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
#53 - 2014-07-24 14:36:57 UTC
I did things and they let me go. Just like alwyas.

Netan MalDoran
Cathedral.
Shadow Cartel
#54 - 2014-07-24 16:57:35 UTC
Cannibal Kane wrote:
Puppy Eating wrote:
So Fleetmates can't attack each other, but Corpmates can?



Correct.


You can shoot your own fleetmates, I accidentally sent a volley at our logi once....Shocked

"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!

Falcon's truth

Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#55 - 2014-07-24 16:58:36 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Nope, espionage and theft is fine, since generally people don't worry as much about that. They can keep most of their own stuff away from thieves. Awoxing is different. It prevents them actually playing the game the way they want to play.

Don't worry as much about corp theft and espionage? Really? Can I join your corp? I promise not to Awox you. I also promise I'll do way more damage than I would have just killing you.
Lucas Kell wrote:
Yes, so he does find a new corporation. It's called an NPC corporation. So all victims of awoxers, go ahead and join NPC corporations, you can't get awoxed there.

While that is true, a better solution is to not recruit just any jack ass who applies. Do some research, there are LOTS of very high quality people who play Eve who will be fantastic additions to your corporation. And there are a few bad apples that will kill your members. I am one of the later (occasionally anyways).
Lucas Kell wrote:
Are you a moron? Like really? I play with others, hence my membership of a null corporation. I'd like other people to play with others too, but many high sec players are put off, because the second they dip their toe out of their comfort zones, some ****** beats them into the ground and runs off laughing. How can you POSSIBLY expect newbies to take the plunge when every time they try they get beaten down?

So following your logic then we should bring concorde out to null sec so that new players who want to dip their toes outside of their comfort zone don't get blown up. I expect newbies to do one of two things when I blow them up:
1) Rage quit (in which case Eve was never for them anyways and they would have left eventually)

2) Learn from their mistake and try to prevent making the same mistake in the future. Players who fall into this category will be meaningful and valuable members of Eve society.

Besides, I'd really rather awox older and likely richer targets than newbies. I've actually left corps unmolested because I couldn't find a target that WASN'T a newbie.

The people who have the most fun in their early experiences in Eve are often the ones who get violenced in some way and decide that is what they want to do. Then they learn that they can do both the violence and the carebearing at the same time if they so wish.

As for me being a moron, I assure you, I am not. Come to Edmonton and have a beer with me sometime, you'll see I'm quite easy to get along with and a far cry from a moron.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.

Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#56 - 2014-07-24 17:01:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Tengu Grib
Netan MalDoran wrote:
Cannibal Kane wrote:
Puppy Eating wrote:
So Fleetmates can't attack each other, but Corpmates can?



Correct.


You can shoot your own fleetmates, I accidentally sent a volley at our logi once....Shocked


Under the new security rules fleetmates cannot legally shoot each other. Corpmates can, but being in fleet is not enough to allow you to legally shoot people. If you shot your logi you were either in low, null, WH, or the same corp. Otherwise you'd get concorded. Or maybe they were suspect.

And to the guy who suggested that, trust me, you do NOT want that. Guys like me would abuse the ever living hell out of it.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.

Renegade Heart
Doomheim
#57 - 2014-07-24 17:04:17 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Renegade Heart wrote:
The mechanic allows corporations to implement internal disciplinary procedures. If a rogue corpmate needs punishing, you can punish him, without concord interfering.

Player corporations are serious business!
LOL
It's got nothing to do with discipline.


Just because you don't see a use of the mechanic for that kind of thing, does not mean that others in the sandbox will play the way you want to play. If someone needs to be taught a lesson, then there are those out there that will happily oblige. It's not unheard of. I would ask you to open your mind and understand that other players have different attitudes to the game from yours.


Lucas Kell wrote:
Back in the day, it was the way to practice fight with each other. Now we have duels and limited engagements that do that job (which by the way also works for webbing freighters).


I can see that the sandbox has allowed other forms of emergent gameplay to arise, but you are short-sighted if you think that the only use of the mechanic is that which you have been exposed to.

Lucas Kell wrote:
It's been kept in because a handful of people who make it their job to make newbies cry would ***** and whine about it if it ever got changed, yet those exact same people already cry that those newbies are risk averse.


This just seems like more assumptions on your part. Where is the evidence that this is the case?

Or, is your opinion just better than everyone elses?
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#58 - 2014-07-24 18:46:01 UTC
LOL exploit...





Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?

Paranoid Loyd
#59 - 2014-07-24 20:21:26 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
How can you POSSIBLY expect newbies to take the plunge when every time they try they get beaten down?


This is not a valid argument, we were all newbies at some point and we all figured it out.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!

Siobhan MacLeary
Doomheim
#60 - 2014-07-24 21:55:09 UTC
Gustav Mannfred wrote:
I want warn you of an exploiting player, who joins your corp, scans you down and can legally attack you without concord. He first joined my corporation, then he scanned me down in Barkrik and came with a paladin and attacked me without concord came and killed him.

So, I lost a Vargur with almost one billion isk worth of fitting.

However, for me, it seems like an exploit, because, normally to attack another player, you need to be in the same corporation and same fleet, in order to attack another one without getting concorded. That guy swiches from corporation to corporation and hunts for mission runners. This is for me also abusing the game mechanics to gain isk. We werent in a duel and i didnt had a suspect or criminal flag, that allowed him to legally attack me.


Is that normal, that corp members can legally attack each other even without beeing in the same fleet? What is more, I also didnt got a duel flag to him. So my first thought, when he started shooting me, was to kick him off of the corp, so that then concord attacks. But it was already too late. When i kicked him off when he started shooting me, would then concord have attacked him?


1. You have always been able to shoot your corpmates without any sort of Crimewatch timer.

2. Being in a fleet with someone does not change your ability to attack someone without CONCORD interference. There's even a pop-up about this. If he is in your corp, he can shoot you.

3. Jumping from corp to corp to AWOX mission runners is not and will likely never be an exploit.

4. It is the responsibility of corporation recruiters, not CCP, to protect their corpmates from rogue recruits.

Point out to me a person who has been harmed by an AFK cloaker and I will point out a person who has no business playing this game.” - CCP Soundwave