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Crius and T2 Bpo's
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Trin Javidan
Caymen Labs
#1 - 2014-07-17 22:11:44 UTC
Now the final changes are roughly know, what are the effects on T2 bpo's?
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#2 - 2014-07-18 00:22:32 UTC
My post-Crius T2 BPO caring factor remains at zero: T2 BPO still don't matter for any item with enough demand to be worth inventing.
350125GO
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2014-07-18 19:36:14 UTC
The effects will be that people will still whinge that they need to be removed and are somehow detrimental to Eve despite the fact that they don't currently, nor will they in the future, impact markets.

You're young, you'll adjust. I'm old, I'll get used to it.
Hakan MacTrew
Konrakas Forged
Solyaris Chtonium
#4 - 2014-07-19 01:04:10 UTC
Trin Javidan wrote:
Now the final changes are roughly know, what are the effects on T2 bpo's?


T2 BPO's will be reduced to ME 10% / TE 20%, just like all other BPO's and the base build materials on them all will be increased by 50%. Meanwhile, invented BPC's will require 2% less materials than they do now and decryters will have even better effects on invented BPC's.

TL:DR
Those T2 BPO's that are worth tens of billions of isk are not going to be worth it much longer.

Friends
Qoi
Exert Force
#5 - 2014-07-19 01:48:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Qoi
It depends a lot. Their profit margins in invention driven markets dropped of course by a pretty big chunk. Pretty much their only real advantage now is that you save the money spent on invention. For items where invention is much cheaper than manufacturing, they are royally ******. The more important question though is, what is the effect on Command Ship prices? ;)

http://eve-industry.org
Trin Javidan
Caymen Labs
#6 - 2014-07-19 11:22:34 UTC
What will be the effect of Max run max'd out ME & TE T2 bpo's copies (lets say 10 run hac) vs decrypter 10 run with the Job bonus involved?
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2014-07-19 12:45:47 UTC
they got brutalized as they lost most of their cost advantage over invention
Agata Matahari
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2014-07-19 19:47:19 UTC
RIP T2BPOs
Plleasure Hub
Municorn
#9 - 2014-07-20 02:15:28 UTC
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I believe you will have to have the BPO or BPC physically stored in a POS to manufacture it there post-Crius. So in order to build from a T2 BPO, the owner will have to risk putting it in a POS for faster build times, unlike now, where you only need the materials there.

"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." — Kazuto Kirigaya
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#10 - 2014-07-20 02:28:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Plleasure Hub wrote:
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I believe you will have to have the BPO or BPC physically stored in a POS to manufacture it there post-Crius. So in order to build from a T2 BPO, the owner will have to risk putting it in a POS for faster build times, unlike now, where you only need the materials there.

Of course you don't have to use a POS to manufacture, and never have. Risk vs. reward.
Plleasure Hub
Municorn
#11 - 2014-07-20 02:31:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Plleasure Hub
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Plleasure Hub wrote:
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I believe you will have to have the BPO or BPC physically stored in a POS to manufacture it there post-Crius. So in order to build from a T2 BPO, the owner will have to risk putting it in a POS for faster build times, unlike now, where you only need the materials there.

Of course you don't have to use a POS to manufacture, and never have. Risk vs. reward.


True, but it seems like you are at a disadvantage if you don't. Manufacturing time is a big choke-point, and a POS offers a huge reduction to this time. Even more so with the improvements coming to Rapid Assembly Arrays.

Edit: My point is, whereas before you could take advantage of a POS using a T2 BPO safely stored in your corp hangar at a station, you are now forced to physically move it to the POS or copy it.

"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." — Kazuto Kirigaya
Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2014-07-20 07:30:32 UTC
You can check how badly T2 BPO owners got hazed in this expansion by... looking at the T2 BPO sale threads!

Smart people offloaded theirs a while ago at premium prices. The rest... Lol

Now if you are a buyer of T2 ships and modules, remember that the way T2 BPO-built stock depressed the market price of the final goods is probably history. So hope you are ready for a nice spike in T2 module/ship prices...
Plleasure Hub
Municorn
#13 - 2014-07-20 08:14:06 UTC
Jarnis McPieksu wrote:
So hope you are ready for a nice spike in T2 module/ship prices...

My wallet is ready. :]

"There's no meaningful difference between a real and a virtual world. It's pointless to ask anyone who they really are. All you can do is accept and believe in them, because whoever they are in your mind, is their true identity." — Kazuto Kirigaya
Paynus Maiassus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2014-07-21 00:32:02 UTC
Hakan MacTrew wrote:
Trin Javidan wrote:
Now the final changes are roughly know, what are the effects on T2 bpo's?


T2 BPO's will be reduced to ME 10% / TE 20%, just like all other BPO's and the base build materials on them all will be increased by 50%. Meanwhile, invented BPC's will require 2% less materials than they do now and decryters will have even better effects on invented BPC's.

TL:DR
Those T2 BPO's that are worth tens of billions of isk are not going to be worth it much longer.


This is the best answer both in terms of the details it provides as well as the conclusion it draws.

If you have a T2 BPO you will still have an advantage in using it, though this advantage will be smaller. The key, though, is that the advantage is nowhere near the huge price tag of the T2 BPOs.

If you do not have a T2 BPO, do not buy one. The advantage has just shrunk and it will continue to shrink until they are basically worthless.

Other than the post I am quoting, the one other post in this thread that is on target is the one saying that people will still whine about the T2 BPOs. While the advantage has shrunk, there is still an advantage, and people should keep whining about that until they are gone.

However, this now marks the point in time where T2 BPOs have become a bad investment. If you own one you can still be happy about it for a while, but do NOT buy one. They aren't worth it anymore. Likely the nerfing will continue.
Careby
#15 - 2014-07-21 13:07:37 UTC
Paynus Maiassus wrote:
...If you do not have a T2 BPO, do not buy one...
...do NOT buy one...

I don't think that advice makes much sense without considering the BPO price. The market value of T2 BPOs will continue to be defined by what buyers and sellers think they are worth. While the ROI based on using them to manufacture or copy may not justify current prices, there are other considerations, and they aren't likely to become worthless any time soon.
Victoria Sin
Doomheim
#16 - 2014-07-21 14:40:43 UTC
Plleasure Hub wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Plleasure Hub wrote:
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I believe you will have to have the BPO or BPC physically stored in a POS to manufacture it there post-Crius. So in order to build from a T2 BPO, the owner will have to risk putting it in a POS for faster build times, unlike now, where you only need the materials there.

Of course you don't have to use a POS to manufacture, and never have. Risk vs. reward.


True, but it seems like you are at a disadvantage if you don't. Manufacturing time is a big choke-point, and a POS offers a huge reduction to this time. Even more so with the improvements coming to Rapid Assembly Arrays.

Edit: My point is, whereas before you could take advantage of a POS using a T2 BPO safely stored in your corp hangar at a station, you are now forced to physically move it to the POS or copy it.


Well as the copy time is now the same ballpark as the build time you just need to use up a research slot continually copying your BPO somewhere safe and then using the BPC to build at your POS. Of course the copy jobs have a cost so this may or may not help.