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Resistances vs Buffer tanks
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Lord Zarcam
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2014-07-15 20:12:28 UTC
Just coming back after a very long break and been spending the last few weeks just reading the forums trying to catch up with all the changes since I've been gone. I have found a lot of the ships in my hanger have had changes over the years as I am currently going thru each ship and adding it to EFT. Plus lots of new shiny playthings to add.

My question is: What is the currently theory on ship outfitting for the tanking for PvE? Resistance ratings or armor plate buffer tanking?

Now I am all straight Amarr and I know Amarr has always been mainly armor tank and lesser shields. From what I remember of when I last played was for PvE it was max possible resistance and armor plate buffer for PvP, does this theory still hold true?


Thanks kindly!
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#2 - 2014-07-15 20:25:23 UTC
High resists are part of any good buffer tank, and they have the added benefit of increasing the power of any remote reps you happen to get. But to get a solid buffer, you do need both.

If I'm tight on slots, I fit a plate (or extender) first. If I have more room, I fit resists first, then the plate.

And don't forget your suitcase! (Damage Control, in case you forgot.)

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs
Lord Zarcam
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2014-07-15 20:36:35 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
High resists are part of any good buffer tank, and they have the added benefit of increasing the power of any remote reps you happen to get. But to get a solid buffer, you do need both.

If I'm tight on slots, I fit a plate (or extender) first. If I have more room, I fit resists first, then the plate.

And don't forget your suitcase! (Damage Control, in case you forgot.)


So far, every ship I've looked at of mine still have the suite case attached. Looks like it's still the one module that's a must fit.

Is it better to drop the armor repairer for a plate or more resistance now?
kurage87
EVE University
Ivy League
#4 - 2014-07-15 20:46:20 UTC
If you are talking about solo pve, then active tank is what you want.

Active tank = repairer/booster + resists

Buffer tank = plate/extender + resists
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#5 - 2014-07-15 20:46:57 UTC
Lord Zarcam wrote:
Bronson Hughes wrote:
High resists are part of any good buffer tank, and they have the added benefit of increasing the power of any remote reps you happen to get. But to get a solid buffer, you do need both.

If I'm tight on slots, I fit a plate (or extender) first. If I have more room, I fit resists first, then the plate.

And don't forget your suitcase! (Damage Control, in case you forgot.)


So far, every ship I've looked at of mine still have the suite case attached. Looks like it's still the one module that's a must fit.

Is it better to drop the armor repairer for a plate or more resistance now?


Repper for solo PvE. Resists prioritized if you're getting RR, whether in PvE (usually incursions) or PvP. Raw buffer on top of decent resists for PvP where you're not getting repped.

Which is all to say: nothing has really upset the balance that much.
Lord Zarcam
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2014-07-16 04:15:54 UTC
Got it, so really little has changed other then a few new modules.

Thanks everyone!
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#7 - 2014-07-16 11:10:59 UTC
Lord Zarcam wrote:
Got it, so really little has changed other then a few new modules.

Thanks everyone!


Speaking of which, make sure you check out the reactive armor hardener. It starts off at 15% resists across the board, then adapts itself to incoming damage types and spreads 60% worth of resists accordingly. Against single damage type opponents, it is awesome, albeit it more cap-intensive than a standard hardener.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#8 - 2014-07-16 16:55:56 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Lord Zarcam wrote:
Got it, so really little has changed other then a few new modules.

Thanks everyone!


Speaking of which, make sure you check out the reactive armor hardener. It starts off at 15% resists across the board, then adapts itself to incoming damage types and spreads 60% worth of resists accordingly. Against single damage type opponents, it is awesome, albeit it more cap-intensive than a standard hardener.


You're pretty much better with an EANM unless you fight pure damage ships (Caldari Missile boats). Even 2 damage types still leaves it only marginally better than an EANM.
Lord Zarcam
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2014-07-16 18:22:26 UTC
Maeltstome wrote:
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Lord Zarcam wrote:
Got it, so really little has changed other then a few new modules.

Thanks everyone!


Speaking of which, make sure you check out the reactive armor hardener. It starts off at 15% resists across the board, then adapts itself to incoming damage types and spreads 60% worth of resists accordingly. Against single damage type opponents, it is awesome, albeit it more cap-intensive than a standard hardener.


You're pretty much better with an EANM unless you fight pure damage ships (Caldari Missile boats). Even 2 damage types still leaves it only marginally better than an EANM.



I was going to ask if this would replace the EANM. Would there be any advantage to running both, with a damage control also? I guess each situation and ship would be different and would be worth testing to see how they work for me.
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#10 - 2014-07-16 18:57:24 UTC
Lord Zarcam wrote:

I was going to ask if this would replace the EANM. Would there be any advantage to running both, with a damage control also? I guess each situation and ship would be different and would be worth testing to see how they work for me.

Reactive Armor Hardeners have a total of 60% resists to split up between the four damage types. It starts at 15% for all four and adapts over the course of the fight. Against one damage type, a RAH is amazing, because it will grant 60% resist to that one type. Against two evenly-split damage types, it's okay because it provides 30% resists to those two types. Beyond two, it loses out to EANMs.

For missions, I use an EANM/RAH combo on my Kronos and I've been very happy with it. I haven't yet tried them on PvP fits, but I do fly my Khanid missile boats with a "rainbow" loadout (multiple damage types) with them in mind.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2014-07-17 00:13:36 UTC
IMO the RAH goes well for missions, where you get missions from different factions and don't want to have to refit hardeners all the time. If you are always ratting against the same NPC's I wouldn't bother.
Feyrin
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2014-07-17 07:35:17 UTC
RAH are stacking penalised with damage controls not hardeners. So a RAH and ENAM together get the full benefit of both with no stacking penalty.
Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
#13 - 2014-07-17 15:04:54 UTC
The RAH is how the DC should have worked in the redesign.

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Lord Zarcam
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2014-07-17 22:52:20 UTC
Looking thru my old ship setups, I see a few have 2 EANM's. I suspect they have a stacking penalty?

I'm starting to see a consensus that RAH's are replacing the damage controls for mission fits? From what I remember, most Amarr missions seamed to deal multiple damage types, has this changed or still about the same? I hate refitting when I'm in "mission mode" and usually just suffer the damage and warp out before it gets too bad.

Great info guys. Lots of ideas to refit my ships with.
Nalelmir Ahashion
Industrial Management and Engineering
Mouth Trumpet Cavalry
#15 - 2014-07-18 13:49:16 UTC
wait wait wait.. so now for pve and such the ongoing is to use EAMM with compensation skills + RAH and active tank?