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The definition of eve content

Author
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#61 - 2014-07-15 14:48:30 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:

I accept your surrender and rename you France.

More seriously, it's not may fault that blunt truth hurts you, you should have used what I was telling you as a reason to rethink, but of course it's easier to blame others for you own faults, ain't it?


Like I said its not worth arguing with you. What you say doesn't hurt me I just find it to usually be out of left field and not worth reading.

Not today spaghetti.

Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#62 - 2014-07-15 14:49:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Ralph King-Griffin
Anything facilitated by eves existence that otherwise wouldn't have been as it currently is could be considered content , including this conversation for example.
Christina Project
Screaming Head in a Box.
#63 - 2014-07-15 14:54:15 UTC
Quinn Corvez wrote:
Christina Project wrote:
Quinn Corvez wrote:
Caviar Liberta wrote:


PvP is non developer created content.


PVP is not content, it is an interaction between players.

And interaction is content, no matter how hard you try not to understand this.



show me in a dictionary where content is defined as interaction. Roll

Are apples oranges also?

Please provide practical evidence that interaction is not content.
I can provide tons of evidence that it is, while you are completely
unable to prove the contrary.

All you need to do is come to Hek when I am around.

[i]"Don't look into another human's bowl to see how much he has ... ... look into his bowl to see if he has enough !" - Sol[/i]

Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#64 - 2014-07-15 14:54:22 UTC
confirming local spam is content and not the process of typing an reading... Jesus gus at this point you may aswll just thay every thing that ever existed is henceforth to be know as content... "I went to the content to get some content and one the way content punched me in the content".

I like this thread and everyone in it Lol
Christina Project
Screaming Head in a Box.
#65 - 2014-07-15 14:55:23 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Anything facilitated by eves existence that otherwise wouldn't have been as it currently is could be considered content , including this conversation for example.
Exactly.
For EVE and Life in general.

[i]"Don't look into another human's bowl to see how much he has ... ... look into his bowl to see if he has enough !" - Sol[/i]

Christina Project
Screaming Head in a Box.
#66 - 2014-07-15 14:56:32 UTC
Quinn Corvez wrote:
confirming local spam is content and not the process of typing an reading... Jesus gus at this point you may aswll just thay every thing that ever existed is henceforth to be know as content... "I went to the content to get some content and one the way content punched me in the content".

I like this thread and everyone in it Lol

It is. You just don't get it. Too stuck in your narrow understanding of Life in general.
You probably believe your existence has no influence on others too, hu?

[i]"Don't look into another human's bowl to see how much he has ... ... look into his bowl to see if he has enough !" - Sol[/i]

Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#67 - 2014-07-15 14:57:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Sexy Cakes wrote:
or CCP to change content in regards to PvP other than what their doing now by rebalancing ships and rules of engagement.

PvE changes drive PvP oreinted conflicts.


Yea, that sure did work well for them in the past. This change was supposed to make conflict, it only made longer high sec incursion wait lists.

Would you like to name an actual PvE change that drove a pvp conflict of some kind. That doesn't happen, where as in reality, changing pve and background 'content' tends to dampen pvp.

-Another example is the moon goo nerf that was supposed to even things out and create conflict but that instead created RENTISTAN.

-or the introduction and rebalancing of 'rewards' in FW that created "Farmmatar" (there were no such silly rewards when I was 1st in FW).

-Or the original introduction of lvl 5s in low sec (marred by the high sec lvl 5 bug) that was supposed to drive conflict (by giving people a reason to leave high sec and go to low) that ended up being almost exclusivly a source of income for pirates who already lived in low sec.

Seems you haven't learned the lesson.....that CCP still hasn't learned because they are still stuffing pve rewards in low sec lol.

PvE doesn't drive PvP content in EVE, mainly because there are other PvE activities that pay isk with little risk (high sec missions, incursions ect ect) and also because groups can easily control the non-high sec space where those pve activities exist (such as sov null and priates around lvl 5 hubs), also such as how those guys locked down a whole constellation to farm FW LP when the now faction ships were introduced and made obscene isk.

In other words, what you believe about PVE affecting PVP is exactly backwards.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#68 - 2014-07-15 15:00:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Always with the 'themepark' comeback. For someone that uses the word narrow a lot to describe other people's points of view you sure don't offer much depth in your discussions.
I use the themepark comparison because you're making a themepark complaint. This is not a matter of depth, but of rough categorisation. You want more stuff to consume (which is the defining characteristic of a themepark game), rather than more stuff to do, even if you have to invent it yourself (which rather defines the sandbox).

Quote:
The reason I only mention PvE interactions is because I would think it would be hard for CCP to change content in regards to PvP other than what their doing now by rebalancing ships and rules of engagement.
Then you pretty clearly accept that there is indeed a metric fsckton of content that CCP has no hand in creating.

Quinn Corvez wrote:
Christina Project wrote:
And interaction is content, no matter how hard you try not to understand this.

show me in a dictionary where content is defined as interaction. Roll

content 2 |ˈkɒntɛnt|

noun (also contents)
the things that are held or included in something: she unscrewed the top of the flask and drank the contents.

• [ in sing. ] [ with modifier ] the amount of a particular constituent occurring in a substance: soya milk has a low fat content.
• (contents) a list of the chapters or sections given at the front of a book or periodical: [ as modifier ] : the contents page.
• [ mass noun ] the material dealt with in a speech, literary work, etc. as distinct from its form or style: the tone, if not the content, of his book is familiar.
• information made available by a website or other electronic medium: [ as modifier ] : online content providers.

Nothing there about interactions being disqualified form being content. If interactions are included in something, why would they not count as content in that something? In fact, usage 3 seems rather applicable here: the content of a game is distinct from its mechanisms and presentation.

After all, there is content and there is content. What is the content of a game of chess? Is it the board and the pieces? Not really — those are the contents of the box the chess game came in. The content of an actual game of chess is the moves, the board states, the strategies involved in reaching the end. Oh, and by the way, apples and oranges are pretty much the same thing.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#69 - 2014-07-15 15:01:03 UTC
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:

I accept your surrender and rename you France.

More seriously, it's not may fault that blunt truth hurts you, you should have used what I was telling you as a reason to rethink, but of course it's easier to blame others for you own faults, ain't it?


Like I said its not worth arguing with you. What you say doesn't hurt me I just find it to usually be out of left field and not worth reading.


What academy did you graduate from, 'cause you sure are good at the Cop out lol.
Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#70 - 2014-07-15 15:01:39 UTC
Christina Project wrote:
Quinn Corvez wrote:
Christina Project wrote:
Quinn Corvez wrote:
Caviar Liberta wrote:


PvP is non developer created content.


PVP is not content, it is an interaction between players.

And interaction is content, no matter how hard you try not to understand this.



show me in a dictionary where content is defined as interaction. Roll

Are apples oranges also?

Please provide practical evidence that interaction is not content.
I can provide tons of evidence that it is, while you are completely
unable to prove the contrary.

All you need to do is come to Hek when I am around.


My point is that there is already a word/term for interaction and guess what that is? no not content... Interaction!

This thread is asking what people mean when they say content. I can only speak for myself but when i say content, i mean the stuff ccp puts in the game. Everything the players do is just the players playing the game.

question: when people say "ccp should add new content" what do you think they mean?

Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#71 - 2014-07-15 15:04:33 UTC
Anything that makes somebody (read: not everybody) happy in EVE is content.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.

Christina Project
Screaming Head in a Box.
#72 - 2014-07-15 15:05:29 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:

I accept your surrender and rename you France.

More seriously, it's not may fault that blunt truth hurts you, you should have used what I was telling you as a reason to rethink, but of course it's easier to blame others for you own faults, ain't it?


Like I said its not worth arguing with you. What you say doesn't hurt me I just find it to usually be out of left field and not worth reading.


What academy did you graduate from, 'cause you sure are good at the Cop out lol.

Damn i loved Police Academy! Still want to play part one from the old times on PC.

[i]"Don't look into another human's bowl to see how much he has ... ... look into his bowl to see if he has enough !" - Sol[/i]

Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#73 - 2014-07-15 15:07:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Quinn Corvez
Tippia wrote:

Quinn Corvez wrote:
Christina Project wrote:
And interaction is content, no matter how hard you try not to understand this.

show me in a dictionary where content is defined as interaction. Roll

content 2 |ˈkɒntɛnt|

noun (also contents)
the things that are held or included in something: she unscrewed the top of the flask and drank the contents.

• [ in sing. ] [ with modifier ] the amount of a particular constituent occurring in a substance: soya milk has a low fat content.
• (contents) a list of the chapters or sections given at the front of a book or periodical: [ as modifier ] : the contents page.
• [ mass noun ] the material dealt with in a speech, literary work, etc. as distinct from its form or style: the tone, if not the content, of his book is familiar.
• information made available by a website or other electronic medium: [ as modifier ] : online content providers.

Nothing there about interactions being disqualified form being content. If interactions are included in something, why would they not count as content in that something? In fact, usage 3 seems rather applicable here: the content of a game is distinct from its mechanisms and presentation.


So let me get this straight...unless the dictionary specifically disqualifies something, it can be considered to be that thing? It doesn't mention genocide but i'm fairly certain mass murder isn't content either.
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#74 - 2014-07-15 15:11:52 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Would you like to name an actual PvE change that drove a pvp conflict of some kind. That doesn't happen, where as in reality, changing pve and background 'content' tends to dampen pvp.


Any wormhole would be an example. When wormholes got figured out plenty of groups started heading into them and evicting other people so that they could print ISK and plenty of people still do.

Jenn aSide wrote:

-Another example is the moon goo nerf that was supposed to even things out and create conflict but that instead created RENTISTAN.


It started the fountain war. Not to get off subject but what's wrong with people renting? Players who want to be in nullsec but don't like PvP or taking orders from a 'godfather' get to have all the fun they want for a small percentage of what they generate. How does it hurt you in any way?

Jenn aSide wrote:

-or the introduction and rebalancing of 'rewards' in FW that created "Farmmatar" (there were no such silly rewards when I was 1st in FW).


Sounds like you are describing more of a tweak to existing mechanics which really wouldn't drive much player interaction.

Jenn aSide wrote:

-Or the original introduction of lvl 5s in low sec (marred by the high sec lvl 5 bug) that was supposed to drive conflict (by giving people a reason to leave high sec and go to low) that ended up being almost exclusivly a source of income for pirates who already lived in low sec.


Plenty of lowsec entities move around like nomads and take into account where the nearest level 5 agent is for funding their PvP.

Jenn aSide wrote:

Seems you haven't learned the lesson.....that CCP still hasn't learned because they are still stuffing pve rewards in low sec lol. PvE doesn't drive PvP content in EVE, mainly because there are other PvE activities that pay isk with little risk (high sec missions, incursions ect ect) and also because groups can easily control the non-high sec space where those pve activities exist, such as how those guys locked down a whole constellation to farm FW LP when the now faction ships were introduced.

In other words, what you believe about PVE affecting PVP is exactly backwards.


Sounds to me like CCP has the right idea, they just need to get back to it. It's not about their being equal/better isk making activities in safer parts of space. The discussion I was touching on was about having new things to do, isk or no isk.

Not today spaghetti.

Kotch 247
Doomheim
#75 - 2014-07-15 15:18:20 UTC
I wouldn't describe the activities made possible by the tools given to you in a sandbox as content. That's like saying a box of Lego has content. It has possibilities, not content. Content is created when players realise those possibilities. I guess you have to make the distinction between developer-created and player-created content.
Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#76 - 2014-07-15 15:20:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Quinn Corvez
Christina Project wrote:
Quinn Corvez wrote:
confirming local spam is content and not the process of typing an reading... Jesus gus at this point you may aswll just thay every thing that ever existed is henceforth to be know as content... "I went to the content to get some content and one the way content punched me in the content".

I like this thread and everyone in it Lol

It is. You just don't get it. Too stuck in your narrow understanding of Life in general.
You probably believe your existence has no influence on others too, hu?


Instead of trying to insult people by suggesting they don't "get life" could you answer this:

Quinn Corvez wrote:

when people say "ccp should add new content" what do you think they mean?


Do you think they just want a CCP dev to trash talk in local. Shocked
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#77 - 2014-07-15 15:22:01 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Sexy Cakes wrote:
The reason I only mention PvE interactions is because I would think it would be hard for CCP to change content in regards to PvP other than what their doing now by rebalancing ships and rules of engagement.
Then you pretty clearly accept that there is indeed a metric fsckton of content that CCP has no hand in creating.


I clearly illustrated that I don't categorize that as content.

Not today spaghetti.

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#78 - 2014-07-15 15:22:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Quinn Corvez wrote:
So let me get this straight...unless the dictionary specifically disqualifies something, it can be considered to be that thing?
If it matches the description, then yes. As it happens, interaction fits the description just fine and isn't disqualified by any part of it. The problem here is really that you're asking for a definition by a single word rather than a general description. That's not really how dictionaries work; they're not a list of all things that mean the same thing — that's more the job of a thesaurus.

But hey, let's do that too:

content 2 |(stress on the first syllable)|
noun
1 many restaurant meals are low in fibre content: amount, proportion, quantity, bulk, total, quota; rare quantum.
2 just as the novel's form is radical, so too is its content: subject matter, subject, theme, burden, gist, argument, thesis, message, point, thrust, substance, matter, material, text, ideas — antonyms: style.
3 (contents) she went to examine the contents of the hamper: things inside, content, load — informal: guts, innards.
4 (contents) the book's list of contents | he picked up the letter and scanned its contents: chapters, sections, divisions; subject matter, subjects, themes, matter, substance, material, text; index; constituents, components, ingredients, elements, items.

Does interaction count as a theme, point, (subject) matter, or substance of EVE? Is it part of the game's “innards” or components or elements? Sure does and sure is.

Quote:
I clearly illustrated that I don't categorize that as content.
…and that's a particularly incongruous and arbitrary categorisation. You're effectively begging the question.
Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#79 - 2014-07-15 15:23:00 UTC
Kotch 247 wrote:
I wouldn't describe the activities made possible by the tools given to you in a sandbox as content. That's like saying a box of Lego has content. It has possibilities, not content. Content is created when players realise those possibilities. I guess you have to make the distinction between developer-created and player-created content.


Nailed it.


Christina Project
Screaming Head in a Box.
#80 - 2014-07-15 15:23:21 UTC
Quote:
My point is that there is already a word/term for interaction and guess what that is? no not content... Interaction!

This thread is asking what people mean when they say content. I can only speak for myself but when i say content, i mean the stuff ccp puts in the game. Everything the players do is just the players playing the game.

question: when people say "ccp should add new content" what do you think they mean?

What I think is irrelevant. What counts is what's happening.
Opinions usually just screw up observation,
because factual reality is put through a stupid filter most call "I".

Most people who whine for new content are consumers. They have a screwed understanding of content
because of all the consumption. People nowadays are used to content as something that is being consumed.

So when you ask what people seem to want, then the answer would be: "a consumeable good".
Does that mean they understand what content means? No.

[i]"Don't look into another human's bowl to see how much he has ... ... look into his bowl to see if he has enough !" - Sol[/i]