Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I absolutely agree.

The idea that the class can travel, without any support, over large distances with relatively low risk is the WHOLE IDEA of the ship. But, as currently implemented, it requires too much logistics. Removing the cyno-requirement should help this ship being used for its intended purpose, and, popularly.

It's true that people will know when anyone comes in local, and seeing 10 people enter local is no different than any mechanics currently. As I suggested earlier, there need to be some delay to keep people in system for a time period. This allows them to be seen in-system, and prevents them from traveling too quickly.

Again, I think these types of jumps should require more fuel, and maybe liquid ozone for the actuation of the module itself. This will also prevent cargo hauling. Still, black ops will be useful for limited (1 jump and back) hauling, but so what? It's not going to hold more than a small collection of mods. Again, requiring liquid ozone (or something more expensive/bigger) will help this issue.

Still, I think there are more kinks to be worked out...

This would mean no mid-point cyno for black-ops battleship fleets... think about that!

+1

If you are moving capitals, that still remains unchanged.

I think you should be able to stop such direct efforts with other direct efforts, like a gate camp.

Now, if someone decides to risk the BLOPs directly in hostile space, rather than staying at a staging area safely, then it is possible they can avoid gates as you suggest.

But then the BLOPs being used also rates at a far higher level of risk as well. The ISK investment, along with the training demands, far exceed the ISK and training needed for a cyno.

More risk, more reward, the way I see it.

Yes, this.

Everyone has been talking about the 'love' that blackops needs. And I think everyone agrees.

So, that comes down to, so what can we do? There's always the possibility of a stat-buff, or a new bonus, but I haven't heard of much suggesting in this arena. There are only so many existing game mechanics that really apply to the concept of the ship.

And what is that concept of that ship?

Black Ops battleships are designed for infiltration and espionage behind enemy lines. With the use of a short-range jump drive and a portal generator, they are capable of making a special type of jump portal usable only by covert ops vessels. This enables them to stealthily plant reconnaissance and espionage forces in enemy territory. For the final word in clandestine maneuvers, look no further.

Now, we've got covert cynos for jump-portaling all manner of covert-ops ships, but the battleships themselves are a nothing special besides the ability to jump and portal. They can cloak, like anything else, but their "infiltration and espionage" abilities? I don't know what those are.

So, this proposal GIVES THEM ONE. Namely, they have a "prototype jump drive" able to calculate an approximate location in space using the signature of a nearby star. They lack the pinpoint accuracy of jumping to a cyno field, but it still enables the ship to jump to within a safe distance away from the star itself.

(put in a little dev-joke about how it's a prototype because you still have a really small chance of jumping inside a planet or something, but this won't actually ever happen)

What's the result? Well, this class of ship can now infiltrate behind enemy lines.
(1)They can't bridge in other ships this way.
(2)They can't open a cyno once they get there.
(3)And they can't jump to a specific location.

Also, there is a high-slot module (maybe a "prototype jump-drive calibrator/actuator/motivator" ?):
An activation delay after uncloaking before jumping. (skill depending)
A cool-down timer before jumping again. (skill depending)
Increased fuel cost (maybe a second isotope or fuel) compared to a regular jump.
An expensive high-slot module.
And some fitting difficulty of the module itself (50tf at least).

There could even be a new skill: Advanced Jump Drive Operation or Advanced Jump Drive Calibration (which affects the jump-drive range of prototype jump drives).

I see the operating of the module working like this:
You decloak.
You wait 5s or something.
You activate the module( which requires your ship to be near-stopped, like a cyno)
When you do, a list of possible systems pops up and you click one.
Now you either jump instantly, or you can now jump with the existing mechanic.
After the jump.
You land in the new system. ANYWHERE (off grid) between 1AU and 5AU from the star.
A cool-down timer on the module starts. You have to wait before you can jump again
You can cloak up.
You cannot warp off until the timer is done. (you're not going to hop around low sec killing miners)

ISSUES

The one thing that comes to mind, is that people need to still use the covert jump portal. We don't want all covert gangs becoming BS fleets because of this ability to move around. I'm just not sure what that is...maybe some small buff to that mechanic? Obviously having a fleet of blackops at 1.5b+ each is way more expensive that a fleet of bombers or recons, and maybe that's enough. I don't know. The best I figure is that the cost of the mod + extra cost of fuel + fitting difficulties will be enough.

Epilogue

In the future, I could even see a second blackops class BS based on the tier 3 hulls. (a citadel-torp heavy bomber???), being able to use this module as well with more limited range.

+1

As much as I want Black Ops to have covert ops cloaks, I would much rather have the ability to jump without a cyno.

If you have a disagreement, state your reasons for disagreeing; it's not a discussion if you're just rejecting an idea without giving any proof for your argument

In my mind it's a good idea because:

It's a new mechanic for a ship class

It allows black ops to fulfill their role

It prevents the use of the ability for direct offensive purposes

It is less open to exploitation for ambushes than the normal travel mechanic

It allows black ops pilots to fully utilize their ship and travel effectively in a BS hull

It isn't a suggestion to give them cov ops cloak

Also, use proper grammar next time- more people may listen to to you

You wouldn't be able to bridge without a cyno.

Even if a fleet composed solely of black ops jumped, they'd all land in different places randomly.

They all appear in local.

They cannot warp for 60 seconds (reduced to 30 at the least).

Anyone in the system will know they're there and be able to react much more quickly than they could to traditional 'ambush' tactics.

No scout means no intel.

Even if they do reach the target somehow, no fleet composed of just one ship class, especially battleship-sized hulls, will stand a chance against any real group.

This is a special travel method for black ops to travel quietly and effectively. It gives no real advantage in a combat situation (random position, can't move for 30-60 seconds, can't bridge w/o cyno), but allows a solo pilot of a ship of a hull type that's typically difficult to move around to navigate covertly and get where they want to go, giving the BLOPS a unique use and ability specific to their class.

Just because something's good, it doesn't make it bad- I don't understand the 'But it'll be good! we can't let that happen!' mentality a lot of people on the F&I have.

I feel there is no value inherent in being able to force pilots to use gates, in this context.

And by this context, I specifically mean the ship which would be used here, which would probably be either a T2 or Nulli T3, depending on circumstances. In addition to which, the cyno character is either a puppet alt, or simply one of the alleged fleet members who would have showed up that you implied above.

It being used in the cyno process itself is followed by it either logging off, or resuming fleet behavior.

So what is the actual difference?

1. Timesink. The cyno alt requires either prior preparation effort, or having your entire fleet twiddle their thumbs waiting for it to get into position. Any effort to organize your group of EVE players for this planned fun must account for this obstacle, or they must scrap the plans and find something else to do.
In my opinion, this is something to promote this change. Helping ships move more easily appears to improve things, in this context.

2. Reduced risk of using a lesser valued ship to scout with. That BLOPs, assuming it did not have a scout present to warn it, will be blind jumping into a hostile system. This opens up possibilities of human error, which could result in kill mails of one of the more expensive sub caps in the game.
If it DOES have a scout, which is more tactically sound, then the absence of a covert cyno is a trivial detail.
Either way, the BLOPs pilot will have their name appear in local, right next to the pilot who scouted for them.