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Eve Damage formula

Author
Soul Storm
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2014-07-03 01:11:19 UTC
Hello, I've been reading the Wiki on turret damage etc, but I still have a question that people can't answer me in-game.
Also, just to confirm i'll make some questions to be sure i'm getting this straight.

Lets say my ship has 50% EM Damage resistance (either shield or amor whatever), and someone were to shoot 100 EM damage at me, counting it was a perfect shot, would I only get 50 EM damage out of those 100 ?

Would this still apply if I had 99% EM Damage Resistance ? Would I only get 1 EM damage ?
Or even 100% EM Damage resistance ?


Is there a modifier somewhere after or before 50%, and is there anywhere I can check these numbers or formulas?


Thank you very much in advance.
L'ouris
Have Naught Subsidiaries
#2 - 2014-07-03 01:26:05 UTC
Turret damage is calculated first, with all mods from tracking and glancing-perfect shots etc.

That total dmg is then applied to your resists, the. The result is subtracted from your ship
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#3 - 2014-07-03 01:57:18 UTC
If the shot is 'perfect', it would actually deal 300 damage not 100 due to the turret formula (think of this as a 'critical hit', it happens 1% of shots fired, or on every successful hit, whichever is rarer).

Yes, you understand the resistance formula correctly. It is not possible to hit 100% resists because of diminishing returns - if you had 0 resists, and fitted 3 modules that give 50% EM resists, here's what would happen:


- First module: Full effect - resist 50%
- Second module: 87% effect due to stacking penalties, so this module provides 43.5% resists. You now take 43.5% less damage than you otherwise would have without it (actual damage suffered is 0.5 * 0.565 = 28.25%). The resist display will show you 72% resists although the game actually calculates based on 71.75%.
- Third module: 57% effect (stacking penalties). Again, multiplicatively stacking, I don't have a calculator handy but it will block 28.5% of the 28.25% of damage you still take, so your actual resist would be around 80%.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Soul Storm
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2014-07-03 02:29:46 UTC
Oh ok thanks, that's new knowledge, good to know.

So just to be sure, if supposedly I would take 100 damage with 0% resists, and I got 50% resists, that same 100 damage would deliver only 50 correct?
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#5 - 2014-07-03 03:00:50 UTC
Soul Storm wrote:
Oh ok thanks, that's new knowledge, good to know.

So just to be sure, if supposedly I would take 100 damage with 0% resists, and I got 50% resists, that same 100 damage would deliver only 50 correct?



Yep. Your shield would drop from 600/600 to 550/600, assuming a shot that would have done 100 EM damage on 0 resists hits your 50% EM resist.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Cara Forelli
State War Academy
Caldari State
#6 - 2014-07-03 03:34:04 UTC
Check out this video which doesn't directly answer your question but does discuss the related topic of tracking speed and turret mechanics and how they affect your damage. Very good info to understand.

Want to talk? Join my channel in game: House Forelli

Titan's Lament

Ethikos
Doomheim
#7 - 2014-07-03 04:21:34 UTC
As was mentioned above, understanding how the resists work is a very good first step. They got you squared away with that. Second is also understanding when damage will be applied or when damage will be applied for full effect. That is where tracking / distances / etc start to really come into play. The result is that in a lot of cases, going with lower damage weapons that tack / reach / apply damage better will actually produce more damage in game. As you start to delve into this, you realize how many trade offs you are making with you start selecting weapons / ships / tactics / etc. Its part of what makes this game so awesome.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2014-07-03 04:43:04 UTC
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
If the shot is 'perfect', it would actually deal 300 damage not 100 due to the turret formula (think of this as a 'critical hit', it happens 1% of shots fired, or on every successful hit, whichever is rarer).

Yes, you understand the resistance formula correctly. It is not possible to hit 100% resists because of diminishing returns - if you had 0 resists, and fitted 3 modules that give 50% EM resists, here's what would happen:


- First module: Full effect - resist 50%
- Second module: 87% effect due to stacking penalties, so this module provides 43.5% resists. You now take 43.5% less damage than you otherwise would have without it (actual damage suffered is 0.5 * 0.565 = 28.25%). The resist display will show you 72% resists although the game actually calculates based on 71.75%.
- Third module: 57% effect (stacking penalties). Again, multiplicatively stacking, I don't have a calculator handy but it will block 28.5% of the 28.25% of damage you still take, so your actual resist would be around 80%.

Actually, wasnt there an overheat bug that allowed expensive mods to reach at or over 100% resist? and the problem was, with the damage calculation, it came back as null damage which translatedto infinity? auto-popping the ship that supposedly had "perfect resists"?
Netan MalDoran
Hail To The King
The Silent Syndicate
#9 - 2014-07-03 05:23:42 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
[quote=Sabriz Adoudel]
Actually, wasnt there an overheat bug that allowed expensive mods to reach at or over 100% resist? and the problem was, with the damage calculation, it came back as null damage which translatedto infinity? auto-popping the ship that supposedly had "perfect resists"?


Yes, if you overhead officer resists in a class 2 Red Giant WH, the resists will be a little over 100% and your ship will pop if you take damage.

"Your security status has been lowered." - Hell yeah it was!

Falcon's truth

Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#10 - 2014-07-03 05:55:20 UTC
Netan MalDoran wrote:
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
[quote=Sabriz Adoudel]
Actually, wasnt there an overheat bug that allowed expensive mods to reach at or over 100% resist? and the problem was, with the damage calculation, it came back as null damage which translatedto infinity? auto-popping the ship that supposedly had "perfect resists"?


Yes, if you overhead officer resists in a class 2 Red Giant WH, the resists will be a little over 100% and your ship will pop if you take damage.


Yeah that's true (specifically in the ships that have the double-overheat-bonus role bonus) but it's pretty clearly a bug.

I do not like the way EVE does maths in some of these situations, mostly with bonused Webs.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2014-07-03 10:16:03 UTC
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Netan MalDoran wrote:
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
[quote=Sabriz Adoudel]
Actually, wasnt there an overheat bug that allowed expensive mods to reach at or over 100% resist? and the problem was, with the damage calculation, it came back as null damage which translatedto infinity? auto-popping the ship that supposedly had "perfect resists"?


Yes, if you overhead officer resists in a class 2 Red Giant WH, the resists will be a little over 100% and your ship will pop if you take damage.


Yeah that's true (specifically in the ships that have the double-overheat-bonus role bonus) but it's pretty clearly a bug.

I do not like the way EVE does maths in some of these situations, mostly with bonused Webs.


For some reason CCP has managed to take sqrt from negative numbers before with turret tracking so I'm not holding my breath on the other formulas being implemented correctly either.
Soul Storm
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2014-07-03 13:22:43 UTC
Wow, thanks alot for all the clear help everyone.
Learned alot, thank you.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#13 - 2014-07-03 17:42:12 UTC
Soul Storm wrote:
Hello, I've been reading the Wiki on turret damage etc, but I still have a question that people can't answer me in-game.
Also, just to confirm i'll make some questions to be sure i'm getting this straight.

Lets say my ship has 50% EM Damage resistance (either shield or amor whatever), and someone were to shoot 100 EM damage at me, counting it was a perfect shot, would I only get 50 EM damage out of those 100 ?

Would this still apply if I had 99% EM Damage Resistance ? Would I only get 1 EM damage ?
Or even 100% EM Damage resistance ?


Is there a modifier somewhere after or before 50%, and is there anywhere I can check these numbers or formulas?


Thank you very much in advance.

can someone help me make sense of ammo info window?
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#14 - 2014-07-03 18:50:02 UTC
while we're on the topic of obtuse mechanics, the 'rate of fire bonus' stat is actually a 'reduced time between shots' stat. if you were able to push it to 100%, you would not shoot twice as fast (as the name would suggest), but instantly empty your magazine (and probably capacitor, depending on weapon type).

I should buy an Ishtar.

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#15 - 2014-07-03 19:11:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Daniel Plain wrote:
while we're on the topic of obtuse mechanics, the 'rate of fire bonus' stat is actually a 'reduced time between shots' stat. if you were able to push it to 100%, you would not shoot twice as fast (as the name would suggest), but instantly empty your magazine (and probably capacitor, depending on weapon type).

Effective Damage = 1 / (1 - Cycle Reduction)

Example: 50% Cycle Reduction
Effective Damage = 1 / (1 - 50%) = 1 / 50% = 200%, or a 100% increase (double)

A 100% cycle reduction would cause a black hole to open and swallow the universe when using lasers with T1 crystals. Otherwise lasers would just be extremely OP (other crystals are equivalent to several thousand rounds of ammo).
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#16 - 2014-07-04 01:33:20 UTC
Soul Storm wrote:
Hello, I've been reading the Wiki on turret damage etc, but I still have a question that people can't answer me in-game.
Also, just to confirm i'll make some questions to be sure i'm getting this straight.

Lets say my ship has 50% EM Damage resistance (either shield or amor whatever), and someone were to shoot 100 EM damage at me, counting it was a perfect shot, would I only get 50 EM damage out of those 100 ?

Would this still apply if I had 99% EM Damage Resistance ? Would I only get 1 EM damage ?
Or even 100% EM Damage resistance ?


Is there a modifier somewhere after or before 50%, and is there anywhere I can check these numbers or formulas?


Thank you very much in advance.


Yes on the resistance % question.

Btw, you can't get 100% because how hardeners etc work.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Nikolai Lachance
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2014-07-04 03:22:09 UTC
I was under the impression (perhaps I am mistaken) that EVE hard-caps resists at 90%. It won't let them get higher than that. Is that not true?
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#18 - 2014-07-04 03:32:02 UTC
Nikolai Lachance wrote:
I was under the impression (perhaps I am mistaken) that EVE hard-caps resists at 90%. It won't let them get higher than that. Is that not true?


Over 90% is possible with some ships and clever fitting. I've seen 94% stats on some ships.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#19 - 2014-07-04 04:47:09 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
Nikolai Lachance wrote:
I was under the impression (perhaps I am mistaken) that EVE hard-caps resists at 90%. It won't let them get higher than that. Is that not true?


Over 90% is possible with some ships and clever fitting. I've seen 94% stats on some ships.



Deep Space Transports can (temporarily) get much higher than that.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com

Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2014-07-04 04:59:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Cannibal Kane
Jabbering in Local + Kane in System(10 x If Home System) = Wardec

I found that to be a pretty accurate formula.

Not to mention plenty of variations which could = into a wardec.

On a more on topic note.

Majority of my ships has 94% resist as their top resist. So it is possible to get above 90%. If you fit the protues right you can get all your armor resist above 90%.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk

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