Skill Discussions

As i see it the idea was introduced to make jump clones a little more useful in terms of a pve,training/ pvp trade off.

which i think is a great idea, However as the skill stands i haven't trained it and wont. this skill at level 5 give s you 19 hours between jumps. Bluntly this is useless its still a full day and in real life terms amounts to me still making a decision between training or pvp.... but why is this? whats the down side to me say on a Saturday being in my pve/ training clone what have you. Then deciding i want to pvp with some friends. and later that night switching back to my training clone..

basically my idea is this why not change the skill so that at level 5 its 12 hours... i cant find a down side, and i would actually train this skill.

The general idea is, you have to plan for tomorrow.
So lets say you jump into a PVE clone today at 02:00, because that's what time you log in every day. You can PVE for 4 or 5 hours, or 2 or whatever you want, then log out. Then tomorrow, as soon as you log in, (your regular time frame), you can jump back to a PVP clone. With the skill at 3, you could log in a couple hours early and still clone jump asap.

Yeah, I know everyone already knows this... just sayin' that it's still a good skill as it is, and way better than things were before. Remember that jumping isn't just about skilling, it's also about locations. The original intent was to limit how fast you could change location. You just have to plan ahead.

Not being negative about your idea though. 12 hours would be great. Train all night, play all day. Or PVE in the mornings and PVP in the evenings.

i don't want to re state my opinions if your curious there here.. well untill a dev cleans my split post up

same topic

Somebody finds it useful but you don't. Better delete the skill!

19 hours is already to much, this crap should be on a 48hour window.

You can already teleportt around on 2 min timer.

Up to approx 50 mil SP the cost of the medical clone is pretty much irrelevant allowing the mobility and rapid change of fleet compositions described in there - yet it does not seem to be common tactics. Up to around 90 mil SP the cost is still ok for few pod-express jumps if you need to. Somewhere around 150 mil it gets to the area where most people will consider if they really need to jump but it is still cheaper than doing the 40+ jumps trip.

Then you would have to take into account that each account has 3 character slots. You can do very competent character if suitable focused within 50 mil SP envelope. For covering most of the fleet doctrines with acceptable competence around 25 mil sp is sufficient. Around 40..45 mil SP is good ballpark for well skilled capital alt (although for capitals the mobility is non-issue in general anyway). For example: Laser focused Scimi alt takes around 12..13 mil SP, with few million more SP you can make it use minmatar recons and do cov ops cynos as well for added utility - all that at the cost of power of 2 + 1 plex for added 30d for recons and the cost of char transfer.

Above ~100 mil SP all that SP does for you is making your clones cost more in essence. Sure, you can drag few percentage points here and there but for null sec fleets it does not matter anymore for all practical purposes.

Throw in there the suitcase carriers, titan bridges and jump bridge networks and the jump clone timer becomes irrelevant for the purposes of the power projection. All it affects is some fresh players or not-properly-organized who do not have enough alts and/or assets to play in the league they want to. And ofc some casuals who would like to jump into implant free clone for some "operation" and then back into their care-bear clone at the end of the evening for scraping out these few thousand extra SP over the night.

Properly organized entity can have these different fleet compositions prepared in their staging stations, they can conduct an operation in one end of the EVE universe, dock up somewhere with medical, change the clone location to the other staging station at the opposing end of the universe undock with their pods, gets smartbombed and be 100 lightyears away in less than 2 minutes undocking with the right doctrine ships after updating their medical clones. All it takes is a corporate office near the target. If nothing is prepared all it takes is one cyno alt to make it there, rent an office (if everyone is in one corp) and then you can send in suitable number of suitcase carriers and just pod-express there.

So claims about mobility in regards of jump-clone timers are utterly unjustified under the current meta in EVE in my opinion.

The problem is not with the jump clones .... but with learning attribute enhancements through implants.

Sure, but my point is not about complexity or fairness but restriction of PvP (aka fun play, IMO). The only reason ever broad up by people who want to reduce the cooldown between jumps, is the long term decision between Learning/PvE and PvP. Changing the jump clone mechanic is like increasing the symptomatic medication with severe side effects instead of curing the cause. But I don't want to hijack the thread, the implants are discussed in another thread.

I never use my clones for moving places, but a lot of my ships demand specific implant sets. Damnation? slaves.. scimi.. special set for that, scanning ships.. yeah the sisters set. and while the new navy mindlinks have made it much easier still the whole wrong mindlink in problem (maxed leadership ftw)

which means I can easily miss a fleet if I am in the wrong clone.

that said.. 19 hours is more then enough. please dont lower it further. the skill mentioned is insanely useful and doesn't need further buffing. there needs to be a drawback to specialized clones as the bonus you get from that is so big. (thats what she said? oh wait.. i did say that.. so yes that is what she said).

a choice should have consequences, and if you can just change clones like you change panties then what is the point?