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Dev blog: Starbase changes for Crius

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Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#21 - 2014-06-16 15:07:24 UTC
timm mmah wrote:
So if the compressed ores will only need 100 of the base ores, where will that change be made? Will the compressed ores yield less than the current sheet indicates, or will the base ores yield less?



Yields were also in the old dev blog
Ereshgikal
Wharf Crusaders
#22 - 2014-06-16 15:08:52 UTC
Dev Blog wrote:
We are modifiying those so that starting local jobs in the same solar system the blueprint is in doesn't require any skill, while each level of Supply Chain Management and Scientific Networking increase job starting distance by 5 jumps, up to a total distance of 25 jumps. This reduces dependency on region boundaries which may actually be closer than 25 jumps in some cases.


So I will be able to start R&D and Manufacturing jobs in regions other than the one I am in? This is very nice! :D
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#23 - 2014-06-16 15:09:26 UTC
I think it was Fozzie that mentioned earlier about anchoring and onlining douchebag stuff

If we anchor and online several assy arrays before a job, then offline and unanchor after the job to save isk on install what repercussions will there be.

It was mentioned before in the previous thread and the threats were pretty broad, I just kinda want that updated in this thread before the 5675866758587587 questions get asked.
Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
#24 - 2014-06-16 15:12:49 UTC
A question regarding bpo's being currently researched.

So.. what happens to all the BPO's that are currently being researched in Eve. Lets say I have a 30 day ME research project going, and Crius drops....

What happens to the currently research BPO?

Yaay!!!!
Ereshgikal
Wharf Crusaders
#25 - 2014-06-16 15:13:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Ereshgikal
Sentient Blade wrote:
Lowsec is getting a 10% material bonus for T2? That's close to 80 or 90 million ISK for certain ships! i.e. the entire profit margin.


How did you arrive at 10% material bonus for T2 for low-sec only?

Edit: Guessing it is this part:
"10% reduction in manufacturing required materials and may only be anchored in low-security solar systems. It may only be used to build Capital Construction Components and Advanced Capital Construction Components."

The only T2 ship that this applies to is JF (ok, Blops use jump drives, but they are not a big part of the total cost). I am totally fine with low-sec getting a buff wrt JF manufacturing.
MaverickG
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#26 - 2014-06-16 15:17:23 UTC
I usually never reply to Dev Blogs but this time I would like to give my opinion to a couple things I do not understand or do not agree with.

1.) I like opening up .8 and above to starbases, but I would like to see the faction standing requirement stay in place. There does need to be a cost of entry to dropping a POS in High Sec.

2.) I don't mind having blueprints required in POS to run the manufacturing ( I like the use of the term "physically available" used in this part of the blog), but I would like to see a way to Lock them down there. In fact, blue print locking and (mostly) unlocking needs to be readdressed since it's a complete pain. I have submitted several complaints and tickets on this. I believe a minor UI change would remedy 75% of the problem.

3.) I am also concerned about market stability once these changes take place, will they be implemented in stages like kronos has been?
timm mmah
Doomheim
#27 - 2014-06-16 15:20:06 UTC
Kenneth Feld wrote:
timm mmah wrote:
So if the compressed ores will only need 100 of the base ores, where will that change be made? Will the compressed ores yield less than the current sheet indicates, or will the base ores yield less?



Yields were also in the old dev blog


So you're saying that those yields are all based on the 100 units for compression? If so, that's a wonderful thing, but seems a little too good to be true.
probag Bear
Xiong Offices
#28 - 2014-06-16 15:20:58 UTC
Could you clarify this:
Quote:
Whole and single items will not be affected by this calculation. This is most relevant for Tech I items required to manufacture Tech II variations. For example, building 10 Paladins will not require 9 Apocalypse if you have a 10% ME.


What exactly qualifies as "whole and single items"? For example, a Damage Control II only requires 1 Morphite currently. How are you distinguishing that situation, from say an Ishtar that only requires 1 Vexor?
(as in, I want to get my tools properly updated well before Crius)
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#29 - 2014-06-16 15:21:16 UTC
Ereshgikal wrote:
Sentient Blade wrote:
Lowsec is getting a 10% material bonus for T2? That's close to 80 or 90 million ISK for certain ships! i.e. the entire profit margin.


How did you arrive at 10% material bonus for T2 for low-sec only?

Edit: Guessing it is this part:
"10% reduction in manufacturing required materials and may only be anchored in low-security solar systems. It may only be used to build Capital Construction Components and Advanced Capital Construction Components."

The only T2 ship that this applies to is JF (ok, Blops use jump drives, but they are not a big part of the total cost). I am totally fine with low-sec getting a buff wrt JF manufacturing.


You're right, it was that part. I missed the second line.
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#30 - 2014-06-16 15:24:38 UTC
The screenshot for the Thukker array says you can build T2 components and T3 components in it. The dev blog says capital & advanced capital only. Can you confirm which is correct?
Llawa
Perkone
Caldari State
#31 - 2014-06-16 15:26:42 UTC
Generic moan about time spent on anchoring 5 for POS gunner skills
Theodore Knox
Ducks in Outer Space
#32 - 2014-06-16 15:30:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Theodore Knox
Interesting...

Quote:
Structure cost scaling

Removing slots from industry jobs discourage players from stacking more than one Starbase structure of the same type at a Control Tower. To counteract this point, we are going to give specific bonuses when Starbase structures of the same type are stacked together at the same control tower.

This bonus is going to be a flat reduction on the whole job cost price, whose amount and total bonus varies depending on the Starbase structure itself.


Let's pretend I'm a small scale T2 croozer manufacturer...

So, to get the full benefit to reduced job costs, I'm going to need a Large Caldari tower, with 50 component assembly arrays, to get a 25% edge on the install cost all my component jobs.

Now, I'm a small scale producer, so I'm not likely to run this sort of set up all month, every month. I'm going to want to throw in some other modules to do other jobs on my shiny new large pos. So there'll be 13 Medium Ship Assembly Arrays too.

When I want to switch back and forth between them, that's a lot of off-lining and on-lining to do, unless I sink more isk into pos costs and get me a second large tower - destroying my margins further. And then my head starts to hurt, because I'm trying to work out, how many jobs at 25% lpwer install cost am I going to need to run to break even on the pos fuel costs.

Have you any idea how cluttered my tower is going to be? I make it 63 assembly arrays alone... This is a profoundly messy game mechanic.

Can you please fix the stupid mess that is the starbase code - and find a better way to implement these changes, so that both we as players, and you as developers, can have a better experience all round.
MailDeadDrop
Archon Industries
#33 - 2014-06-16 15:30:23 UTC
Yoda-speak:
Quote:
Advanced Assembly arrays no longer 10% have material waste.


MDD
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#34 - 2014-06-16 15:31:14 UTC
timm mmah wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
timm mmah wrote:
So if the compressed ores will only need 100 of the base ores, where will that change be made? Will the compressed ores yield less than the current sheet indicates, or will the base ores yield less?



Yields were also in the old dev blog


So you're saying that those yields are all based on the 100 units for compression? If so, that's a wonderful thing, but seems a little too good to be true.



Remember, we don't get 100% refine anymore, you have to multilpy the output by your reprocessing percentage. 72% should equal todays 100%
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#35 - 2014-06-16 15:32:59 UTC
Phoenix Jones wrote:
A question regarding bpo's being currently researched.

So.. what happens to all the BPO's that are currently being researched in Eve. Lets say I have a 30 day ME research project going, and Crius drops....

What happens to the currently research BPO?




The finish researcha nd are delivered to where they would be pre patch, then the BPO goes thru the conversion from post research number to post patch number
CCP Ytterbium
C C P
C C P Alliance
#36 - 2014-06-16 15:38:20 UTC
timm mmah wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
timm mmah wrote:
So if the compressed ores will only need 100 of the base ores, where will that change be made? Will the compressed ores yield less than the current sheet indicates, or will the base ores yield less?



Yields were also in the old dev blog


So you're saying that those yields are all based on the 100 units for compression? If so, that's a wonderful thing, but seems a little too good to be true.


To make things clearer:


  • OLD: one unit of Compressed Veldspar has a volume of 417m3 and is made from 166,500 units of regular Veldspar. Reprocessing Veldspar required a batch of 333 units to get 1000 units of Tritanium. Thus one unit of Compressed Veldspar would hold 500,000 units of Tritanium. Total volume for Tritanium in Compressed Veldspar is 5000m3, thus compression ratio is approximately 12 (with old 100% reprocessing rate).

  • NEW: one unit of Compressed Veldspar has a volume of 0.15m3 and is made from 100 units of regular Veldspar. Reprocessing Veldspar now requires a batch of 100 units to get 415 units of Tritanium. Thus one unit of Compressed Veldspar now holds 415 units of Tritanium. Total volume for Tritanium in Compressed Veldspar is 4.15m3. 100% compression would be around 27.7, however max reprocessing rate now is 72.4% for high-sec, giving a compression of around 20. A fully upgraded reprocessing Minmatar outpost would have 86.8% reprocessing rate, thus the compression would climb to around 24 there.


When Crius hits, we will make sure to update stacks of Compressed Ores to make sure you keep the same amount of final minerals.
CCP Ytterbium
C C P
C C P Alliance
#37 - 2014-06-16 15:39:33 UTC
Retar Aveymone wrote:
The screenshot for the Thukker array says you can build T2 components and T3 components in it. The dev blog says capital & advanced capital only. Can you confirm which is correct?


Thukker Component Assembly Array will only be able to build Capital and Advanced Capital Components, description is being fixed, thanks for pointing that out citizen.
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#38 - 2014-06-16 15:40:18 UTC
Is there a real benefit to having 8 million different assembly arrays? Why not use this chance to combine arrays and stop confusing poor new people with component assembly arrays vs. subsystem assembly arrays vs. equipment assembly arrays?

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
Seith Kali
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#39 - 2014-06-16 15:45:59 UTC
Two step wrote:
Is there a real benefit to having 8 million different assembly arrays? Why not use this chance to combine arrays and stop confusing poor new people with component assembly arrays vs. subsystem assembly arrays vs. equipment assembly arrays?


So you can't have a swiss-army tower. This is good complexity.

Apprentice Goonswarm Economic Warfare Consultant - Drowning in entitlement and privilege. 
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#40 - 2014-06-16 15:50:46 UTC
Could I ask for some clarification on one point? I don't think I fully understand the change to Supply Chain Management (SCM) and Scientific Networking. Are you removing the regional restriction for starting RAM jobs remotely? For example, if I had SCM trained to 1, could I start a job in Muvolailen (The Citadel) from Jita (The Forge)?

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.