Player Features and Ideas Discussion

To accurately convey the idea of a fraction, you should have said "Hulks to Skiffs". Thus the confusion.


The point is that these problems are counter productive to getting pilots to fleet together. Do you disagree with that?

solo miner = solo player? Hmmm that's funny, i didn't realize that if i'm a solo miner i have to solo everything else in game too.. Very interesting.

A 5 man incursion pays each pilot 50,000isk and 50 CONCORD LP and takes 1-3 minutes to complete. That's 250,000isk and 250LP every 1-3 minutes total. Thats up to 15mil and 15,000LP per hour. So the L4 mission rewards are worth 5x this amount? (it's been a while since i missioned so I'm not actually sure if it is or isn't)

Ultimately I think the situation comes as follows.

High Sec: Vast amounts of easy ore with little to no non-play risk

Low Sec: Order of Magnitude higher but Risk return on a venture is enough that these ships are much more manageable to take into lower sec space as well as limited WH envoy's.

NPC-Null-sec: Almost never a good idea to have operations in unless it is not frequently bubbled or camped. Rewards are pretty decent for a ninja fleet, but nothing super amazing.

Sov-Null: King Big Nuts, you live and work here with usually less people traffic than high-sec at nearly 4 to 5 times the rate of return because of Rorqual boosting. Less time is needed in a belt to make a safe profit or operational activity.

Predictions based on coming events:

Low ends will no longer be purchased out of High-sec and shipped to null for production, It is no longer a short fall for low end minerals in null with coming changes.

High-end minerals will see a boom in prices and shipped almost exclusively from null with a limited and even scarce supply coming from module reprocessing. However, this will bring a increase in module reprocessing and volume of consumption and more demand for mission running and clean-up services may occur.

High-sec solo miners will be slowly contracted out or banding together, profits mining alone are paled in comparison to running in a boosted operation, solo miners will submit to entities like CODEdot or shackle on to Industrial corp ore buying programs.

New mining players currently will be subjected to the fruits and failures of the general problems inherent of being a noob losing their ships doing dumb things in low and null-sec(they already are) and either quit there or find something safer; A few cunning and well guided newbies will learn the tricks of the trade and thrive in this environment. Slowly they will either develop a distaste for mining in such a small ship and work to a procurer or retriever and follow into null-sec or low sec corps as players. The players who fail initially will have the hardest time going back to try it, as it will scare them with the inevitable stage most newbies reach being unable to buy even the simplest of commodities for a fair amount of time.

I know that when I was a new fresh faced bright eyed minmatar pilot, that I wanted to fly the biggest ship with the largest alpha strike format in the game: The Maelstrom. I also was attempting to run my account on plex, as you may guess This took a while, and I would occasionally be set back on ISK far enough I would have to wait until I could buy a month and generate isk again for more plex.

My playing of the game at that time was dependent on the grinding of isk to keep playing, what I fear, is that it will be so far out of a new players reach to plex an account that many will not stay in long solely for that reason alone. Can you imagine the weight of having to grind almost a billion isk on a fresh character with no guidance to try and keep playing this game?

It's not a fun thought to have that kind of pressure on a new player, and so the learning cliff of EVE continues to raise it's peak on a mountain of newbie blood and corpses with the bar being set ever higher to not pay a flat subscription fee.

However, I am a scumbag and have my account paid for me by glorious friends who work for a living

Before anybody asks: The EHP numbers for all three Th/Kn tanked Exhumers against Coercer/Conflagration are virtually identical to those against Void, yet the Coercer only does 10080 damage in 18 seconds w/ heat.

So the previous conclusions still stands: Miners tank against Th/Kn, gankers always use Catalysts.

yes i do. Pilots have been able to share since this game started. They are not problems, ur doing it wrong.


and here u are being obtuse again.



yes level 4's certainly pay better than that.

The blockade level 4 gives ~21mil in bounties, 3.5mil rewards and 6975LP
Ive ran this mission with three ppl and got it down to less than 6 minutes. Im pretty confident 5 ppl can run it and hand it in 4.

so thats 315mil bounties/hour. 52.5mil/hour in rewards. 104 625LP's/hour

split that between the 5 and u get 70+mil/hour in isk, 20kLP's/hour per person.


there will definitely be lower earners than the blockade though. Things like angel extravaganza can be longer because of numerous accel gates. But u'll still earn more than 15mil per hour per person in isk. Running with an astarte (thats less than optimal) and a noob in a kestrel, we were each getting ticks of 5-10mil every 20 minutes. And thats with the noob contributing less than 70dps and me mwd'ing all over the place between rats. Incursions make more money from their LP store however, but i dnt think its enough. U really wanna do higher level incursions for better pay.

The other advantage of running missions in groups is that withseveral ppl pulling missions u dnt have to dock up as much and u can be more picky about which missions u take.



if that fleet is using boosts then no its not solo play. if its using a scout then no its not solo play. If its using a cyno then no its not solo play.

Only if those in his fleet are his alts would i consider it solo play.

There are players in the game that have learned to avoid 'group play' due to bad experiences. I am one of those.

Don't worry about the dedicated solo miners.
CCP doesn't.
CCP thinks there are so few of us, our absence from the game wouldn't even be noticed.
I hope they're right, but I doubt it.

I will be mining in high sec until one of three things happens:
a> my account runs out (in November) and I decide I no longer need to play this game.
b> CCP makes solo mining in high sec so unprofitable, it simply isn't done anymore.
c> CCP enacts a means for miners to fight back (not playing 'turtle', but actually shooting back)

I believe "A" will occur
"B" looks like a good chance after "A" happens (which could of kill the game)
"C" doesn't look to be even an outside chance (at least, not soon enough to save the game if "B" happens).

Aalysia falls under a common archetype we've seen already demonstrated, she has no interest in actually being a community member hence mining alone. She works alone for her own profit, and has no intention of considering the practical options aside from just increased yield and volume cash income on a personal level.

She is the Archetype of the solo miner, she wants a I win defense button over being ganked. If you really don't want to be ganked you tank fit and mine in about .6-.7 space with a buffer tank fit to prevent alpha striking. You mark people with proper tags and standings, and watch local carefully. You also don't behave lazily and use proper storage and transport or you dock up to empty your hold. It is foolish to assume mining will ever be 'unprofitable' no matter where you do it, save perhaps the undock of Jita 4-4. Proper return on investment assessment and general fiscal safety practice chanted over and over : Don't fly, what you can't afford to lose because you will.

I have linked multiple Killmails where I have fought off aggressors in my home space in a Procurer, I caused a Sabre to flee in terror from having a point and drones on him just today. There is no reason, no excuse, and no doubt that you are now able to fair better situations where all you need to do is survive. This is not a single player game, you will play with others, positive or negative but you will have internet in your internet spaceships.

I know many people who fail to understand that EVE is a game, where you are not ever 'safe' but that does not mean you can not be at least more secure and thrive in a hostile environment. Code has already been in this thread as well as other gankers, demonstrating clearly how it's easier to work in a group to overcome a problem than most individuals who will struggle slowly along through one.

I've been **** posting in this thread for a week now, and the topic still hasn't been ended when it's pretty much a dead end issue. The coming indy changes are a needed change, High-sec was not ever intended to be a place where people sit comfortably and guzzle on isk faucets with little risk, thats not player or community development game design in a sandbox.

Can we gas this thing yet?

Just to be clear, mining is a handout.

Not to the miner, stars no.... but to those who would hunt miners.

Beyond gates themselves, and the corresponding gate camps, I can think of no occupation whose participation makes you easier to locate.
You HAVE to be around asteroids, in order to mine.

Now sure, like nearly everything else in EVE, being a part of a competent group drastically increases your odds of survival.
But, like dating in social situations, finding that group is not simple for everyone. Quite often it is simply not an option people have.

Let's not pretend we have a universally available solution called grouping, when it is simply not available reliably.

Who has time for mining when there are sov mechanics to manage?

When I can see who is ninja looting wrecks in missions and fleet engagements during combat this is in no way OP, it's a necessary function of group dynamics and should definitely be implemented. Make things easy for people to do things together; Core of sandbox elements.

First of all, if I'm mining and a ganker shows, I want to shoot back. Why is that so cotton-picking hard to understand?

Second, I do not have the funds or the computer to run multiple characters at a time, so I am doing what I like with the one (which does NOT include hunting for PvP).
I am aware I can have 3 on one account and see no reason to go thru the hassel of turning off the training for one just to train another when the first can have the training of both. and I do not have the funds to do that 'two-character' training BS.