These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Test Server Feedback

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Crius] Reprocessing feedback

First post First post
Author
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#21 - 2014-06-10 18:18:31 UTC
Darkblad wrote:
Rowells wrote:
other than the blueprints and hard values, has the way compression on the rorqual changed at all?

I can't seem to get sisi to work...
The Compression Array works fine. Select something first and right click that.

(Though the presence of compression blueprints might be a hint to that it doesn't work for the Rorqual yet)

I got sis to work and tested it on rorqual. It is instantaneous (cheers of happiness) and simple. Relieved they didn't leave my baby behind on these changes. and yes all my bpos are gone, with a decent return from CCP.

Gonna get to work trying out the other reprocessing stuff.
Darkblad
Doomheim
#22 - 2014-06-10 18:28:19 UTC
Arronicus wrote:
Darkblad wrote:


Also:
If I remember correctly, a block of compressed ore is made of a batch of the raw ore (100 units).


While correct for Arkonor and a couple others, this is incorrect for most other ores.

Compression values chart

Ore refine values

You'll notice in most cases the volume of minerals in 1 compressed ore block is not 100 units of the raw ore, so it's not safe to maintain this assumption, while it does work for your arkonor example.
It changed to "100 units buld a block" after release of the blog. CCP Ytterbium announced that change on March 31.

NPEISDRIP

Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#23 - 2014-06-10 18:31:25 UTC
were all stations supposed to recieve reproccessing arrays or was I mistaken?
Jinn Aideron
#24 - 2014-06-10 18:40:43 UTC
Aryth wrote:
Man, the art team really phone it in on the new reprocessing button eh.
Both industry and its derivative reprocessing icon scale down really badly in Neocom. Tiny outline plus antialiasing...

And frankly, Industrial Revolution age archetype "factory" iconography was the best you could come up with for a warp-driven space game civilization? (These ill-sized side windows on it? Hilariously bad. Smile)


Personally, I'm dreading the time when all icons, the Store being the sole exception, will have turned single-color, blunt, uninspired, not telling anything anymore.
What?

Stealth deletes are bad.

mynnna
State War Academy
Caldari State
#25 - 2014-06-10 19:10:07 UTC  |  Edited by: mynnna
Arronicus wrote:
Sales Alt negrodamus wrote:
Alright, I'll start.

* Reprocessing shows a bonus from scrapmetal processing, and I don't have that skill.

Its' kinda unclear if you don't realize how the multipliers work. I'd suggest simply not showing it at all.


Eve is a game designed for intelligent individuals, if every thing that might confuse some people were hidden, it'd quickly become a very dumbed down and frustrating to use game. Seeing possible options like this laid out for you not only shows players what else they can train for increased efficiency without having to refer to external sites, but shows that there IS something that they could train up to increase that efficiency. As such, I think Eve players are better as a whole with it there, and some individuals being confused, and asking.

Might be true but (and I say this without seeing what he's looking at) "fighting the interface" is dumb no matter how smart the players are supposed to be.

So here I suppose it's a matter of whether the info is being conveyed clearly or not.

Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal

Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#26 - 2014-06-10 19:19:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Steve Ronuken
Just tried reprocessing a couple of things in station.

I'm seeing a consistant set of multipliers, but an inconsistant percentage return.

Equipment array is showing 56%
Fuel blocks are showing 49%

(scrap metal reprocessing 2 1.1 multiplier shown., no standings in station 0.95 multiplier)

(just an edit to be clear: I've stuck in a bug report)

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#27 - 2014-06-10 20:32:22 UTC
mynnna wrote:
Arronicus wrote:
Sales Alt negrodamus wrote:
Alright, I'll start.

* Reprocessing shows a bonus from scrapmetal processing, and I don't have that skill.

Its' kinda unclear if you don't realize how the multipliers work. I'd suggest simply not showing it at all.


Eve is a game designed for intelligent individuals, if every thing that might confuse some people were hidden, it'd quickly become a very dumbed down and frustrating to use game. Seeing possible options like this laid out for you not only shows players what else they can train for increased efficiency without having to refer to external sites, but shows that there IS something that they could train up to increase that efficiency. As such, I think Eve players are better as a whole with it there, and some individuals being confused, and asking.

Might be true but (and I say this without seeing what he's looking at) "fighting the interface" is dumb no matter how smart the players are supposed to be.

So here I suppose it's a matter of whether the info is being conveyed clearly or not.


agree with the fighting the interface part, but don't judge stuff you haven't seen Cool

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis

CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#28 - 2014-06-10 20:33:26 UTC
Jinn Aideron wrote:
  • There is no multi-selection in reprocessing window. -- You are presented with very nice visual clues, warning signs, etc. When you then want to ACT on these, you have so select,right-click,remove every single element on its own!
  • Allow us to DRAG things out of the window for 'remove', just as we now drag them in to 'add'.

When I picture this window in its finished state: awesome! Big smile Can't wait.


unfortunately dragging items out of the window and dropping them somewhere in the void doesn't work very well in EVE so we couldn't make that happen this time

multiselect is something we might look into

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis

Noriko Mai
#29 - 2014-06-10 21:34:10 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
Jinn Aideron wrote:
  • There is no multi-selection in reprocessing window. -- You are presented with very nice visual clues, warning signs, etc. When you then want to ACT on these, you have so select,right-click,remove every single element on its own!
  • Allow us to DRAG things out of the window for 'remove', just as we now drag them in to 'add'.

When I picture this window in its finished state: awesome! Big smile Can't wait.


unfortunately dragging items out of the window and dropping them somewhere in the void doesn't work very well in EVE so we couldn't make that happen this time

multiselect is something we might look into

multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, *stomp stomp* Smile

"Meh.." - Albert Einstein

CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#30 - 2014-06-10 21:40:19 UTC
Noriko Mai wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:
Jinn Aideron wrote:
  • There is no multi-selection in reprocessing window. -- You are presented with very nice visual clues, warning signs, etc. When you then want to ACT on these, you have so select,right-click,remove every single element on its own!
  • Allow us to DRAG things out of the window for 'remove', just as we now drag them in to 'add'.

When I picture this window in its finished state: awesome! Big smile Can't wait.


unfortunately dragging items out of the window and dropping them somewhere in the void doesn't work very well in EVE so we couldn't make that happen this time

multiselect is something we might look into

multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, multiselect, *stomp stomp* Smile


worst case scenario you just close the window and open it again and don't add ALL THE ITEMS, but just the ones you're going to reprocess Blink

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis

Darkblad
Doomheim
#31 - 2014-06-10 22:26:12 UTC
looks @CCP_Punkturis, pointing at https://twitter.com/Darkblad_eve/status/448194987843678208

NPEISDRIP

Arronicus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#32 - 2014-06-10 22:28:07 UTC
Darkblad wrote:
Arronicus wrote:
Darkblad wrote:


Also:
If I remember correctly, a block of compressed ore is made of a batch of the raw ore (100 units).


While correct for Arkonor and a couple others, this is incorrect for most other ores.

Compression values chart

Ore refine values

You'll notice in most cases the volume of minerals in 1 compressed ore block is not 100 units of the raw ore, so it's not safe to maintain this assumption, while it does work for your arkonor example.
It changed to "100 units buld a block" after release of the blog. CCP Ytterbium announced that change on March 31.


No clue how I missed that one; thanks
Tash'k Omar
Indefinite Mass
#33 - 2014-06-10 22:47:34 UTC
Cristl wrote:
I've asked this before, but I'd love an official response (and if there's a time to ask, it's now).

Almost all industrial processes in Eve require time: whether it be researching, copying, mining or building, your character has to wait it out. However, you can smelt millions of tons of ore instantly.

Isn't that both counter-intuitive and somewhat counter to general Eve principles? Most stuff is designed to take time and be faster with more corpmates involved. But the refining requirements of an entire alliance can be done by a single character.

It's weird. Let me just say that I don't want to arbitrarily increase anyone's grind, but assigning skills to tasks with instant duration is bad game design. It allows single alts to do the work of nations, and means that newbies with mediocre refining skills cannot market those skills.

Obviously refining could be set up and left while you did other things or logged off. Also, aspects such as mining, manufacturing or copying could be sped up to compensate – there's no need for the overall time to market for goods to increase.

If refining took time, there would be a refining mini-profession: more people would need to chip-in in larger corporations, and newbies with fair-to-middling refining skills could still be of use. Imagine if they could accept refining contracts from industrial big-shots and make a little extra cash while they run their level two missions. It's an MMO remember: the more interaction the better.

And if POSes then needed an extra buff to refining (over the proposed buff in Crius), who would object?

ps. If they want to combine refining and reprocessing into one word, then smelting would make more sense than reprocessing.



As much as I would hate having to wait for reprocessing, I think this is a very interesting idea, and overall would be happy if it were implemented.

It would also allow you to tweak the Rorqual to make it a viable ship again (Add the ability to reprocess with bonus to speed/yield).
Circumstantial Evidence
#34 - 2014-06-10 23:24:17 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
worst case scenario you just close the window and open it again and don't add ALL THE ITEMS, but just the ones you're going to reprocess Blink
Please bring back my spreadsheets-in-space, so I can have friendly, visually oriented checkboxes to un-check Smile The "input materials" pane looks like an inventory window that is set to view contents as icons. OK... I just found "remove item" on the context menu per item, so base functionality is somewhat preserved. But... a "spreadsheet" - um, bad word - a "list" view (optional) with checkboxes to un-check, should also be possible, and would preserve expectations. Please consider adding the familiar icon/list/details buttons that are present in the upper right of inventory windows, to this UI. Big smile
Circumstantial Evidence
#35 - 2014-06-11 00:39:48 UTC
  • Tooltip text: "Warning: non-repackaged and valuable item"
  • I think this should be: "...OR valuable item"
    (Because the warning is shown for "valuable" items that are packaged, with the quantity text box visible.)

  • Assembled (non-repackaged) items with low value may not always show the Warning icon.
  • Example: Tech 1 100mm armor plates (all meta levels) - just stripped from a ship... no warning icon.

  • "-1" quantity shown for assembled (non-repackaged) item looks odd.
  • I don't think it should be necessary to display a quantity text box, assembled items can't be stacked.
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#36 - 2014-06-11 00:45:55 UTC
Reprocessed roughly 4 billion minerals in various amounts

No matter what, volume was ALWAYS 0.07m3

It basically only counts one of each mineral in the output screen it seems, it forgets to multiply by the number of each of the reprocessed minerals.
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#37 - 2014-06-11 04:45:46 UTC
We need a list view so we can copy pasta things into our spreadsheets :3

The Drake is a Lie

Velicitia
XS Tech
#38 - 2014-06-11 11:20:32 UTC
Tash'k Omar wrote:
Cristl wrote:
I've asked this before, but I'd love an official response (and if there's a time to ask, it's now).

Almost all industrial processes in Eve require time: whether it be researching, copying, mining or building, your character has to wait it out. However, you can smelt millions of tons of ore instantly.

Isn't that both counter-intuitive and somewhat counter to general Eve principles? Most stuff is designed to take time and be faster with more corpmates involved. But the refining requirements of an entire alliance can be done by a single character.

It's weird. Let me just say that I don't want to arbitrarily increase anyone's grind, but assigning skills to tasks with instant duration is bad game design. It allows single alts to do the work of nations, and means that newbies with mediocre refining skills cannot market those skills.

Obviously refining could be set up and left while you did other things or logged off. Also, aspects such as mining, manufacturing or copying could be sped up to compensate – there's no need for the overall time to market for goods to increase.

If refining took time, there would be a refining mini-profession: more people would need to chip-in in larger corporations, and newbies with fair-to-middling refining skills could still be of use. Imagine if they could accept refining contracts from industrial big-shots and make a little extra cash while they run their level two missions. It's an MMO remember: the more interaction the better.

And if POSes then needed an extra buff to refining (over the proposed buff in Crius), who would object?

ps. If they want to combine refining and reprocessing into one word, then smelting would make more sense than reprocessing.



As much as I would hate having to wait for reprocessing, I think this is a very interesting idea, and overall would be happy if it were implemented.

It would also allow you to tweak the Rorqual to make it a viable ship again (Add the ability to reprocess with bonus to speed/yield).



TBH, it's because repro is "backwards" from everything else.

Mining is the time-sink ... and repro is the "instant" (well except in POS, which takes 10 sec).

Manufacturing, Research, etc have the "instant" at the beginning (BP -> Install -> Mats + Cost Confirmation -> Accept) and then the time-sink is afterwards.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia

Darkblad
Doomheim
#39 - 2014-06-11 11:39:39 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
Mining is the time-sink ... and repro is the "instant" (well except in POS, which takes 10 sec).
POS Reprocessing currently happens instantly as well - at least the highsec usable "Reprocessing Array". The attribute isn't active (neither is the yield multiplier).

NPEISDRIP

AZON21AUG
State War Academy
Caldari State
#40 - 2014-06-11 11:44:40 UTC
Built a new amarr factory outpost, unable to reprocess in it. Did this change from the original plan of having all outposts able to reprocess?