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Kronos Rattlesnake Fitting.

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Blitz Apollo
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2014-05-27 13:30:07 UTC
Afternoon folks,

Been looking at getting a missile boat for a while to replace my Rattlesnake, been looking at a CNR, Typhoon Fleet and SNI for instance. However, I got thinking about the new Kronos changes to the Rattlesnake and started wondering if I could make it an efficient missile boat. Came up with this fit, its a bit of a mix but looking for some comments about how effectively it would work.

5x Cruise Missile Launcer II
1x Drone Link Augmentor II

Pith B-Type Large Shield Booster
Pith B-Type EM Ward Field
Pith B-Type Thermic Diss. Field.
3x Republic Fleet Target Painter
1x Large MJD

4x Ballistic Control Unit
2x Drone Damage Amplifier

2x Rigor II
1x Flare I


1. I am in Amarr space, hence the EM/Therm resistances, I know this isn't ideal, but it is what it is.
2. It is possible of course to carry a Jump Unit, lose the MJD and fit an adaptive.

Stats with my skills

1296 DPS with Inferno Furies and Gecko, 1250 with 2x Garde 1.
320m Explosion Radius with T2 missiles, 210 with Caldari Navy.

2.30 cap time with all running, stable without booster. 538 burst tank against Sansha.

Cheers,

BA
unidenify
Deaf Armada
#2 - 2014-05-27 13:43:16 UTC
consider me crazy, but have you consider to drop Pith B Large for XL Gist C?
XL Gist C use 16 GJ more than Pith B Large but give 261 raw shield hp more over same period

in fact, Gist C XL is twice effective than Pith B Large.
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-05-27 13:46:46 UTC
3x tp is probably overkill, even for furys, you have drones for small targets.

the dps @ all lv5 and 5% implants should be around 1300 for navy and 1500 for fury , with wardens and 2x3 damage mods.
Blitz Apollo
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2014-05-27 13:58:25 UTC
unidenify wrote:
consider me crazy, but have you consider to drop Pith B Large for XL Gist C?
XL Gist C use 16 GJ more than Pith B Large but give 261 raw shield hp more over same period

in fact, Gist C XL is twice effective than Pith B Large.


I shall look into it man. How much is it out of interest?
unidenify
Deaf Armada
#5 - 2014-05-27 14:17:44 UTC
Blitz Apollo wrote:
unidenify wrote:
consider me crazy, but have you consider to drop Pith B Large for XL Gist C?
XL Gist C use 16 GJ more than Pith B Large but give 261 raw shield hp more over same period

in fact, Gist C XL is twice effective than Pith B Large.


I shall look into it man. How much is it out of interest?


XL Gist C is about 500 million isk in market.

I consider it to be worth of my isk for my Scorpion Navy and Golem.
Illiar D'Anaari
Lassandar
#6 - 2014-05-27 16:34:31 UTC
Wouldn't you get more damage out of a split 3 DDA+3 BCS instead of 2+4?
Blitz Apollo
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2014-05-27 16:48:45 UTC
Illiar D'Anaari wrote:
Wouldn't you get more damage out of a split 3 DDA+3 BCS instead of 2+4?


Quite possibly yes. However, had the intention of making this boat a primary missile ship with drones as support. Either way it would be 1.3k DPS +.
Egravant Alduin
Ascendance Rising
Ascendance..
#8 - 2014-05-29 10:21:25 UTC
I always loved rattlesnake and now with kronos it will be in place it worth to be.A beast!Gratz for your fit but i would also go 3+3 damage mods.

Feel the wrath of the GECKO!
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#9 - 2014-05-29 11:00:42 UTC
I think a Drone navigation comp might be more useful than that 3rd TP.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2014-05-29 11:57:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Jeanne-Luise Argenau
not using eft to check the fitting but here are a few changes in the fit i would think about


5x Cruise Missile Launcer II
1x Drone Link Augmentor

Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Pith A-Type EM Ward Amplifier
Pith A-Type Thermic Diss. Amplifier
Republic Fleet Target Painter
2x Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Computer
Large MJD

3x Ballistic Control Unit
3x Drone Damage Amplifier

2x Rigor II
1x Drone Scope II
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2014-05-29 14:01:27 UTC
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:
not using eft to check the fitting but here are a few changes in the fit i would think about


5x Cruise Missile Launcer II
1x Drone Link Augmentor

Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Pith A-Type EM Ward Amplifier
Pith A-Type Thermic Diss. Amplifier
Republic Fleet Target Painter
2x Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Computer
Large MJD

3x Ballistic Control Unit
3x Drone Damage Amplifier

2x Rigor II
1x Drone Scope II


Thats probably over cpu and over calibration.

Why 2xomni, and navy to boot and a scope?
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2014-05-29 14:43:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Barton Breau wrote:
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:
not using eft to check the fitting but here are a few changes in the fit i would think about


5x Cruise Missile Launcer II
1x Drone Link Augmentor

Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Pith A-Type EM Ward Amplifier
Pith A-Type Thermic Diss. Amplifier
Republic Fleet Target Painter
2x Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Computer
Large MJD

3x Ballistic Control Unit
3x Drone Damage Amplifier

2x Rigor II
1x Drone Scope II


Thats probably over cpu and over calibration.

Why 2xomni, and navy to boot and a scope?


to use gardes somewhat efficiently (should get them up to 70km range)
navy because they r slightly better and need less cpu
if cpu is an issue use caldari navy bcu and c-type amps

and yeah thats what i thought to thats why i stated i havent checked on eft but its a basic i would try out, let me play abit around in eft and i will see what i can do.
EDIT 1: Actually that fit with enough bling and implants is possible by downgrading one rigor to t1. and garde range would be 74km with falloff included.
EDIT 2: that would the blinged out fit be
[Rattlesnake, blingmission]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier
Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier
Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier

Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Gistum A-Type Thermic Dissipation Amplifier
Gistum A-Type EM Ward Amplifier
Large Micro Jump Drive
Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script
Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Black Eagle Drone Link Augmentor

Large Drone Scope Chip II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

Garde II x2
EDIT 3: just to make sure i wont fly fits that ******* expensive.
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#13 - 2014-05-29 15:22:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Chris Winter
Are you planning on primarily MJD-sniping with sentries? If so...
- That fit is WAY overtanked. 2 T2 hardeners and a slightly pimped large SB is all you need for tank.
- You need another drone link augmentor. With just the one, you'll MJD and then discover that your DPS drops by half since you can't hit anything with drones.
- At least one of those TPs should be an Omni, it'll help sentries more.

If you're *not* planning on MJD-sniping with sentries, then you should probably swap the MJD for an AB or MWD, depending on mission.

Honestly, if you want primarily missiles with drones secondary, get a Typhoon or TFI. Even with fury cruise, the rattlesnake still ends up as a 50/50 split due to the lower number of launchers compared to other missile boats (7.5 vs 8 for everything else or 8.25 for TFI).

And just as they said they were getting rid of split weapon boats, they go and introduce another one...

EDIT: Also note that the Rattlesnake's default lock range of only 93.75km with max skills might cause problems with the MJD.
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2014-05-29 16:03:57 UTC
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:

EDIT 3: just to make sure i wont fly fits that ******* expensive.


Yeh, 1.8bil, black eagle helps :) , still over cpu (cruise implant is slot 6), also the 0.5% per navy omni more optimal with gardes doing 50% damage at 70km....
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2014-05-29 16:22:42 UTC
Barton Breau wrote:
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:

EDIT 3: just to make sure i wont fly fits that ******* expensive.


Yeh, 1.8bil, black eagle helps :) , still over cpu (cruise implant is slot 6), also the 0.5% per navy omni more optimal with gardes doing 50% damage at 70km....


actually with modifying it u can get it down to a geno set if u want :P
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2014-05-29 16:31:53 UTC
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:
Barton Breau wrote:
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:

EDIT 3: just to make sure i wont fly fits that ******* expensive.


Yeh, 1.8bil, black eagle helps :) , still over cpu (cruise implant is slot 6), also the 0.5% per navy omni more optimal with gardes doing 50% damage at 70km....


actually with modifying it u can get it down to a geno set if u want :P


:)

What playstyle were you aiming at anyways?
Hasril Pux
Red Cabal
#17 - 2014-06-01 20:32:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Hasril Pux
I've been playing around with this fit on Singularity. It's not a max damage fit, but it does over 1300 dps with faction ammo and over 1500 with fury. It can target at 117km and do its full damage from 0 to 104k, has a set of Warrior IIs for close encounters with fast moving targets. It uses an LMJD for positioning.

This fit is extremely tight on CPU. You need perfect skills. However, you can switch out the Pith-A for a Pith-B and use faction hardeners. As long as their not invulns, Guristas hardeners are pretty cheap. Or you can take off an Omni and throw on another TP. That will loosen up the CPU a bit.

If you want a cheaper build use the above suggestions to slacken up CPU and replace the Caldari Navy BCS's with standard Tech II. You'll still get about 1300 dps with faction ammo and max skills.

Use mission specific hardeners.

[Cabal Kodiak - Rattlesnake]

{highs}
Drone Link Augmentor II
5x Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile

{mids}
Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster
Large Micro Jump Drive
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Thermic Dissipation Field II
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
2x Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script

{lows}
3x Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
3x Drone Damage Amplifier II

{rigs}
Large Drone Control Range Augmentor II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Ionic Field Projector I

{drones}
Warrior II x5
Garde II x2
Warden II x2
Bouncer II x2

{ammo}
Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Scourge Fury Cruise Missile
(TBH I never use the Furys)

Caldari Navy Inferno Cruise Missile
Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
(As far as I know these are still better than precisions vs. small targets)

Tracking Speed Script

If you like any of the older ship models (original artwork) better than the redesign of your favorite hull and don't want them to be lost forever, support ship customization and this feature request.
Kesshisan
#18 - 2014-06-04 04:54:32 UTC
[Rattlesnake, Sniper]
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Sentient Drone Damage Amplifier
Sentient Drone Damage Amplifier
Ballistic Control System II
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script
Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Caldari Navy Adaptive Invulnerability Field
Large Shield Booster II (Change to faction shield booster of choice if you want.)
100MN Afterburner II (Change to faction AB of choice if you want.)
Large Micro Jump Drive

Drone Link Augmentor II
Drone Link Augmentor II
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Inferno Fury Cruise Missile

Large Ionic Field Projector I
Large Ionic Field Projector I
Large Drone Control Range Augmentor I

Bouncer II x2
Garde II x2
Berserker II x2



With all V, this beast does 1303 damage with Bouncers and 4x Cruise Missile Launchers (using long range T2 Kinetic or Thermic missiles.) It's about a 50/50 split in damage between drones and missiles. The Optimal range of your drones is ~70k, with 80k falloff using 2x Optimal Range scripts. This also gives you a lock range of 142km. That means that your Bouncers can hit things at that range, alas your missiles cannot. Those start to hit things around 100km depending on your skills.

The AB is a really handy tool to have in general, but I found that it becomes very valuable for "stopping" after a MJD. After you jump, activate your AB, and hit ctrl-space to stop. You stop much faster with the AB on for two or three cycles permitting you to not drop your sentry drones earlier. And it helps out for getting to gates faster, too.

Reasoning for drones chosen: Garde and Bouncers are the drones you have likely trained for specialization. I know I had Gallente and Minmatar trained pre patch. That means you probably have no extra training needed. And the Berserkers have the best tracking of heavy drones. With All Vs, and 2x Tracking scripts, Berserkers track at ~1.5 rads / second. That's almost 180 degrees / second. This means they will kill even the fastest of frigates if things get close. Though with proper management, you shouldn't need to use them too much, still they're very handy when things get too close for your Gardes.

You shouldn't need to worry about many flare or rigor rigs because your drones can kill most frigates and cruisers with ease, even at 100k+. Save your missiles for the battlecruisers and battleships.

Don't forget to swap your scripts around when necessary. Learning the optimal range of your drones, and swap to fit your needs at the moment.

I run a Dominix very much like this, though much less faction gear, and (of course) no missiles. Tank is almost unnecessary once you get the hang of things. My Dominix is Armor tanked, and in some missions I never even run out of shield. MJDs are amazing for things like this.
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2014-06-04 11:28:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Barton Breau
Just one tp on its own is not enough for furys, i fear, keep in mind that battleships can go as fast as 350m/s at times,especially as you are planning to range tank.

EDIT: also talk about tracking and gardes with mjd? odd
Barton Breau
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2014-06-04 11:46:45 UTC
Hasril Pux wrote:
I've been playing around with this fit on Singularity.


Since you dont use furys, have you tried

- painter
+ sebo
- ionic
+ flare II
- range augmentor II
+ range augmentor I

Less annoyance with painting?
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