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Dev Blog: Tiptoe Through the Tooltips

First post First post
Author
voetius
Grundrisse
#441 - 2014-05-14 20:18:46 UTC
Barbelo Valentinian wrote:
In general, I think the tooltips are a great idea, but ... when you have tooltips in a game, you need to have the ability to adjust the delay, and turn them off too, and preferably selectively.

I should think the only tooltips a vet would like to keep are the ones on modules (both in Fitting and in Space), most of the others are only really useful for the NPE.


Exactly what I wanted to say. Tooltips are fine. Tooltips on modules are fine. The tooltip on contracts is really nice (I have the contract interface set on compressed view with no icons etc).

Things that could be improved:

In the Inventory hangar view it says 0.0m3 at the top of the window and the tooltip says the same. Unnecessary.

In the Overview I can see a stargate icon, distance, name and type. The tooltip shows "stargate" which is less information than the overview displays.

The most annoying one is mousing over the overview and and instead of seeing a name, corp and alliance ticker is something about pilot is in a frigate or w/e.
Chiyo Kawamura
Dissonance Corp
#442 - 2014-05-14 20:20:57 UTC
I lost some cans whilst exploring because these tooltips blocked my view in space

I also know what the overview symbols mean

PLEASE GIVE US A DISABLE OPTION (or at least a disable in space option) This isn't space-wow...

These are great for newbies.. but cmon you just celebrated yoru 11th b'day... so you know there are players older than a month :)
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#443 - 2014-05-14 20:21:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Doc Fury
Question

Did you test this new feature under fleet-type conditions?

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

Marcus Greengale
Vector Prime Industries
#444 - 2014-05-14 20:21:46 UTC
CCP Delegate Zero wrote:
We've been following all the constructive feedback on this thread, and in other places, closely and will be making some adjustments to address some of the issues that have been exposed since release.

We're intending to release a small update very soon to address the most pressing matters.

Cheers,
Delegate Zero

I hope it will be possible to disable most of this tooltips at all!!!

When you are going to add or improve some interface features like this – please, test it first! Or give us an opportunity to disable it immediately without waiting next patch! It is dangerous to fly in a fleet now! Really, I was near to lose my ship running Incursions yesterday because of this stupid tooltips falling on me from every place!

And tell me please, how many idiots are playing this game so you need to explain via tooltips what “close window” button is really doing???

Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#445 - 2014-05-14 20:33:15 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Harrison Tato wrote:
Winchester Steele wrote:


Reading comprehension is hard though, right?



I guess so. Try comprehending my post.

This little exchange made me smile.
The ironyLol

Back on topic, has anyone else noticed how more people are retouching their portraits since these things droped?


Plenty of time to make themselves look beautiful whilst they wait for the game to be playable again Big smile

Aaaaaaand relax.

Torei Dutalis
IceBox Inc.
Rogue Caldari Union
#446 - 2014-05-14 20:44:08 UTC
Sven Viko VIkolander wrote:
After reviewing the changes, I really dislike the new tooltips. In fact, they are terrible. Here's why:

http://i.imgur.com/LYCBacJ.jpg

When you mouse over a collection of things, especially when you are zoomed out, you get a giant box that blocks your field of view. I already have an overview which takes up a good portion of my view, I don't need another overview popping up in space blocking what I am trying to look at.




This ^. I really preferred just the icons when you would mouse over a cluster of celestials/wrecks. The giant black background is just aggravating.
mechtech
Ice Liberation Army
#447 - 2014-05-14 20:53:51 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:

Do all these new tooltips which also need to update the UI frequently create any new server load (offsetting any gains from changing omnis), and does this increase especially during fleet engagements?
.


The tooltip information is pulled from the client, not from the server. It adds nothing to server load.
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#448 - 2014-05-14 20:58:20 UTC
mechtech wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:

Do all these new tooltips which also need to update the UI frequently create any new server load (offsetting any gains from changing omnis), and does this increase especially during fleet engagements?
.


The tooltip information is pulled from the client, not from the server. It adds nothing to server load.


That would make sense, as anything on grid had to be loaded already for overview, et; al.





There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

Ridnic
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#449 - 2014-05-14 21:05:24 UTC
All the tooltips can be disabled, at least at my client. Following procedure: Go to the Star Map and zoom in and zoom out quite fast the entire zoom range. Repeat a few times and the tooltips are disabled. They are now off in station as well as in space.

Anyway, this does not solve anything and does not (magically) bring back the old tooltips.

There are a lot of good suggestions given here, to make the tooltips customizable so that players can set them up according to their needs. We will see if CCP takes them into account.
korellis hawkesford
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#450 - 2014-05-14 21:09:44 UTC
please can you create a way where tooltips can be turned of. i much prefer the old way.

when makeing changes it would be awesom if you could create a way where you allways get a on off button. so if you dont like the change you can revert it back to how it used to be befor it was added. in my opinion giveing people the option of personal choice when it comes to changes is awesom customer care and helps keep people happy. i for one dont enjoy this new tooltip thing. i know my game i dont need it to tell me whats what. i understand it helps people that is new to the game. but what about us old long timers who dont care much for changes like this


plz plz plz give us the option to turn it off.



many thanks

Josef Djugashvilis
#451 - 2014-05-14 21:10:02 UTC
I do like the title of the thread as I am old enough to remember Tiny Tim who looked like the epitome of an Eve Online player.

This is not a signature.

Azim Salam
Council of Esus
#452 - 2014-05-14 21:11:30 UTC
As others have posted, I used to be able to hover over a column to see the full description (long station names, for example), and hover over a pilot to see Name[corp]alliance(ship type). Now all I get is "Planet", "Station". Not handy at all. I can tell these items are planets & stations by the icon, I certainly don't need a redundant popup taking up my limited screen real estate. This is especially annoying with the pilot popup. I don't want to hover over a ship only to have the tip tell me the ship hull, or that the pilot is a suspect. I have ship type column on my overview from which I can glean hull type, and the flashing skull icon is more than sufficient to inform me of a pilot's suspect status without barging into my targeting area!
Allow disable/custom overview tooltips & return the hover-over details please!! SOON!

Overview tooltips: hate it! -1

Predictive mouse movement: very nice. +1
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#453 - 2014-05-14 21:15:09 UTC
Jayem See wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Harrison Tato wrote:
Winchester Steele wrote:


Reading comprehension is hard though, right?



I guess so. Try comprehending my post.

This little exchange made me smile.
The ironyLol

Back on topic, has anyone else noticed how more people are retouching their portraits since these things droped?


Plenty of time to make themselves look beautiful whilst they wait for the game to be playable again Big smile

Iv been catching up on that popular show about Mads Mikkelsen eating people.
Death Ryder
Vagrant Elite
#454 - 2014-05-14 21:15:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Death Ryder
So i'm going to assume that the dev team tried these new tool;tips out with everything to be sure that it doesnt impeed players in any way, you know like in exploration. Scatter cans can definately do with tooltips that hang around for a second or so because no one in there right mind is going to want a specific can out of those very anoying cans to start with..

In short,. which are you keeping? Tooltips or the scatter can annoyance, because they are mutually incompatible, having to wait a second for the information about the can doesnt work when you only have 10-15 seconds to find the relevant cans to try and scoop. Now don't get me wrong, looks pretty, and i'm all for keeping the tooltips at the expence of the scatter cans, they shouldn't have made it into the game to start with.
Belt Scout
Thread Lockaholics Anonymous
#455 - 2014-05-14 21:18:25 UTC
hmm. 23 pages and everyone agrees the tooltips need to go.

CCP needs to own up to their player base, and just get rid of them. With all the other broken crap that needs attention, why in the world did management allow even 10 minutes to be spent on spamtips when they worked fine the way they were.

Can't wait till the new patchspansion plan get into full swing.

Ugh

They say most of your brain shuts down on the EvE forums. All but the impatient side, and the sarcastic side. No wonder I'm still awake.

**This IS my main so STFU.

Mahican Moe
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#456 - 2014-05-14 21:58:39 UTC
I am not able to get all containers I want when I hack relic or data site because of your new tooltips. It takes longer to realise if its parts or a materials container, also tooltip can get in a way of hovering over some other container. All this needs to be done very fast if you are to get anything good out of those sites. New tooltips slow me down to the point that I had decided not to do those sites for some time. So please please give us option to put all back a way it was.
Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#457 - 2014-05-14 22:01:15 UTC
CCP Delegate Zero wrote:
We've been following all the constructive feedback on this thread, and in other places, closely and will be making some adjustments to address some of the issues that have been exposed since release.

We're intending to release a small update very soon to address the most pressing matters.

Cheers,
Delegate Zero


Been a while now. Could you update us on which parts of this improvement you are going to update?

You may notice that I have now turned my back on you.

Aaaaaaand relax.

Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#458 - 2014-05-14 22:02:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Jayem See
Also - just as a slightly crass aside - where is the current CSM on this?

Surely their first issue - and yet no word?

Aaaaaaand relax.

ihcn
Life. Universe. Everything.
#459 - 2014-05-14 22:12:47 UTC
If "NPE" is already taken then how does CCP refer to null pointer exceptions?
Kusum Fawn
Perkone
Caldari State
#460 - 2014-05-14 22:30:02 UTC
Jayem See wrote:
Also - just as a slightly crass aside - where is the current CSM on this?

Surely their first issue - and yet no word?


several CSM have commented on this thread, in fact they have mentioned that they also would like some control over which and when tool tips are shown / what is displayed.

They have not mentioned if they had any say in this before it went out.
Here is the list of who of the CSM has posted and what they posted at the time. Ali was the last CSM to post on page 11


Sugar Kyle #31 Page 2
- The overview tool tip is nice. However, I just noticed that I expected the tooltip to display the name/corp/alliance info of a wreck I was heading towards.

Mike Azariah #45 Page 3
- am fairly sure that Trebor, who has been fighting for the predictive mouse (amazon menu hack) for years will be buying someone some vodka for this addition.
m

Ali Aras #182 P10
-Quick feedback note:
Hovering over other pilots on the overview should include corp/alliance info.
The new tooltip (class / info about why it's colored that way) is f'n fantastic, especially as a learning tool. But I used to hover over people to get their corp/alliance-- I have those on some overview setups, but not all; I don't think it's a great use of space when I'm not scouting. Still, I like to see who's around me, because it helps me make decisions about engagements, hence the hover.
Two other ideas: why not add corp/alliance tooltips to local, too? (would it be annoying?) Makes it a lot easier to see whether the local reds in system are in their home system, or fellow roamers cruising through.
Second, what about making some tooltips newbie-only? By which I mean, hide them (with option to re-enable?) after the player is no longer able to join Rookie Chat. For example, the "stargate" and "station" ones are ones that most veteran eve players *should* know, but might help a new player map symbols to type of space object.

#196 p 10
-It's funny you mention this, because the tooltips on the modules have been in-game for a long time...maybe even over a year? Also fwiw you can shift + click on a mod to overheat it; much easier than hitting the green bar.

#202 P 11
-Information was hard to discover in-game ("Targeting? 20.0 points? What the ****?") and some displays of information were unhelpful. It was hard to tell what ship class you were fighting if you didn't have all of the name -> class mappings memorized (this, memorably, lead to me killing a blackbird in a catalyst because I thought blackbirds were frigates).
Now some different displays are redundant, but others are much more helpful. The scrolling thing and the big black box issues were acknowledged by CCP DelegateZero earlier in the thread. The existence of tooltips at all-- the module tooltips, the tooltips on the fitting window and station services screen-- will be something that vets will likely adapt to and ignore, just as we ignored the old tooltips.
"This is the worst feature since ______" is unhelpful feedback; "This is interfering with my ability to do ________, __________, and ________ because I'm trying to x and instead y happens" is useful stuff that CCP can use to actually improve the feature (or kill it, as they have with loot scatter!). If you're interested in a better game for yourself, I'd suggest using the latter language, or at least pretending you're talking to a real person standing in front of you when drafting your post.

Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.