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Dev Blog: Delivering The Industry New Eden Deserves!

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Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#141 - 2014-05-13 02:30:07 UTC
Wrent Simulus wrote:
CCP Explorer wrote:
Rhivre wrote:
Seith Kali wrote:
Quote:
Moving the industry features to the Crius release on 22 July is an example of our new release model in action.
Wouldn't that be to release the parts that are ready rather than pushing back a big bang release?
The parts that are ready are being released

"The Kronos release, coming out on June 3rd, will include all other features announced in development blogs and during the EVE Online keynote at Fanfest, such as the 3 new Mordu's Legion ships, the new advanced mining frigate, changes to low sec sites and faction warfare, new warp-in effects, rebalanced and redesigned ships, drone rebalance, faction themed stations and sound customization. "
Exactly, and the industry features will then follow approx. 6 weeks later.


Was there any content that was originally planned for this date that has not already been announced? Or is originally announced material simply getting delayed 6 weeks?



https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie/status/465926289678163968

Fozzie tweeted that a few hours ago, so, I would think maybe we haven't seen everything yet perhaps
Wrent Simulus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#142 - 2014-05-13 02:54:35 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Wrent Simulus wrote:


Was there any content that was originally planned for this date that has not already been announced? Or is originally announced material simply getting delayed 6 weeks?



https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie/status/465926289678163968

Fozzie tweeted that a few hours ago, so, I would think maybe we haven't seen everything yet perhaps


Very interesting, it would be fantastic if they were able to keep their original schedule as well as make the changes to the Kronus stuff. I'm -very- dubious, but hopeful that this is possible!

I'm still in " show me" mode for this 6 week thing thou, I'm thinking closer to 10 weeks (which is still good I think)



Fixed quoting. ISD Ezwal.
asteroidjas
Rothschild's Sewage and Septic Sucking Services
The Possum Lodge
#143 - 2014-05-13 03:36:00 UTC
I'll put this here too, just to hope it gets seen.

I think this whole industry/research change that requires ALL blueprints to be in the exact location of their operation should happen at the same time there is a centralized POS storage.

Material Tetris at a tower is bad enough, let alone the new Blueprint Tetris with all the new hundreds of copies you want us to use under the new system. I would have no problem with this change if it weren't ADDING lots of extra headaches for those who chose to build/research in a POS. For once, think of how players actually use your product, and not only thinking about how 'neat' or shiney something is. Try to consider the daily use-case scenarios. (yes, the INTERFACE will be much better, but Tetris is not a mini-game i wish to play inside of Eve.
Kusum Fawn
Perkone
Caldari State
#144 - 2014-05-13 03:41:19 UTC
Pleas put the current terrible version onto sisi so we can tell you exactly how bad it is and why.
then you can take the next six weeks and fix it the way you will know you need to.

This is all predicated on the idea that you actually listen to Test server feed back, which has historically not been the case.

Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#145 - 2014-05-13 03:51:36 UTC
Kusum Fawn wrote:
Pleas put the current terrible version onto sisi so we can tell you exactly how bad it is and why.
then you can take the next six weeks and fix it the way you will know you need to.

This is all predicated on the idea that you actually listen to Test server feed back, which has historically not been the case.



They said Jun 10, it will be on SiSi, give or take a day or ten
General Nusense
Doomheim
#146 - 2014-05-13 04:32:56 UTC
Dramaticus wrote:


Its not gonna take 8-10 weeks for you to figure out you're gonna get plowed by null-sec industrialists



in 8-10 weeks you will be paying more for everything. it dosent matter where its built, the prices are set by the Jita market. If I make 100 vexors and sell them for 15 mil each, that dude in nullsec will list them at 14.999.999.99.

the only difference will be a bigger profit margin for the nullsec dude and a higher cost for the buyer.

Made a signature so I am taken seriously on the forums, since thats the only thing they are good for.
Tikitina
Doomheim
#147 - 2014-05-13 05:02:09 UTC
Zloco Crendraven wrote:
I hoped we would get more things and faster. But apparently you took this frequent release mode so you can slack. I just realized that EVE development will be slower actually.

Disapointed


Instead of waiting until a Winter release a further 6 months down the road, you get it 6 weeks later. Roll

So that is in fact faster.
Shinnan Krydu
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#148 - 2014-05-13 05:04:00 UTC
So we're getting the industry in EVE that we deserve.
Not the industry we needed.
Got it.
Oxide Ammar
#149 - 2014-05-13 07:13:42 UTC
For god sake, they are way way behind the schedule and I won't be surprised if they pushed the indy changes farther, fragmented in future small patches or the worst thing can be is apologizing on some of what they promised to us and postpone in it for unforeseen future.

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Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
Tactical-Retreat
#150 - 2014-05-13 07:17:10 UTC
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
Some people have asked for a comprehensive list of what's going into Kronos and what's going into Crius.

We are working on a list internally which will include all of this information and make it available to you soon. In fact we have plans for the Kronos release to go to Singularity very soon. In summary however most of the details can be found in the news article:

http://community.eveonline.com/news/news-channels/eve-online-news/industry-features-coming-in-the-crius-release/

The Kronos release, coming out on June 3rd, will include all other features announced in development blogs and during the EVE Online keynote at Fanfest, such as the 3 new Mordu's Legion ships, the new advanced mining frigate, changes to low sec sites and faction warfare, new warp-in effects, rebalanced and redesigned ships, drone rebalance, faction themed stations and sound customization.

If it relates to game balance that does not strictly involve or impact Industry then you can expect it will go out in the Kronos release on June 3rd. Redesigned ships includes new models in case that was unclear.

Changes to Starbases, Reprocessing and Compression, Material requirements, Research, the Industry UI/UX or anything else covered in the 6 Industry blogs you can expect to go out with the Crius release on July 22nd.

Hope that clarifies things for most people. You can expect more details in the days and weeks leading up to Kronos on June 3rd. However if there are specific changes that you are unsure about when they are being released feel free to ask and we will tell you where it slots in.


Did starbase refining changes really had to be delayed too ? I mean making the refineries useful and instantaeous isn't really an "industry change" point :D

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CynoNet Two
GSF Logistics and Posting Reserves
Goonswarm Federation
#151 - 2014-05-13 07:47:16 UTC
Lyn Fel wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Freighter and Jump Freighter rebalancing - Kinda industry, but also ship rabalancing...

Kronos or Crius??


Kronos. All of the previously announced ship and module balancing is still scheduled for Kronos.

The one exception is the capital jump drive fuel use increase which is being delayed to Crius.


Could we get some numbers on the new smaller base cargohold sizes of Freighters and Jump Freighters? I just happen know a lot of players who are interested in this. Smile

If you wanted to be really nice you could throw in cargohold sizes with various T1/T2 cargo expander options installed as well.


Pretty much this. I assume these ship balancing changes are still coming in 3 weeks... so how long until we see the dev bog?
CynoNet Two
GSF Logistics and Posting Reserves
Goonswarm Federation
#152 - 2014-05-13 07:48:34 UTC
Altrue wrote:

Did starbase refining changes really had to be delayed too ? I mean making the refineries useful and instantaeous isn't really an "industry change" point :D

Refineries link directly into the new industry code, so yeah they are an industry change.

Basically if it builds, researches or refines, it won't change until July 22nd.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#153 - 2014-05-13 08:25:55 UTC
I for one am glad that sanity prevailed, I've seen too many releases pushed in for arbitrary dates only to fall on their arse immediately.

P.S. why did spellcheck tell me that I spelt arse wrong? I'm the one that usually talks through it so I should bloody well know :D
Freelancer117
So you want to be a Hero
#154 - 2014-05-13 09:20:40 UTC
Quote:
Community Feedback


We followed up the discussion at Fanfest with multiple round tables and panels, all the while gathering your feedback from the blogs, the CSM and across social media.

Getting back to your roots at fanfest CCP; this is what fanfest was all about before the jesus features and gaming media attention seeking at fanfest.

Smart move listening to your customer base Cool

Eve online is :

A) mining simulator B) glorified chatroom C) spreadsheets online

D) CCP Games Pay to Win at skill leveling, with instant gratification

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CCP RubberBAND
CCP Engineering Corp
#155 - 2014-05-13 10:16:48 UTC
Potions Master wrote:


I also see no mention of where the anchoring IV change for Starbase Defense Management has gone. I assume it's a Kronos change though... (Btw, would be nice for gunnery skills to effect starbase modules, it would make up for the few stat upgrades they've had over the years. A renaming of the guns to indicate their ammo usage wouldn't be too unwelcome as well, as they all use the size up from their name. Small = Medium, etc...)


The skill requirement changes are currently scheduled for Crius. I'll talk to CCP Ytterbium and see if it makes sense to get these into Kronos.

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Jai Centarium
Anqara Expeditions
#156 - 2014-05-13 11:07:10 UTC
Oh good, 6 extra weeks before every moon in highsec has a dummy tower anchored at it.

Certified purveyor of the High Life.
Mar Drakar
LDK
#157 - 2014-05-13 11:21:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Mar Drakar
Which expansion will include proper power projection nerf? (dont even mention the isotope use increase please, you will only make people drag a JF slave(s) along the major ops now)

declining numbers of people online and those buying plexes for $ are surely not leaving due to industry, but due to bleak prospects in nullsec without powerblock bullshit behind...

I remember new eden was F****ing HUGE when I started playing almost 9 years ago... now it takes what? 20 minute to get you and most of your stuff (I'm no indy guy...) across the universe... what gives ? easy logistics DO enable much nullsec things to happen, but they kill much more in the process, especially with incoming industry changes, player built things that will be so very limited due to untamed power projection...

so this is my rant, I hope someone reads, and I'm somewhat pretty sure I'm not the only one who feels like this.
Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#158 - 2014-05-13 11:29:35 UTC
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
Potions Master wrote:


I also see no mention of where the anchoring IV change for Starbase Defense Management has gone. I assume it's a Kronos change though... (Btw, would be nice for gunnery skills to effect starbase modules, it would make up for the few stat upgrades they've had over the years. A renaming of the guns to indicate their ammo usage wouldn't be too unwelcome as well, as they all use the size up from their name. Small = Medium, etc...)


The skill requirement changes are currently scheduled for Crius. I'll talk to CCP Ytterbium and see if it makes sense to get these into Kronos.



It makes huge sense as people will wardeck a lot of corps on day one the standing requirments drops. Giving people time to train pps defence for 6 weeks before release will make it easier to defend.

Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff?
Granios
Wild Tigers Unleashed
#159 - 2014-05-13 11:31:45 UTC
Will we see something new beside industry that should be in Kronos ? in Criuse Expansion ?
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#160 - 2014-05-13 13:06:55 UTC
This should be the #1 guiding principle of the industry rework.

Every player is looking for passive income to avoid the grind. Because of this, and the ability to run multiple concurrent S&I jobs per toon and multiple toons per account, capacity far exceeds demand. EVEN IF, rat drops were not taking up a big chunk of the market, capacity would far exceed demand.

Therefore, profits for passive income are a slim, slim delta between cost of producing the Dth item and the sale price of the Dth item, where D is the demand. The only profit margins that are not razor thin are the ones where D is above T2 BPO production potential. That is, there is no mechanism to drive down the price due to the inability to create new T2 BPOs to meet the demand.

That is not going to change.

There will still be an absolute minimum price for building something, and the market price for manufactured items will be a razor thin margin above that absolute minimum build cost. If that minimum price to bring to market means bidding for all the best "teams", building at a fully upgraded null outpost, then jump freighting to Jita, then that will be what sets the market price, and that will be a slim profit margin over absolute minimum build price, AND NO ONE will be able to produce profitably in any other way.


What the originally proposed changes (teams, unlimited slots, BPO research round up, ME reductions for outposts and large batch runs, etc) did was allow the mega corps, with thousands of toons, capable of running tens of thousands of concurrent jobs, to completely dominate the market and thus crush any smaller corp that could not build in a fully upgraded outpost that was loaded up with all the best teams, then jump freighter to Jita.

No one would have been able to make any manufacturing profit unless they were part of the swarm.