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BEAR102: Advanced Capital Escalations for the Discerning Wormhole Bear
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Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-05-12 03:51:09 UTC
Ion Udan wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Way ahead of you, my Phoenix is already armour tanked.
Nice write up. Sadly my corp is destined to run sites slowly forever since it's full of shield nag pilots :(

It should be noted that if you're armour tanking your dreads, you have MUCH less chance of surviving if you get dropped by hostile dreads.


I can confirm this, on comms with Rolled Out last night running sites.
* Hmm site not pre warped, I'm 50 off the sleepers
* Who left this mobile depot here last night? My carrier cant refit to put its Capital Cap transfer on. Ill slow boat away at 10m/s
* **** I'm out of range of the other mobile dept, but i didnt bring Capital Cap transfer mod someone bring me one
* Ill bring it to you in a Zephyr, it wont get targetted, should fit in the hold right?
* Guys, we have a new sig on scan. Scan the sig, its a WH
* Its ok guys, i'll put a large cap transfer on instead
* Whats that? All the dreads? "NO!!!!"
* So who likes AFL?
* Lots of gifs linked

:) I hope its the same again tonight, i thoroughly enjoyed it

pretty much sums up why i don't run sites with corp :)

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Sith1s Spectre
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2014-05-12 03:54:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Sith1s Spectre
Ion Udan wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Way ahead of you, my Phoenix is already armour tanked.
Nice write up. Sadly my corp is destined to run sites slowly forever since it's full of shield nag pilots :(

It should be noted that if you're armour tanking your dreads, you have MUCH less chance of surviving if you get dropped by hostile dreads.


I can confirm this, on comms with Rolled Out last night running sites.
* Hmm site not pre warped, I'm 50 off the sleepers
* Who left this mobile depot here last night? My carrier cant refit to put its Capital Cap transfer on. Ill slow boat away at 10m/s
* **** I'm out of range of the other mobile dept, but i didnt bring Capital Cap transfer mod someone bring me one
* Ill bring it to you in a Zephyr, it wont get targetted, should fit in the hold right?
* Guys, we have a new sig on scan. Scan the sig, its a WH
* Its ok guys, i'll put a large cap transfer on instead
* Whats that? All the dreads? "NO!!!!"
* So who likes AFL?
* Lots of gifs linked

:) I hope its the same again tonight, i thoroughly enjoyed it


Confirming Ion was on our comms and doesn't hate AFL.

Also, Quote Ion "I'm not use to hearing so many Australian accents on teamspeak at once."

Just send those API keys through when you can dude and we'll get you set up and on board ASAP.

♥ Sith

Resident forum troll and fashion consultant
Ion Udan
Stellar Ascent
#23 - 2014-05-12 04:07:11 UTC
Now now Sith, dont play dirty. I dont need to app to Rolled Out, our spy Fido is already in

So, glorious QEX brother steals potatoes from hisec.
Sith1s Spectre
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2014-05-12 04:10:02 UTC
Ion Udan wrote:
Now now Sith, dont play dirty. I dont need to app to Rolled Out, our spy Fido is already in

P.S

We're in your chain right now. Ping please

♥ Sith

Resident forum troll and fashion consultant
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#25 - 2014-05-12 05:22:08 UTC
Sith1s Spectre wrote:
Ion Udan wrote:
Now now Sith, dont play dirty. I dont need to app to Rolled Out, our spy Fido is already in

P.S

We're in your chain right now. Ping please

♥ Sith


Jack Miton checks KB for red.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Winthorp
#26 - 2014-05-12 05:39:19 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Sith1s Spectre wrote:
Ion Udan wrote:
Now now Sith, dont play dirty. I dont need to app to Rolled Out, our spy Fido is already in

P.S

We're in your chain right now. Ping please

♥ Sith


Jack Miton checks KB for red.


No finger painting for you today jack.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#27 - 2014-05-12 10:31:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Paikis
Keith Planck wrote:
you lost me at dps rigs and strong boosters

other then that no real new information, thanks for the write up though

p.s. the point is to survive long enough to coast out of siege and get reps, surviving long enough for your corp to drop half a dozen more dreads on the attacker's 2 or 3


This from the guy who a few days ago wouldn't believe it when he was told that sites could be done in 5 minutes or that you could influence sleeper agro. :D

Anyway, can you explain what you meant about DPS rigs and boosters please?
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#28 - 2014-05-12 10:37:02 UTC
Most likely it's been some time since he saw an escalation spawn with transversal :p
Mizhir
Devara Biotech
#29 - 2014-05-12 14:33:52 UTC
Just some questions from someone who haven't done escalations as a dread pilot.

Since you got 2 turret rigs on the dreads you use for sites, do you use the same dreads for pvp or do you have other dreads with capacitor rigs for that?

Also how does the Naglfar compare? The moros obviously has more damage and better tracking but if you factor in the longer range and better tank of the naglfar wouldn't you end up with similar performance when factoring in everything?

❤️️💛💚💙💜
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#30 - 2014-05-12 16:31:20 UTC
Mizhir wrote:
Just some questions from someone who haven't done escalations as a dread pilot.

Since you got 2 turret rigs on the dreads you use for sites, do you use the same dreads for pvp or do you have other dreads with capacitor rigs for that?

Also how does the Naglfar compare? The moros obviously has more damage and better tracking but if you factor in the longer range and better tank of the naglfar wouldn't you end up with similar performance when factoring in everything?


I don't PvP in my dread, but there's no reason I couldn't. I tested on a shield Moros and CCC rigs gain you all of about 8 seconds of capacitor against a single neut legion. I think I'd rather have the extra damage and tracking.

The Nag and Rev are pretty much comparable in terms of damage. Against a webbed and painted target, the Revelation applies more damage better at all ranges, but only if you swap ammo to always be at optimal. The Nag shouldn't be armour tanked and the Rev shouldn't be shield tanked. So you're left with the Revelation having a bigger buffer and better cap life but the Naglfar having a better burst tank.

The big difference in PvP though is the damage types of the guns. A Naglfar can simply tank against EM/Therm and should kill a Revelation 100% of the time. Same against the Moros, tank against Kin/Therm and never lose. A Naglfar can do EM or Thermal or Explosve damage quite easily, so anything it is shooting at really needs to omni-tank.
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#31 - 2014-05-12 16:59:31 UTC
Paikis wrote:

I don't PvP in my dread, but there's no reason I couldn't. I tested on a shield Moros and CCC rigs gain you all of about 8 seconds of capacitor against a single neut legion. I think I'd rather have the extra damage and tracking.


Use SMC rigs Blink
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#32 - 2014-05-12 17:14:46 UTC
Angsty Teenager wrote:
Paikis wrote:

I don't PvP in my dread, but there's no reason I couldn't. I tested on a shield Moros and CCC rigs gain you all of about 8 seconds of capacitor against a single neut legion. I think I'd rather have the extra damage and tracking.


Use SMC rigs Blink


Yup. These add about an extra 80 seconds under neuts from a single neut Legion. You're still going to run out of cap well before your siege is done, but it's a better option than the damage rigs. Shield Boosters just use too much cap. :D
Havoc Zealot
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#33 - 2014-05-12 17:36:21 UTC
I think keith has some competition O_O
Blodhgarm Dethahal
8 Sins of Man
Stray Dogs.
#34 - 2014-05-12 18:00:55 UTC
And here I am with a maxed Amarr Dread :(

I can fly all 4 Dreads across all my characters though :D (yes even that Phoenix..)
Mizhir
Devara Biotech
#35 - 2014-05-12 18:43:03 UTC
Paikis wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
Just some questions from someone who haven't done escalations as a dread pilot.

Since you got 2 turret rigs on the dreads you use for sites, do you use the same dreads for pvp or do you have other dreads with capacitor rigs for that?

Also how does the Naglfar compare? The moros obviously has more damage and better tracking but if you factor in the longer range and better tank of the naglfar wouldn't you end up with similar performance when factoring in everything?


I don't PvP in my dread, but there's no reason I couldn't. I tested on a shield Moros and CCC rigs gain you all of about 8 seconds of capacitor against a single neut legion. I think I'd rather have the extra damage and tracking.

The Nag and Rev are pretty much comparable in terms of damage. Against a webbed and painted target, the Revelation applies more damage better at all ranges, but only if you swap ammo to always be at optimal. The Nag shouldn't be armour tanked and the Rev shouldn't be shield tanked. So you're left with the Revelation having a bigger buffer and better cap life but the Naglfar having a better burst tank.

The big difference in PvP though is the damage types of the guns. A Naglfar can simply tank against EM/Therm and should kill a Revelation 100% of the time. Same against the Moros, tank against Kin/Therm and never lose. A Naglfar can do EM or Thermal or Explosve damage quite easily, so anything it is shooting at really needs to omni-tank.


I'm aware that the naglfar is superior for pvp. But what about pve? You haven't listed a shield naglfar as a viable option for running sites in 1 cycle. Since they can just refit for armour tank and catch reps if **** hits the fan you can still use them alongside your armour fleet.

❤️️💛💚💙💜
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#36 - 2014-05-12 22:44:32 UTC
Mizhir wrote:
I'm aware that the naglfar is superior for pvp. But what about pve? You haven't listed a shield naglfar as a viable option for running sites in 1 cycle. Since they can just refit for armour tank and catch reps if **** hits the fan you can still use them alongside your armour fleet.

nag is the definition of MEH for pve.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#37 - 2014-05-13 04:28:37 UTC
Blodhgarm Dethahal wrote:
And here I am with a maxed Amarr Dread :(


No need to brag. Amarr really is the master race, other people just haven't worked it out yet. Hopefully the Revelation is about to get buffed too :D

Mizhir wrote:
I'm aware that the naglfar is superior for pvp. But what about pve? You haven't listed a shield naglfar as a viable option for running sites in 1 cycle. Since they can just refit for armour tank and catch reps if **** hits the fan you can still use them alongside your armour fleet.


Jack is right, the Naglfar is decidedly average for PvE.

I said in the OP that you can do this with a shield fleet, but you're going to need more people. At the very least you will need an extra Loki, and possibly an extra Dreadnaught. Naglfars do less damage than Revelations at pretty much any range, they also have worse tanks and less capacitor life. They are quite frankly an inferior choice. But you can still do it and it will work, just slower.

As far as using a shield Naglfar in an armour fleet... you probably shouldn't. You can make it work, but you're going to have to either add another character for shield boosts, or run a Dread without boosts. Either option is less than ideal. Also, if you're talking about coasting out of siege to get reps, you've already failed a 1-cycle site by a fair margin.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#38 - 2014-05-13 05:38:56 UTC
as a quick addition, armour nag is better than shield nag for PVE.
and if youre armour tanking a nag; what are you doing?

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
RudinV
Sons Of Mother's Friend
Can i bring my Drake...
#39 - 2014-05-20 11:22:34 UTC  |  Edited by: RudinV
Paikis wrote:

6. Dreadnaught rigs should be 1x Burst Aerator II and 1x Metastasis Adjuster I.
Yes, leave one rig empty. No, don't fit Cap rigs. The thing that makes your site times faster is damage.

So true...
note: u have to delete "amp;" in the browser tab after redirect.
Alec Freeman
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2014-05-21 22:16:16 UTC
Nidhoggur is best if you pimp your carriers slightly... just sayin'.
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