EVE General Discussion

inb4 bounty payouts.

but risk is defined as "the possibility of financial loss."
so it's pretty obvious that you have to consider module/loot drops.

anyway, even if we do casually ignore isk in this equation...
probability of outside interference >0, therefore it's not risk free even before we get in to semantics.

no, don't change the quote to suit your argument.

google states "the possibility of financial loss." NOT "possibility of losing something of value"

if you get 0 drops because the loot fairy says no, which has a statistical probability >0, then you have incurred a financial loss. because it's a fact that the probability of a loot drop worth less than your ganking ship is >0 that means all suicide ganks involve risk.

there's no opinions here, there's no subjectivity. it's an objective fact.

Apparently, you are financially motivated. While that is great and all that you yourself choose to place your sense of value solely on your ability to "profit" regarding finances, it should also be perfectly understandable that someone other than you could place his value system on something not centered around making isk.

Also, "fun" being a subjective term, it's allowed to be used subjectively, for each person, however he may so desire.

i dunno, some one jamming out half of your ships, or simply alphaing them off the field as soon as they turn criminal, or some one repping your target or....
do i really need to write out the entire damn list?

Well when not considering your goal is for profit, considering my initial argument was that there was no risk since my satement wasn't based around "financial", with proper planning you could destroy someone's ship with bringing more dps than their tank can sustain within the amount of time for concord to arrive.

My initial position was that there was no risk, because I was focusing on the task of ensuring a space ship destroyed without considering profit as what determined the risk.

Like I could go with 4 guys in catalysts to blow up 1 retriever. Sure, you might consider it "overkill" and "not worth it" considering it wont be as profitable, but if your only goal is to deny that person of their retriever without considering profit as the motivator, then it's very well possible it can be done without risk, and simply a cost.

Like you right now, doing this burn jita.

A charon warps into system, you know it has zero fittings because they have zero fittings available to them, so you just assume the pilot has maxed skills to plan on the side of caution.

You then calculate how much DPS is needed to blow up the Charon before concord can kill you. You bring that much DPS, and you blow it up. Regardless of what it's cargo is, because you're not doing it for your own profit, you're doing it for their loss.

You make the isk to spend the isk, and because your cost to destroy that charon might be expensive, since it's being spread out amongst many, then comparing it to the costs of the charon, his loss is much greater because it's his personal loss, which could be your motivation.

But it's not, your goal is financial, and not pure destruction.

You're not really "burning jita", you're pirating in jita.

If you were "burning jita", your goal would simply be causing as much destruction as possible because you know you have more isk/resources/isk potential/resource potential to fall back on than those whose ships you're destroying.

No, because if your goal wasn't your own profit, and merely the other person's loss, you could be bringing more than enough DPS to destroy every freighter regardless of what it's cargo is. But because your focusing on profit and not the destruction, you then assign a value to "profit" which then manifests a risk.

considering a charon has a set number of EHP, all you have to do is gain a high enough DPS to destroy that charon before concord can kill you. You could "over kill" because you know your organization can afford, while those you're destroying, do not have the same resources as you.

If your goal was purely the destruction of the freighters, and not the profit, you could be running a risk free operation because there is no risk, you gaurantee your ability to destroy the freighter by bringing more than enough DPS to destroy it. There would be a "cost" yes, but no risk, since you're accepting the loss of your ship as a necessary cost.

The only reason risk exists is because you're choosing to focus on the profit of the gank, and not focus on your imposing the destruction of the target's ship.

except it doesn't matter how much dps you bring, if there's enough people there to stop you using that dps... we've just been through this in several posts. the chance of killing a freighter is NEVER 1.

except you can't factor in the unknown number of potential cloaked falcons, so your "overkill" excuse is irrelevant unless you can bring an impossible number of pilots to the fight.

no, you can't run a risk free operation. stop pretending you can, we've pointed out that you can't on several occasions now.

i haven't focused on the profit one bit and still proven you wrong. it all comes back to that simple fact that the probability of ganking a freighter is never 1.

but you can't because a bunch of falcons just uncloaked and jammed everyone.