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lvl5 missions available only for... pirates\KoS players?
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Lockdown86
Night line Logistics
#21 - 2014-04-23 12:21:23 UTC
IIshira wrote:
Havriil wrote:
Subj.

It seems that all lvl5 agents' hubs are controlled by pirate corporations mostly. What if I don't want to join this kind of corporations because this playstyle doesn't fit for me? Maybe someone asked yourself same question and has found an answer? What ways to deal with this issues?

Do level 4 missions in highsec. If you want to risk getting blown up go to null. Lowsec is just for PVP


level 4 missions are the worse / boring source of income, i did incursions, and wanted to try level 4s so did the grind and hit level 4s and omg what a waste of my time! slit my wrist moments, reward of 1-4m per hand in LOL make more isk mining in a venture
G3neral D3stRuCtion
X---FORCE
#22 - 2014-04-23 14:13:28 UTC
They really need to improve level 4 missions or move some level 5's to hi sec. It would be nice all level 4 had bonus rooms.

Move level 5's to hi-sec and create another level for low sec.

Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#23 - 2014-04-23 16:22:04 UTC
G3neral D3stRuCtion wrote:
They really need to improve level 4 missions or move some level 5's to hi sec. It would be nice all level 4 had bonus rooms.

Move level 5's to hi-sec and create another level for low sec.



And then you would start asking for lvl 6 in high sec...
Nuela
WoT Misfits
#24 - 2014-04-23 20:19:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Nuela
Frostys Virpio wrote:
G3neral D3stRuCtion wrote:
They really need to improve level 4 missions or move some level 5's to hi sec. It would be nice all level 4 had bonus rooms.

Move level 5's to hi-sec and create another level for low sec.



And then you would start asking for lvl 6 in high sec...



Correct.

However, what I think is happening here is that hiseccers want more PvE content that requires multiple players to complete (besides Incursions).

I could see this, but the rewards would have to be appropriate/not much more than lvl 4's.

Actually, maybe what should be done is that these hisec multi-player lvl 5 missions should pay about what lvl 4's do now (per player on average) and the reward of lvl 4's nerfed.
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#25 - 2014-04-23 20:33:25 UTC
Lockdown86 wrote:
level 4 missions are the worse / boring source of income, i did incursions, and wanted to try level 4s so did the grind and hit level 4s and omg what a waste of my time! slit my wrist moments, reward of 1-4m per hand in LOL make more isk mining in a venture


The money in L4s is in the Loyalty Point payouts. It takes some effort to find the good items in the good stores, get the tags if necessary, and so on, but if you want them to be more than a quick hit of a few million ISK, that's what you have to do.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#26 - 2014-04-23 21:45:22 UTC
Level V's don't pay very much more than IV's for the average pilot.
You need multiple pilots, 3-way splits, or more.
Much more time,
Much more risk.
On many nights a Hi-sec missioner can earn the same as a lvl V mission crew member.

Having them in Low-sec does have some incentives though.
It gives hi-sec pilots incentive to *venture out*.
It gives incentive for group play, with decent pay, and a new, exciting, adventure.
It gives corps incentive to move in, and control low-sec hubs. Populating Low-sec had been a long time issue for CCP.
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-04-23 22:00:00 UTC
RavenPaine wrote:
Level V's don't pay very much more than IV's for the average pilot.
You need multiple pilots, 3-way splits, or more.
Much more time,
Much more risk.
On many nights a Hi-sec missioner can earn the same as a lvl V mission crew member.

Having them in Low-sec does have some incentives though.
It gives hi-sec pilots incentive to *venture out*.
It gives incentive for group play, with decent pay, and a new, exciting, adventure.
It gives corps incentive to move in, and control low-sec hubs. Populating Low-sec had been a long time issue for CCP.


I want to go to lowsec where I'm going to make about the same as I would in highsec but get killed by pirates. Yeah I'm on my way!
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#28 - 2014-04-23 22:04:25 UTC  |  Edited by: IIshira
Lowsec is good for one thing, ganking fools who are dumb enough to go there without proper scout. I do this frequently. I see no point to go run missions there risking a PVE fitted ship that can be killed by anything. Risk vs reward I got it but currently there's not nearly enough reward for the risk.
Judas Isu
Firman AB
#29 - 2014-04-23 22:52:46 UTC
I'd love to see some actual numbers on mission running activity. How many level 5's are completed in a day, say versus 4? Just curious.
Fango Mango
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2014-04-25 06:15:43 UTC
Judas Isu wrote:
I'd love to see some actual numbers on mission running activity. How many level 5's are completed in a day, say versus 4? Just curious.


I can give you a rough guess on L5 mission runners.

At any point in time there are 2-5 people running L5s out of each L5 hub.
Lets go with average of 4
There are 10 L5 hubs.

Lets say each of them completes 8 mission per hour.
You are looking at 320 Mission per Hour. 7520 L5s per day.
I bet that is several orders of magnitude below the number of L4s run per day


-FM
Eurynome Mangeiri
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#31 - 2014-04-25 08:56:24 UTC
isk/hour in lowsec is not worth it anyway, wether you look at lvl4 or 5.

it is barely better in low, but when you factor in the disruption because neut, roaming gang etc.. it is WAY below highsec.

then you have highsec incursion.

and lowsec isk/hour is really crap compared to highsec.....

risk vs reward? my ass, when it comes to lowsec, it has never been applied.

it is the most dangerous place, while the payout is the worse.

lived in sov null, WH, high and now low.....clearly low is the most dangerous place.....

from scratch, null and wh are more dangerous, but you CAN make them safe... in low you just can't
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#32 - 2014-04-25 17:36:05 UTC
Fango Mango wrote:
Judas Isu wrote:
I'd love to see some actual numbers on mission running activity. How many level 5's are completed in a day, say versus 4? Just curious.


I can give you a rough guess on L5 mission runners.

At any point in time there are 2-5 people running L5s out of each L5 hub.
Lets go with average of 4
There are 10 L5 hubs.

Lets say each of them completes 8 mission per hour.
You are looking at 320 Mission per Hour. 7520 L5s per day.
I bet that is several orders of magnitude below the number of L4s run per day


-FM



I don't think there's anyone doing 8 V's an hour. And I don't think most hubs are doing 8 per hour on average.
I'd put my guess at less than 1000 V's per day. That would be 4 per hour x 10 hubs x 24 hrs.

Our corp used to do V's on occasion. Completing even 2 missions started to feel like an all night event.
Travel time, ship set up time, interruption time, occasional PvP interuptions, salvage/loot, sell the tags.
It really sucked up the hours.
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#33 - 2014-04-26 02:55:22 UTC
If you go down to Black Rise lowsec there's a guy called Capt Tenguru who multiboxes 20 passive tanked Tengus doing L5s. So if this guy can afford to plex 20 accounts it's clearly profitable enough to warrant it being in lowsec.
Avelyne Syno
Ninjew Evasion Inc.
#34 - 2014-04-26 03:10:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Avelyne Syno
Since I don't run them anymore...


L5s make anywhere from 600m-2bil per hour, depending on how good you are at running them.

I know *people* that are approaching 100mil LP CURRENTLY. This is after they have already cashed out multiple times. There has been talk of setting up a cartel since they are crashing the LP markets rather hard and fast.

Running them in normal carriers your income is going to cap out ~1.2bil per hour it seems, assuming you get lucky on mission pulls (and have tons of pulling alts) if you run them in supers (you can buy a super+pilot in 2-3 weeks of farming, so people do this now), you can make much much more, ~2bil per hour.

The trick is to have carriers in every system you can pull missions in, and use a leopard to get to all the systems fast. You also want to have lots of pulling toons, ~8 for best income, though of course more is better. And you can make decent money, albeit inconsistant, with as few as 3.

You need multiple alts so you can decline any missions that are not blitzable.

Also, moving L5s to highsec is PRETTY much the worst idea ever, unless they completely restructure the reward system, since you would obliterate any value that LP has instantly.
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#35 - 2014-04-26 15:56:00 UTC
Avelyne Syno wrote:
Since I don't run them anymore...


L5s make anywhere from 600m-2bil per hour, depending on how good you are at running them.
.


Is this for each pilot or combined? If combined how many pilots?
Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
#36 - 2014-04-27 04:02:57 UTC
Avelyne Syno wrote:
Since I don't run them anymore...


L5s make anywhere from 600m-2bil per hour, depending on how good you are at running them.

I know *people* that are approaching 100mil LP CURRENTLY. This is after they have already cashed out multiple times. There has been talk of setting up a cartel since they are crashing the LP markets rather hard and fast.

Running them in normal carriers your income is going to cap out ~1.2bil per hour it seems, assuming you get lucky on mission pulls (and have tons of pulling alts) if you run them in supers (you can buy a super+pilot in 2-3 weeks of farming, so people do this now), you can make much much more, ~2bil per hour.

The trick is to have carriers in every system you can pull missions in, and use a leopard to get to all the systems fast. You also want to have lots of pulling toons, ~8 for best income, though of course more is better. And you can make decent money, albeit inconsistant, with as few as 3.

You need multiple alts so you can decline any missions that are not blitzable.

Also, moving L5s to highsec is PRETTY much the worst idea ever, unless they completely restructure the reward system, since you would obliterate any value that LP has instantly.



Just wondering...

Who does these? L5 missions as a theory seem like great sources for isk until you check the LP store for the corps that have them. Hard to imagine any high LP returns that are sustainable.

Just about every thing offered of any value is beaten by uber FW LP.

Unless you are just a thrill seeker, why would you run these missions?

Be careful what you think, for your thoughts become your words. Be careful what you say, for your words become your actions. Be careful what you do, for your actions become your character. And character is everything. - author unknown
Fango Mango
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#37 - 2014-04-28 06:04:17 UTC
Patri Andari wrote:



Just wondering...

Who does these? L5 missions as a theory seem like great sources for isk until you check the LP store for the corps that have them. Hard to imagine any high LP returns that are sustainable.

Just about every thing offered of any value is beaten by uber FW LP.

Unless you are just a thrill seeker, why would you run these missions?



Presumably people run them for the same reason they run any other mission, to make ISK . . .

Navy LP is worth around 800 ISK/LP (down from 1000 ISK/LP a year ago and 1200 ISK/LP the year before that).

L5s are the "end game" for Solo mission runners (and I mean single person, not single account).

You can blitz then in a carrier, Golem, or Domi Fleet.

Rewards work out to ~600 mil/hour which is better than you can do with any other PvE (well wormholes are better but you run out of sites eventually).

If you are smart it is just as safe as high sec, the rewards are just much greater than running L4s or incursions.
RoCkEt X
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#38 - 2014-04-30 10:58:24 UTC
For those of you claiming lvl 5's dont make much more isk than lvl 4's your ignorance is incredible.

If you know what you're doing you can easily do 7-10 missions an hour, at 110k lp and 10mil mission reward each. The reason the l5 hubs are inhabited by pirates is precisely because of how good they are at making isk. The chances are, the people living in that system chose to live there because they run the missions themselves.
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#39 - 2014-04-30 12:44:25 UTC
RoCkEt X wrote:
For those of you claiming lvl 5's dont make much more isk than lvl 4's your ignorance is incredible.

If you know what you're doing you can easily do 7-10 missions an hour, at 110k lp and 10mil mission reward each. The reason the l5 hubs are inhabited by pirates is precisely because of how good they are at making isk. The chances are, the people living in that system chose to live there because they run the missions themselves.

What you're not saying is how many pilots does it take to do 7-10 missions per hour and thus what fraction of that 10 mil ISK reward is per pilot? Or are you doing this with one pilot?
RoCkEt X
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#40 - 2014-04-30 19:06:56 UTC
IIshira wrote:
RoCkEt X wrote:
For those of you claiming lvl 5's dont make much more isk than lvl 4's your ignorance is incredible.

If you know what you're doing you can easily do 7-10 missions an hour, at 110k lp and 10mil mission reward each. The reason the l5 hubs are inhabited by pirates is precisely because of how good they are at making isk. The chances are, the people living in that system chose to live there because they run the missions themselves.

What you're not saying is how many pilots does it take to do 7-10 missions per hour and thus what fraction of that 10 mil ISK reward is per pilot? Or are you doing this with one pilot?


1x paladin, 1x passive loki.

10/hr is using 2x paladins + loki.

The shortest mission i run = 60 seconds, the longest i run is 12 minutes, on average it's about 5 minutes per mission.

110k LP @ 700isk/unit = 77mil
5mil reward
5mil time bonus

87mil per mission. so approx 900m/hr. With a single paladin/other dps ship, you can expect about 6-700m/hr, you just have to know how.

Short Mission: (Wrath of Angels) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfi_4nd7vjE&feature=youtu.be

Average Length: (Rogue Spy (1 of 3)) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQy4mXYPvDk&feature=youtu.be

:)

-Rock
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