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[Kronos] Pirate Faction Battleships

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gascanu
Bearing Srl.
#1241 - 2014-04-23 17:07:52 UTC
Gypsio III wrote:
gascanu wrote:


i'm sorry but you are wrong; drones do not fire when mwding, and as soon as they get in range they shut down the mwd; the web will slow them out of range and they need to mwd again for 1 cycle to get in range and so on;
all that that have been explained before...

there is a big difference: webbing one out of 5 drones will make you lose 20% dps, so basically no one do that; webbing one out of 2 drones will make you lose 50% dps. that's a pretty big difference don't you think?


No. The situation that you describe simply reflects an incorrect choice of drone by the Rattlesnake pilot. I keep on explaining this but it's not sinking in. The Rattlesnake pilot should not be using heavy drones in this situation so the problem that you describe should never arise.

The only way that you will be able to use a web to drive a heavy drone out of activation range in the way that you describe is if you are flying a fast ship that is not itself tackled. In which case, the Rattlesnake pilot should not be using heavy drones. It should be using sentries.

If you are attempting to orbit around 10 km, then, yes, you can try to web an incoming heavy drone. I've tested this and it doesn't work very well. The heavies are too fast and you're too close. Yes, you could then attempt to burn away and web the drone down, but in this case you just switch to sentries - and frankly you shouldn't have been able to have done this anyway, because of counter-tackle.


i tested that too, and it will work for any ship smaller than a bs and have an mwd. i was able to shield tank an ogre launched from an ishtar in a sacrilege.
you keep saying "incorrect choice of drone by the rattlesnake pilot" but you forget that in most cases it's not him engaging more like the other way around; sentry drones will be worthless at point blank range, and rattle will be in no position to dictate range; and that's where heavy drones will come in, trying to kill the heavy tackler but yea, they won't.

eve today it's not an 1 vs1 game; it's stoped being like that along time ago; eve today is about fleets fights and ganks;
a dominx is a pain in the ass to kill for a small frig gang; if the domi pilot know his stuff will kill some and make the rest run away;
a rattlesnake in the same situation will probly just die: having trilions of dps do no good if you are not able to apply it
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
#1242 - 2014-04-23 17:14:51 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
baltec1 wrote:
Angeleh wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Almost every other ship deals with frigs with 5 unbonused small drones. The rattler is now on par in that respect. where is the disadvantage?


The disadvantage is that the Rattlesnake was a drone boat, now it is a missile boat. And drone pilots have lost their only shield tanked option.


Its still a drone ship, it just happens to also get a good bonus to its missiles making it a much better ship and one of the most adaptable battleship platforms isk can buy.


*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal. The increased vulnerabilities to e-war, the loss of bonuses on light and medium drones and missile velocity bonus, and massive reduction in drone bay make the Rattlesnake a decidedly worse ship. The DPS increase it got and extra survivability of 2 types of drones was not worth the heavy price in power the Snake paid. Additionally, 5 drones is better than 2. This to a ship that was already considered to be relatively under performing. It is a hard slap in the face to Guristas pilots. Apparently, a few devs desire to alter a ship to be radically and unnecessarily different trumps the desires of the majority of its pilot who choose to fly it for what it was.
Gypsio III
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#1243 - 2014-04-23 17:37:46 UTC
gascanu wrote:


i tested that too, and it will work for any ship smaller than a bs and have an mwd. i was able to shield tank an ogre launched from an ishtar in a sacrilege.

you keep saying "incorrect choice of drone by the rattlesnake pilot" but you forget that in most cases it's not him engaging more like the other way around; sentry drones will be worthless at point blank range, and rattle will be in no position to dictate range; and that's where heavy drones will come in, trying to kill the heavy tackler but yea, they won't.

eve today it's not an 1 vs1 game; it's stoped being like that along time ago; eve today is about fleets fights and ganks;
a dominx is a pain in the ass to kill for a small frig gang; if the domi pilot know his stuff will kill some and make the rest run away;
a rattlesnake in the same situation will probly just die: having trilions of dps do no good if you are not able to apply it


I keep saying "wrong drones" because it's not sinking in. You seem to be insisting on using heavies against fast, untackled targets, and sentries against tackled opponents at point-blank range. You're just making life difficult for yourself.

The point about environment is well made though. Battleships are generally used on in fleet and situations where mobility isn't important, but the "no 1v1" thing cuts both ways. Null Rattlesnake fleet may become a niche thing - nice buffer, great damage projection and able to bypass the drone assignment limit. In this case they'll almost always use sentries, so the heavy problems that you're so worried about won't arise. Elsewhere, the Rattlesnake will often be as heavy DPS support in a small gang, where the tackle needed to make good use of heavies will be available.

I don't understand why you're so upset about specious problems with the superheavies, when legitimate concerns about CPU and similarity of drone damage to the Dominix exist.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1244 - 2014-04-23 17:42:59 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Fabulous Rod wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Angeleh wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Almost every other ship deals with frigs with 5 unbonused small drones. The rattler is now on par in that respect. where is the disadvantage?


The disadvantage is that the Rattlesnake was a drone boat, now it is a missile boat. And drone pilots have lost their only shield tanked option.


Its still a drone ship, it just happens to also get a good bonus to its missiles making it a much better ship and one of the most adaptable battleship platforms isk can buy.


*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal.The increased vulnerabilities to e-war, the loss of bonuses on light and medium drones and missile velocity bonus, and massive reduction in drone bay make the Rattlesnake a decidedly worse ship. The DPS increase it got and extra survivability of 2 types of drones was not worth the heavy price in power the Snake paid. Additionally, 5 drones is better than 2. This to a ship that was already considered to be relatively under performing. It is a hard slap in the face to Guristas pilots. Apparently, a few devs desire to alter a ship to be radically and unnecessarily different trumps the desires of the majority of its pilot who choose to fly it for what it was.


A 50% bonus to rapid light missiles delivers a lot more firepower than a 50% bonus to light drones. When it comes to ECM you simply scoop the drone and redeploy, nobody is going to bother trying to jam drones over jamming a bonused missile spewing BS controling the drones, especialy given how fragile ECM boats are. The reduction in the drone bay means little due to the fact your sentries and heavies only take up 50m3 per flight now.
Ebag Trescientas
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1245 - 2014-04-23 17:54:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Ebag Trescientas
Morrigan LeSante wrote:

I have PvE'd extensively in guristas space. Can you please explain, as my 750 sentry DPS will remain 750 DPS now and in Summer.



Hate to tell you this, but you're wrong.

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/giving-drones-an-assist/
Quote:

The other major change we will be making to drone skills in the summer release will be the expansion of drone skills to affect all drone types consistently. This means that the racial Drone Specialization skills will now provide their damage bonus to Tech Two sentry drones as well as the normal combat drones

Quote:

They can also gain an extra 2% damage for each level of their racial Drone Specialization skill that is trained.


So post summer changes, damage should climb to ~825 DPS for sentries.

So assuming an fully DPS setup for missiles and sentries, sentries will still OD missiles, which makes this (just barely!) a drone focused boat. Big smile

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Pyfa.fit
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1246 - 2014-04-23 18:03:26 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
epicurus ataraxia wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Angeleh wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Almost every other ship deals with frigs with 5 unbonused small drones. The rattler is now on par in that respect. where is the disadvantage?


The disadvantage is that the Rattlesnake was a drone boat, now it is a missile boat. And drone pilots have lost their only shield tanked option.


Its still a drone ship, it just happens to also get a good bonus to its missiles making it a much better ship and one of the most adaptable battleship platforms isk can buy.



Personally, I do not agree, with the first, it is now a drone ship in name only, but hopefully CCP Rise just didn't put ALL the stats regarding light and mediums because he thought we would assume they were unchanged (*hopeful*. But we will see either way) the third point I am afraid is that is it less adaptable than before so I respectfully do not agree, and neither do many others, but you are also entitled to your opinion. But regarding your second point, yes it does get a strong bonus to the missiles.


How is it less adaptable?

You now have a 50% bonus to every missile launcher from all size groups. This is unique in the battleship class and when coupled with unbonused light drones it means the rattle is one of the most deadly ships vs frigates where as the current one is rather vulnerable to them.
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#1247 - 2014-04-23 18:05:13 UTC
@ebag: oops, forgot that Smile

Though I'm sure you know my point was I expect no ewar hit going from 5>2
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1248 - 2014-04-23 18:07:02 UTC
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
@ebag: oops, forgot that Smile

Though I'm sure you know my point was I expect no ewar hit going from 5>2


People using ECM against the drones is a good thing for the rattle as it means fewer ECM mods being used on the battleship.Twisted
gascanu
Bearing Srl.
#1249 - 2014-04-23 18:15:37 UTC
Gypsio III wrote:
gascanu wrote:


i tested that too, and it will work for any ship smaller than a bs and have an mwd. i was able to shield tank an ogre launched from an ishtar in a sacrilege.

you keep saying "incorrect choice of drone by the rattlesnake pilot" but you forget that in most cases it's not him engaging more like the other way around; sentry drones will be worthless at point blank range, and rattle will be in no position to dictate range; and that's where heavy drones will come in, trying to kill the heavy tackler but yea, they won't.

eve today it's not an 1 vs1 game; it's stoped being like that along time ago; eve today is about fleets fights and ganks;
a dominx is a pain in the ass to kill for a small frig gang; if the domi pilot know his stuff will kill some and make the rest run away;
a rattlesnake in the same situation will probly just die: having trilions of dps do no good if you are not able to apply it


I keep saying "wrong drones" because it's not sinking in. You seem to be insisting on using heavies against fast, untackled targets, and sentries against tackled opponents at point-blank range. You're just making life difficult for yourself.

The point about environment is well made though. Battleships are generally used on in fleet and situations where mobility isn't important, but the "no 1v1" thing cuts both ways. Null Rattlesnake fleet may become a niche thing - nice buffer, great damage projection and able to bypass the drone assignment limit. In this case they'll almost always use sentries, so the heavy problems that you're so worried about won't arise. Elsewhere, the Rattlesnake will often be as heavy DPS support in a small gang, where the tackle needed to make good use of heavies will be available.

I don't understand why you're so upset about specious problems with the superheavies, when legitimate concerns about CPU and similarity of drone damage to the Dominix exist.


i'm not upset;
and i agree with you that as a fleet ship for close/med range(since you have allot of webs/painters to apply your dmg) this ship will become a great ship; maybe a bit OP considering drone assign thing;

as a solo/pve ship it will be "not the best choice by far" so to speak, and that puts it in a niche situation as a fleet ship; and a fleet doctrine based on a pirate ship hull... i don't see many out there...
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#1250 - 2014-04-23 18:19:56 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
baltec1 wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Angeleh wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Almost every other ship deals with frigs with 5 unbonused small drones. The rattler is now on par in that respect. where is the disadvantage?


The disadvantage is that the Rattlesnake was a drone boat, now it is a missile boat. And drone pilots have lost their only shield tanked option.


Its still a drone ship, it just happens to also get a good bonus to its missiles making it a much better ship and one of the most adaptable battleship platforms isk can buy.



Personally, I do not agree, with the first, it is now a drone ship in name only, but hopefully CCP Rise just didn't put ALL the stats regarding light and mediums because he thought we would assume they were unchanged (*hopeful*. But we will see either way) the third point I am afraid is that is it less adaptable than before so I respectfully do not agree, and neither do many others, but you are also entitled to your opinion. But regarding your second point, yes it does get a strong bonus to the missiles.


How is it less adaptable?

You now have a 50% bonus to every missile launcher from all size groups. This is unique in the battleship class and when coupled with unbonused light drones it means the rattle is one of the most deadly ships vs frigates where as the current one is rather vulnerable to them.



I do not disagree with it having the possibility to be adaptable with missiles, it clearly does.
It is however less adaptable, if one wishes to use drones.

So adaptable as a description depends on whether the drones matter to one.

People who use drones are posting their worries and concerns, so that is all that is required.
They can now be read and considered.


We can all agree that the rattlesnake needed improvement to make it an effective pirate ship.
If you are a missile user, it is an improvement but clearly not a class leader unless you wish to use rapid launchers.
If you are a drone user, it is less effective and the losses exceed the gains.

Drone users use this ship too, probably will not now unless they embrace the rapid missile launcher.
To my mind that is not a description of adaptable.

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1251 - 2014-04-23 18:20:23 UTC
gascanu wrote:


as a solo/pve ship it will be "not the best choice by far" so to speak, and that puts it in a niche situation as a fleet ship; and a fleet doctrine based on a pirate ship hull... i don't see many out there...




It has a resist bonus, a bonus to rapid heavies and its heavy/sentry bonus. This thing is a monster when solo vs a cruiser.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#1252 - 2014-04-23 18:26:05 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
gascanu wrote:


as a solo/pve ship it will be "not the best choice by far" so to speak, and that puts it in a niche situation as a fleet ship; and a fleet doctrine based on a pirate ship hull... i don't see many out there...




It has a resist bonus, a bonus to rapid heavies and its heavy/sentry bonus. This thing is a monster when solo vs a cruiser.


So are most ships, but does that really happen very often?


There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#1253 - 2014-04-23 18:27:47 UTC
epicurus ataraxia wrote:


So are most ships, but does that really happen very often?




No, most battleships are not this deadly when solo.
epicurus ataraxia
Illusion of Solitude.
Illusion of Solitude
#1254 - 2014-04-23 18:34:06 UTC  |  Edited by: epicurus ataraxia
baltec1 wrote:
epicurus ataraxia wrote:


So are most ships, but does that really happen very often?




No, most battleships are not this deadly when solo.


Unfortunately, it is difficult, to dictate that solo will happen.
I do see your point, as an anti frigate weapon, it will probably be the most effective user of the RLML.

But without being able to call up reasonably bonused drones, then a falcon will ruin your entire day..........

There is one EvE. Many people. Many lifestyles. WE are EvE
Ebag Trescientas
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1255 - 2014-04-23 18:51:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Ebag Trescientas
Ebag Trescientas wrote:
Morrigan LeSante wrote:

I have PvE'd extensively in guristas space. Can you please explain, as my 750 sentry DPS will remain 750 DPS now and in Summer.



Hate to tell you this, but you're wrong.

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/giving-drones-an-assist/
Quote:

The other major change we will be making to drone skills in the summer release will be the expansion of drone skills to affect all drone types consistently. This means that the racial Drone Specialization skills will now provide their damage bonus to Tech Two sentry drones as well as the normal combat drones

Quote:

They can also gain an extra 2% damage for each level of their racial Drone Specialization skill that is trained.


So post summer changes, damage should climb to ~825 DPS for sentries.

So assuming an fully DPS setup for missiles and sentries, sentries will still OD missiles, which makes this (just barely!) a drone focused boat. Big smile



Morrigan LeSante wrote:
@ebag: oops, forgot that Smile

Though I'm sure you know my point was I expect no ewar hit going from 5>2


Okay...and I'm wrong. (Though yes, I know that ewar against drones is a silly argument for the vast majority of scenarios.)


I applied the changes Fozzie published in his spreadsheet...and they're...well...see it for yourself.

Today a base Garde II would do 60 DPS with level 5 skills (no hull/module bonuses). On a RS today (with 3 DDA's) you're pushing out 150 DPS.

This summer, base Garde II damage will climb to 72 DPS (base damage is being boosted, plus 10% specialization bonus). On this summer's RS with 3 DDA's, one Garde II will push 451 DPS. (If split among 5 drones instead of 2, that equals out to 180.4 DPS.)

So your basic 3 DDA RS should be able to break 900 DPS from drones alone. Wow.





What if we said screw missiles, I <3 drones and want to max the damage?

You could add another DDA and increase your damage to 480 per drone, or 960 DPS. If you maxed out your drone stats, your Garde II's would have an effective range of 47.1 KM + 18 KM (65.1 KM total).

With the new Warden's, you would need 4 DLA's, 3 scope II rigs, a Sensor Booster II with range script, and a Signal Amp. Your range would effectively by capped by your targeting range of 154 KM (drone control range is 156KM, and Warden's falloff ends a few KM beyond that). (Fit omni in mid with tracking, or use drone nav x2 for heavies. Dual painters to make frigates easy targets.)

That fit would keep a invuln II and DCU, so you'd still have nearly a 100k EHP tank (as if you need them with a 150 KM range tank). If you dropped the two missile slots for armor reppers, you could keep your sentries and/or heavies alive for a looong time.



Frigate problem? What frigate problem? One single drone per frigate should insta-blap them from existence. Your biggest problem with them will be targeting the damn things, as you'll kill them faster than you can target new ones. P

Want Pyfa, but with more features?

Pyfa.fit
Cassandra Aurilien
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1256 - 2014-04-23 19:08:21 UTC
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
I'm going to vainly try to take this thread in another direction... Pirate battleships seem to be midway between Faction and T2 Marauders, with one exception: the Vindicator (and to a lesser extent, the Machariel). Every other single Pirate battleship has at least one utility high - except the Vindicator. Thus, I'm suggesting the following:

Vindicator
Specs: 7h(-1), 5m, 8l(+1); 6 turrets(-2)
Roll Bonus: 75% to large hybrid weapon damage
This is 4.5% less overall damage, but is offset by a utility high and additional low slot.

Machariel
Specs: 7h(-1), 6m(+1), 7l; 6 turrets(-1)
Roll Bonus: 37.5% to large projectile rate of fire
This is a slight damage buff of 2.9%, but provides the Machariel with another mid slot.



I can't really speak to the Vindi (don't use it much), but boosting the Mach with another effective slot, extra firepower & slightly lower ammo usage seems like a bit too much of a buff.

The Mach's nice, as it is. They didn't nerf it much, and boosting it this much would just be asking for a serious whack with the nerf stick. The shield Mach is more than viable... For PVE it can run most level 4's in an omni-tank without ever running a booster cycle. (In a T2 fit...) I wouldn't mind the extra mid for a few pvp fits, but it would seem a bit unbalanced.
Fabulous Rod
Darkfall Corp
#1257 - 2014-04-23 19:26:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Fabulous Rod
baltec1 wrote:
Fabulous Rod wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Angeleh wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Almost every other ship deals with frigs with 5 unbonused small drones. The rattler is now on par in that respect. where is the disadvantage?


The disadvantage is that the Rattlesnake was a drone boat, now it is a missile boat. And drone pilots have lost their only shield tanked option.


Its still a drone ship, it just happens to also get a good bonus to its missiles making it a much better ship and one of the most adaptable battleship platforms isk can buy.


This is a foolish and narrow-minded perspective. The increased vulnerabilities to e-war, the loss of bonuses on light and medium drones and missile velocity bonus, and massive reduction in drone bay make the Rattlesnake a decidedly worse ship. The DPS increase it got and extra survivability of 2 types of drones was not worth the heavy price in power the Snake paid. Additionally, 5 drones is better than 2. This to a ship that was already considered to be relatively under performing. It is a hard slap in the face to Guristas pilots. Apparently, a few devs desire to alter a ship to be radically and unnecessarily different trumps the desires of the majority of its pilot who choose to fly it for what it was.


A 50% bonus to rapid light missiles delivers a lot more firepower than a 50% bonus to light drones. When it comes to ECM you simply scoop the drone and redeploy, nobody is going to bother trying to jam drones over jamming a bonused missile spewing BS controling the drones, especialy given how fragile ECM boats are. The reduction in the drone bay means little due to the fact your sentries and heavies only take up 50m3 per flight now.




Jamming the BS is what we talking about, fool. The weaker drones makes the Snake even more vulnerable to ewar because it is more reliant on missile DPS now. Before, E-war had little effect on the Rattlesnake because its drones were so strong.

Additionally whenever you have to pull back a drone or a drone gets webbed, that is 50% of your drone DPS lost. This is why 5 drones are better than 2.

The Snake is really getting radically altered in a bad way. All its great strengths are being taken away. Guristas pilots should rightfully feel contempt towards CCP for screwing them over for some unnecessary vision of making ships radically different from each other.

If these changes go through there will be no good reason to train for a Rattlesnake. Real DPS will be better on other ships and the The gimped Rattlesnake will have nothing else to offer other than the novelty of using 2 drones instead of 5(Not what people spent the past 2+ years training for).

Get a clue.
If you are using your missile salvos on frigates in a Snake you are doing it wrong. Learn to play, baddy.
Ebag Trescientas
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1258 - 2014-04-23 19:28:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Ebag Trescientas
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
The base damage increase was to make up for the change in the drone interfacing skill from 20% per lvl to 10%, which is a small drop in DPS.


Yes, which might have something to do with the fact that I quoted Fozzie's statement on that exactly. Lol


Like I said, plug in the numbers and see for yourself. Since you're not providing any different ones, you apparently have nothing better than that. You also seem to be ignoring the 10% spec bonus that will now apply, which would more than offset any base damage reduction.


If/When CCP publishes new drone stat numbers, I'll be more than happy to plug them in and see what they look like (up or down). Until then, I can only use the numbers CCP provided...which shows over 900 DPS. Point is, to all those complaining about Rattler no longer being a drone boat, or how sentries are being nerfed, that's just simply not true. (Not that I expect anyone holding those stances to suddenly change their mind, just because CCP published numbers that say so.)

Want Pyfa, but with more features?

Pyfa.fit
gascanu
Bearing Srl.
#1259 - 2014-04-23 19:31:45 UTC  |  Edited by: gascanu
Ebag Trescientas wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
The base damage increase was to make up for the change in the drone interfacing skill from 20% per lvl to 10%, which is a small drop in DPS.


Yes, which might have something to do with the fact that I quoted Fozzie's statement on that exactly. Lol


Like I said, plug in the numbers and see for yourself. Since you're not providing any different ones, you apparently have nothing better than that. You also seem to be ignoring the 10% spec bonus that will now apply, which would more than offset any base damage reduction.


If/When CCP publishes new drone stat numbers, I'll be more than happy to plug them in and see what they look like (up or down). Until then, I can only use the numbers CCP provided...which shows over 900 DPS. Point is, to all those complaining about Rattler no longer being a drone boat, or how sentries are being nerfed, that's just simply not true. (Not that I expect anyone holding those stances to suddenly change their mind, just because CCP published numbers that say so. Especially when they make comments like "don't let the facts get in the way" when the facts state exactly what they don't want to believe.)


how hard is it to understand?

Quote:
The Drone Interfacing skill currently provides a 20% increase in drone damage per level, which makes it one of the most powerful skills in the game but also means that to be competitive with drones it is usually necessary to train this rank-5 skill all the way to level 5. The result is that drones have earned a reputation as a weapon system that is not suitable for new players.

We will be minimizing this problem by reducing the bonus from the Drone Interfacing skill to 10% per level, and building the extra damage into the base stats of the drones. That means that on average, all drones will be gaining about 33% more base damage and a character with Drone Interfacing trained to level 5 will see their damage remain constant (ignoring for a moment all the other drone changes being made in this release)


your eft is using the 20%/lvl dmg increase but from summer that will be only 10%/lvl
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1260 - 2014-04-23 19:33:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyberius Franklin
A few points:
1, I'm not seeing the statement you alluded to in the sentry breakdown given:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
I'm seeing a fair bit of confusion about the details of the Sentry changes. I left the nitty gritty details out of the text section of the blog since they don't lend themselves to easy summaries and the actual numbers were in the spreadsheet, but I'll go over the end results of the changes to T1 and T2 sentries here so people can see the whole picture. These numbers assume max skills:

Curator I - +15% tracking, -50% falloff, +18.15% damage
Warden I - +40% falloff, +12% damage
Garde I - +50% falloff, +2% damage
Bouncer I - +60% tracking, -12.5% optimal, +14.3% falloff, +2.86% damage

Curator II - +15% tracking, -50% falloff, +8.31% damage
Warden II - +40% falloff, +2.67% damage
Garde II - +50% falloff, -6.5% damage
Bouncer II - +60% tracking, -12.5% optimal, +14.3% falloff, -5.71% damage

Please note the statement that max drone skills are assumed. This would include Racial drone spec V.

It is stated in the blog, but you are entirely misinterpreting it. It's not just referring to the application of racial drone specs, but also the other changes, which in the case of sentries was not a constant, hence the need to make the above post. Also despite posting the means to confirm the numbers it's pretty clear you haven't done so.

Edit: Reposting since it seems the post linking was removed: Detailed stats

Old = (50(base)*1.92(damage multiplier)*2(Drone Interfacing)*1.25(Sentry Drone Interfacing)*1.5(Effective drone ship bonus))/4(ROF) = 90DPS/Grade II

New = (64(base)*1.7(damage multiplier)*1.5(Drone Interfacing)*1.25(Sentry Drone Interfacing)*1.5(Effective drone ship bonus)*1.1(Racial Drone Spec))/4(ROF) = 84.15DPS/Grade II

Which is a 6.5% reduction as started.