Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The problem of webbing a second drone isnt huge, its just magnified compared to a standard drone ship.

A target can with a single web just about negate the dps of a single heavy. When you are being hit by 5 its hardly worth the effort. When its just two, even if all you do is web and keep it at range you have cut incoming dps significantly.

The same is true of the ramifications of ECM on drones... Normally they just are not worth the effort. On the smaller hulls this is made up in the fact that each drone is almost a flights worth of dps individually, but on the Rattlesnake that is not the case... The Superdrone concept is actually a weakness if left at a break even point.

I will have to look again, as I am at work, but I dont recall sentries or heavies having especially strong sensors, and there is no way to improve it unless Command bonuses apply to drones, and I have never noticed that they do.

You are certainly better off just jamming the Rattlesnake if you can force it to recall its drones...

However, with the fluffed HP that will be a bit harder. On the other hand I am betting a skilled pilot in an unbonused hull could jam a sentry reliably with a multispectral jammer, while the same is much less certain for the snake itself. Again, I need to look at the base stats of the drones, but even so there is no way to improve that.

Edit: 22.5 is better than I assumed, but not by much. I dont know if it would be worth attempting in a hull that isnt itself bonused for jamming, especially with the multispec.

Yes, I assumed the target would continue to move and make an attwmpt to keep the drone at the edge of its range.

Edit: on the topic of things that dont work on drones, anyone ever tried keeping one scrambled? It occurs to me someone benefitting from skirmish links might have a significantly easier time dealing with superdrones.

I wonder if there is a reason why drones can't shoot while MWD is active. I understand needing to turn off MWD so they don't out-fly their tracking when in orbit, but if they are chasing the target with MWD on and not getting into orbit range it would be awesome if they would still shoot.

I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them. As always I let some edge cases stay.
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Thread reopened.

Seems to me the reason lights and mediums are not getting the 275% bonus is pretty obvious.

With 50m3 bandwidth and a 275% bonus on hammerheads you would be fielding a flight of 5 hammerheads doing the equivalent damage of 18.75 hammerheads.


That would be an awful lot of DPS.

That's a fair point, but unless they're going up against a BS with arties or other long ranged weaponry, I don't think it's going to make much (if any) of a difference. They just don't move fast enough and have a small enough sig size. Sentries, on the other hand, have the advantage of range tank.

While I wouldn't want to swap the stats straight across, I would like to see heavies bonused to be at least equivalent to sentries. IMHO they should also have a damage bonus greater than sentries, due to the damage application issues they have. Leave the drone bonus for sentry where it's at, add another 50-100% for heavies, and things would start to get real interesting.

My gut feeling is that the way heavies are setup now, you're going to have to treat them as disposable. Sure you only lose 2 compared to someone else losing 5, but no way are you going to be able to recall them in time to save them in most situations (mediums on the Gila will have the same problem, which is offset a little bit with the MWD changes coming). If they were tankier, you might have the option of being close in brawling like you will with the Gila, and swapping through drones as their shield tank broke. The shield buffer/regen just isn't enough as it stands now to make a significant difference, which is more than a little confusing considering that heavies are going to take FAR more damage than sentries will (being in the thick of things, as opposed to being at 30km-100km stand off range).

Try a current snake putting the launcher in the 5th slot. The hard points already exist. It's based on which slot you put the turrets/launchers in as to where they appear, so if you leave the first two slots empty and put them in the last slots, you get a different turret layout. Or you can leave the middle two slots empty at present for a different layout again etc.

I know on the rattlesnake that we have real concerns with the effective neutering of lit and medium drones on the rattlesnake and Gila.

And how it seems that althought the may be welcome and advantageous bonuses to the missile damage..
And it seems now that the balance has been completely disrupted, i know some will like that the ship can be a more missile ship and drones are now not really an option to fit for, almost always best to fit for millile damage and application mods.

But are we actually missing something and making a false assumption,


When ford bring out a new model, they give their press release and a little speech, must like a dev announcement.

They list the new features, but they do not tend to say, ah the car still has a laminated windscreen and electric windows.

I notice CCP rise does not say " I am unbonusing light and medium drones and give a brief reasoning why"

For ships that are currently drone boats, and flown in that way, that is a curious ommission.


Rather than assume it was deliberate, might it be a more reasonable assumption that he has no intention of making the ships so unbalanced, with such a change to their core useage, that he has no plans to neuter and nerf light and medium drones on these ships at all and we are getting so worried and excited over a simple misunderstanding on our part?

Please CCP rise, put our minds at rest, We are really concerned, and a shame if for nothing but the comfort of a few words.

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so:
the role bonus is a strait nerf to the rattlesnake:

- you lose dps and hp on light drones;
- you lose: dps and hp on medium drones;
- you lose:the ability to use 5 heavy ew/logistic drones- and i know there are not allot of pilots using them atm, but they will get a buff at some future point as ccp already promised; the same thing apply to medium drones

- you keep the same total dps and hp on heavy and sentry drones: and while at it, if 1 of your only 2 drones gets webbed, or manage a poor hit or a miss, that's half of your drone dps gone... and that will happen allot.

-you gain.... a bit more surviability for your heavy drones: sentrys don't really need hp boost, since you are in scoop range. and if you are not then it doesn't really matter they will die anyway; and if a heavy gets webbed at 30km away it will die with or without the hp bonus bonus

I'm sorry, but i don't see how can someone say this role bonus is am improvement for the rattlesnake; except maybe some ****** that think managing 5 drones is hard, lol, and maybe some semiafk mission runners.

now on the missile part:



this bonus and the adding of another launcher is an improvement to the current rattlesnake, there is not denying that, the paper stats looks very nice.
i'm not a missile user myself, except hams maibe, so i don't really know how well cruise missile really apply dmg in eve today.
but, looking around , i see that basically every missile bs that is used in some numbers today have a dmg aplication bonus: raven navy/golem/navy phoon, all of them have that in common. so i guess that they really need that bonus to put down their dps; a bonus that rattlesnake don't have.(i think this lack is intentional as CCP Rise is trying to find a spot for his( not really used weapon system) rapid launchers, and gila and rattle are basically build with rapid launchers in mind)

So, i think that there will be a big difference between paper numbers and reall numbers when it come to missiles;

as a conclusion:
is this new rattlesnake better that the old one? yes.
it this new rattlesnake on the same lvl with the rest of the pirate bs? no!

p.s. i remember the last pirate bs rebalance pass; it was basically the same at least regarding the rattlesnake: ALLOT of ppl complained that the role bonus(50% bonus to Cruise missile and Torpedo max velocity) was a wasted bonus on a 4 unbonused launchers; and there were some ppl that were all out about how awesome the rattlesnake will be....
i don't remember the name of the dev that was doing the rebalance at that time, but he deceided to ignore all the arguments about the wasted bonus and to go with the "positive feedback"(ring a bell?) on it; we all know what happent after that: rattlesnake become the worse pirate bs in game for a looong time; CCP Rise, you should learn from that