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PI Costs
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tab one
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-12-01 16:11:28 UTC
I am very upset about the new PI setup... there is no way i can make PI cost effective... I do PI in nul sec and between the taxes and the shipping costs to get my T2 and T3 products out i will be loosing millions of isk's to continue
Omega Flames
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2 - 2011-12-01 16:15:30 UTC
friendly warning, your thread is about to be locked as CCP are locking all threads concerning PI taxes / POCO except the ONLY one where the OP agreed with the change.
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2011-12-01 16:17:39 UTC
Your thread will be locked soon and you will be directed to a thread from a well known null sec alliance member.

There your fears and concerns will be dismissed and sometimes laughed at.

CCP would like to remind you to pay your taxes and happy holidays.
tab one
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-12-01 16:20:34 UTC
at least 2 ppl got to see it Shocked
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2011-12-01 16:23:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Jim Hooknose
I sympathize with you. This is how I think it went down:

CCP decides to shank high sec PI but knows if that is all they do people will unsub in droves SO

They play it smart. They work on some things people have been BEGGING for years for and everyone glosses over the gutting of PI.
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2011-12-01 16:25:17 UTC
Oh, and here is the thread CCP will direct you to. You can voice your opinions but prepared to be shutdown unless you have nice things to say about PI changes.
tab one
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-12-01 16:36:08 UTC
Ill just shut my PI planets down for a while... figure if they get enough ppl doing that there wont be any game to play... hard to build stuff if u have no supplies ... just sucks that ive spent a lot of time and isk training my PI skills
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#8 - 2011-12-01 16:44:51 UTC
Welcome to the club bro
Dr Mercy
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2011-12-01 17:03:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Dr Mercy
tab one wrote:
I am very upset about the new PI setup... there is no way i can make PI cost effective... I do PI in nul sec and between the taxes and the shipping costs to get my T2 and T3 products out i will be loosing millions of isk's to continue


My advice would be not to sell them yet. Prices should come up as people exit the market (i.e. stop producing these underpriced items). Of course, you may not have the capital to withstand the continued running costs. At which point you'll have to let the factories and extractors stop until such time as you can make a profit again.

Edit:
tab one wrote:
Ill just shut my PI planets down for a while... figure if they get enough ppl doing that there wont be any game to play... hard to build stuff if u have no supplies ... just sucks that ive spent a lot of time and isk training my PI skills


Oh, this is what you are doing. Carry on.

o7.

Make isk with PI: http://failheap-challenge.com/showthread.php?1207-What-to-do-PI-Processor-only-planets
Teuna
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2011-12-01 17:28:55 UTC
The new costs associated with PI in HS is total BS. I really do not even know why they decided to go down this route.
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2011-12-01 17:31:59 UTC
My guess? Too many subs.
Dr Mercy
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2011-12-01 17:35:03 UTC
Teuna wrote:
The new costs associated with PI in HS is total BS. I really do not even know why they decided to go down this route.


If Highsec PI was both the safest AND the cheapest option - why would anyone do PI anywhere else?

Make isk with PI: http://failheap-challenge.com/showthread.php?1207-What-to-do-PI-Processor-only-planets
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#13 - 2011-12-01 17:45:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Jim Hooknose
I, personally, am fine with low/null sec being more profitable. I just don't want high sec made LESS profitable.

Keep your POCOs (and their adjustable tax rates). They encourage pvp and player interaction I guess. Just don't lower my PI profits in high sec.

To sum it up:
+1 non-empire space and -1 empire = BAD
+1 non-empire space and no adjustment to empire = GOOD

Hell even,

+2 non-empire space and no adjustment to empire = GOOD
Akrasjel Lanate
Immemorial Coalescence Administration
Immemorial Coalescence
#14 - 2011-12-01 17:55:23 UTC
Then stop PI, there will be more for me Blink

CEO of Lanate Industries

Citizen of Solitude
agrajag119
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#15 - 2011-12-01 19:09:21 UTC
PI may not be profitable at current prices, thats by design. Sounds screwy, I know. Guess what though, there is no way for the eve economy to function without PI goods. So once all the people get adjusted to what the new costs per unit are, guess what is going to happen to the price of PI goods? Yup, thats right kids, they'll go *up*

Once they go up, guess what ... you'll be making isk again. Whether or not that is as much as you made before per unit remains to be seen. I'd bet the overall profit will stay pretty close to what it was before.
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#16 - 2011-12-01 22:37:05 UTC
The problem is that eventually you reach a point where the players are no longer willing to pay the price and find lower cost alternatives.

Also, the actual rate they tax at is flexible, so be prepared for the taxes to increase with the prices.

And, yes, we're all counting down till CCP locks the thread, just like they do every time it's a Damage Control party.

Let me try to speed it up: BoB T20 goons BPOs POCO NeX aurum monocle

and a partridge in a pear tree!
Dr Mercy
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2011-12-02 00:19:38 UTC
Jim Hooknose wrote:
I, personally, am fine with low/null sec being more profitable. I just don't want high sec made LESS profitable.

Keep your POCOs (and their adjustable tax rates). They encourage pvp and player interaction I guess. Just don't lower my PI profits in high sec.

To sum it up:
+1 non-empire space and -1 empire = BAD
+1 non-empire space and no adjustment to empire = GOOD

Hell even,

+2 non-empire space and no adjustment to empire = GOOD


Yeah, it's **** when your chosen isk making activity gets nerfed in EVE. We need it to pay for the **** we want to buy and we don't want less of it!

However, I have a question. Say they kept Highsec PI taxes at 5% as they were before - how would anyone with a POCO in lowsec use it to entice people out there?

Make isk with PI: http://failheap-challenge.com/showthread.php?1207-What-to-do-PI-Processor-only-planets
PipBrown
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#18 - 2011-12-02 00:42:11 UTC  |  Edited by: PipBrown
I don't understand the fuss from player unhappy with the changes to PI taxes. Why can't they just increase the price of the product to offset any incurred taxes.
Jim Hooknose
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2011-12-02 00:51:07 UTC
Dr Mercy wrote:
However, I have a question. Say they kept Highsec PI taxes at 5% as they were before - how would anyone with a POCO in lowsec use it to entice people out there?


In low sec you can prevent all taxes by putting a POCO up. 0% is better than 5%. Plus a POCO would keep players from accessing the planet unless you permit them to. IIRC the number of players extracting on a planet affects the yield from the ECUs. Less players extracting = more yield for the few who are extracting.

Oh, and meeting us halfway with something like 7.5% would be a step in the right direction. Better than the current replies of "Working as intended!" that we have heard so far.
Dr Mercy
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2011-12-02 01:03:29 UTC
Jim Hooknose wrote:
Dr Mercy wrote:
However, I have a question. Say they kept Highsec PI taxes at 5% as they were before - how would anyone with a POCO in lowsec use it to entice people out there?


In low sec you can prevent all taxes by putting a POCO up. 0% is better than 5%. Plus a POCO would keep players from accessing the planet unless you permit them to. IIRC the number of players extracting on a planet affects the yield from the ECUs. Less players extracting = more yield for the few who are extracting.

Oh, and meeting us halfway with something like 7.5% would be a step in the right direction. Better than the current replies of "Working as intended!" that we have heard so far.


Hmm, so in your view lowsec POCOs can't realistically be used to generate income via third parties using the planets for PI - only for corps/alliances to undercut highsec CO taxes?

A margin of only 5% doesn't sound a particularly large incentive for these kinds of players to invest in the POCO structures (100 mil) and operate under the risk present in lowsec. A mere 5% premium for operating in the safety of highsec? When I look at it from this point of view 10% doesn't even seem like a large enough margin either!

Make isk with PI: http://failheap-challenge.com/showthread.php?1207-What-to-do-PI-Processor-only-planets
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