EVE General Discussion

That's just it, you don't have to sit in a station for 2 months.

Yes we moaned about the learning skills, as a result newbies have a far easier time than we did, do we begrudge them this?

No we don't. Learning skills were an abomination and a huge barrier, and we're glad that they're gone, because it especially benefits newbies. Everything we had to train to increase character attributes is now baked into a new character in the form of much better starting attributes.

Lets see, I've done lowsec exploration and ratting, annoyed people in wormholes by posting in local (they either POS up or start hunting for me, much fun is generally had by all), quite often run highsec anoms and get 500k to 1.2M in bounties every 15 minutes with a frigate or destroyer, and I'm seriously considering moving her to NPC null.

My main, this character, undocked last night for the first time in a month, been using my newbie alt instead.

Nobody mentioned +5's, and +3's are cheap.

At least 50% of PvP in Eve doesn't involve shooting at other players. If you're competing with another player, be it for rocks, sales on the market, selling loot, or just about everything else you can do, you're engaged in PvP.

I agree completely, but since someone made the comparison, I reused it.

This whole entire post is related to the first couple months. What does a new player do that is worthwhile for their first 2 months in eve?

They make next to nothing doing pve. If they branch out into something else like blobing low sec gate campers in frigs they still make zero isk and delay the training to what they really want while they skill small guns and frigs.

new player does the main thing in this game: he is getting used to it! He discovers new systems/ships/things. He meets people.

Actually first 2 months are the most funny. After that Eve becomes known place you see nothing really exciteful.
But first time is just incredible! I really wish i could erase all memories about Eve from my memory and restart it all again!

they think they do

Bad parents exist

inb4 predictable/unoriginal "like urs lolz"

I prefer to create my own character and name it with an account that is actually mine. I want to build it and skill it to be my own special little snow flake. I want to make my own mistakes and learn from them my own way. I don't just want to buy someone else's character and baggage.

If someones version of winning is having more isk or more sp this game is so pay to win it's not even funny. Seeing as how that is mentality of a huge amount of the current and future player base perhaps that should be taken with a little more then a grain of salt.

Why would it **** of existing characters? Could it be because they may have to finally admit that SP are an advantage and they don't want new players to close the gap on them quicker?
Existing players would have full access to the exact same boost so I don't see why they would "get nothing out of it"

Well what you see as the truth is wrong.

also, the "mother" thing, you're interpreting it as the person in question's mother. Like, "as your mother".

I clearly stated "as a mother". Which you often find when it comes to people pushing their beliefs onto others without an actual argument other than their personal feeling and what they feel should be a credential lending factor.

You rang?

It hurts everyone because you've just introduced the ability to ignore game mechanics you don't like by paying for it. This is inherently bad. It's so bad that the EULA even contains a rule against acquiring stuff at an accelerated rate compared to normal gameplay, and CCP will ban people who break that rule. They're far from alone in this — it's a standard rule you'll find in almost every game because of how it imbalances and unduly favours the people who exploit it.

What if you could pay to skip the warp scrambling mechanic? What if you could pay to skip the ISK creation mechanics? What if you could pay to skip the damage mechanic? They be more extreme examples, but they demonstrate why skipping mechanics is a bad idea to begin with: because they're there for a reason, and they apply equally to everyone for a reason. Paying to skip them does not make the idea any better — quite the opposite. It just means that you have two layers of inequality, neither of them good.

“Oh but it's just SP” isn't an excuse, because no matter how you twist and turn it, you still make separate people into two rule groups depending on how much they spend. It unbalances the game by instantly devaluating the time spent of those already in the game. It unbalances the game by vastly boosting old players over new ones. It unbalances the game by, as mentioned, skipping over a core balance mechanic, and worse: it only skips over it for some (that's why the come-back is always: if you want to train faster, just ask them to make training faster) — that is pretty much the definition of imbalance. Above all, it doesn't solve any kind of problem that can't be solved in ways that don't break the game.

Good news: there is no wait to play problem. That's just the imagination of people who thinks that EVE is your standard xp/class/level-based game acting up. Rather, the problem is that people think reaching level X, getting ship Y, and unlocking gizmo Z is an absolute must before they try whatever activity they're going for. In reality, they can try right now, and reaching X, Y, and Z will not actually change their gameplay much. If they wait, they will suck, they will lose a lot, and they will be disenchanted when it turns out that what they've been waiting for is pretty boring. If they don't wait, they can find out right now whether X, Y, or Z will improve the speed of what they're already doing in any meaningful way (because, again, that's all that will happen).

Oh, I know. See sig. What I think a lot of P2Wers forget is that it only takes a long time if you are hell-bent on training them to lvl V. It is also very stupid to have lvl V as your baseline. It is not something you absolutely have to have or you're screwed forever — it's something you might want to get eventually, but which you can survive without in the meantime.

That isn't really a counter to the vast list of things you can do from day 1. That's a counter against some never expressed argument that you can earn top ISK from day one using the methods explained in the tutorial.

If you branch out into PvP, you can try PvP from day 1. Your goal of flying a battleship is just that: a goal. It is not a requirement. It is not a minimum baseline. It is perhaps not even a good goal, strictly speaking. And yes, you can use implants just fine — you just have to bump up the pod safety lessons a few steps on your priority list.

Manufacturing takes about 2 months to become competitive; the main sink is not the training, but getting your hands on researched BPOs. And “fun” is completely subjective and not a valid measure of what can or cannot be done. The fact remains that you can scam right out the character creator and earn many PLEXes worth of ISK in a matter of hours. Your choice not to do this does for some personal reason not mean that the option doesn't exist. Suicide ganking requires maybe two weeks of skills before it can be done with some efficiency, and “ruin your character” is just another subjective characterisation.

The biggest discrepancy here is still the confusion between the goal and the baseline. You don't start at the goal; you start now, and reach the goal later on. Also, getting to the goal will not change what you're doing — the activity is the same, and if you don't start now, you will be completely befuddled by what goes on when that goal is reached.

Funny to see the vets type out long, precise, well-thought out posts and the newbs return with one-liner: "You are wrong!" posts.

I don't know if you guys are just that dead-set in your opinions that you refuse to even consider someone else's point of view, our your are just that plain f'in stupid...

The thing is, it's not wrong and you'll find that most of our forum posting peers will agree with me rather than you . Not that such agreement is needed: you are not mentally suited to EVE online as evidenced by the fact that you do so much posting about how bad the game is for new players. I was a new player in 2007 with much less access to the things you have now and i (and most of us here) survived easily without having to make posts asking for changes.

If you go to a swimmign pool and see one guy jump in and swim easily and another go in and struggle, the 1st logical thought is "that second guy needs swimming lessons". If the 2nd guy goes and gets swimming lessons and comes back and still struggles, that then means that swimming probably isn't for him.

In the above example , you are the 2nd guy who keeps jumping into the water, struggles, then complains that it's dumb and unfair for water to hamper one's abilty to breath when one is submerged in it rather than understanding that you can't swim.