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Anti-probing Sniper Tengu
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Nad'x Hapax
Hapaxa
#1 - 2014-04-07 14:24:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Nad'x Hapax
I have been thinking of getting myself one of those and I have a question or 2.

1) How har are they to probe down? What will my enemies need to do it?

2) This is what Im thinking about flying:

MFS II
MFS II
Signal Amp II
GBA II

ECCM - Grav II
ECCM - Grav II
Passive Targeter II
TC II
TC II

250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II

Anti-EM I
Locus II
Locus II


Supplemental Screening
Dissolution Sequencer
Power Core Multiplier
Magnetic Infusion Basin
Intercalated Nanofibers



This Will give me: 265 DPS at 207km optimal with Spike. 186 Grav sensor STR. Align time 4.6 sec. Targeting range 227km.


Plz gimme pointers!
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#2 - 2014-04-07 15:40:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Bertrand Butler
From what I see, you are missing one med slot. Judging by the stats you give, you are missing one sebo.

1. Have in mind that a talon or a halo set can be very good for the application at hand. Talons are very cheap btw.
2. Do not use T2 ECCMs, go for the meta4 conjuctive variant.
3. Instead of focusing on extreme range, it is better to use multiple on-grid bookmarks and bounce around the battlefield as you see fit. The gravitational capacitor sub together with 1-2 T2 HVOs will serve you well.
4. Don't use extenders or shield rigs that boost your signature radius.
5. Three magstabs at a minimum.

Lastly, have in mind that an Eagle or a Naga can do pretty much the same thing..while being a lot cheaper.
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#3 - 2014-04-07 16:01:45 UTC
Go look up ELO Knight's loss this last weekend on eve-kill.

Impossible to scan down afaik.

Not today spaghetti.
Last Wolf
Umbra Wing
#4 - 2014-04-07 16:33:01 UTC
Wouldn't it be easier to fit a cloak?

That awkward moment at the Gentlemen's Club when you see your sister on the stage....and you're not sure where to put the money....
George Boothe
Blootered Bastards
#5 - 2014-04-07 16:38:19 UTC
I believe the idea is to not be combat probable whilst sitting far of a gate and shooting stuff.
Last Wolf
Umbra Wing
#6 - 2014-04-07 17:39:26 UTC
I haven't used probes in a while, is it fairly simple to probe an on-grid target to create a warp in? When I was hanging out in WH space 2-3 years ago it would take forever to position probes to scan down a stationary site/wh, I can't imagine how annoying it would be to try and quickly scan a ship before they moved enough so that your warp-in wasn't 100km away.

That awkward moment at the Gentlemen's Club when you see your sister on the stage....and you're not sure where to put the money....
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#7 - 2014-04-07 17:59:25 UTC
If I could actually SEE your ship, My probe toon could probe you in one scan cycle.
If you were more than 150 away, 1 warp would get tackle on top of you.

You'd be safer sitting at 120 than you are at 200.
Nad'x Hapax
Hapaxa
#8 - 2014-04-07 21:04:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Nad'x Hapax
Thanks all of u. Im now looking at an Eagle to test this out. Might upgrade for a Tengu later on if I like the results.

This is what Im now looking at:


Eagle for 100-140km:

GBA II
MFS II
MFS II
MFS II

ECCM - Grav (M4)
ECCM - Grav
ECCM - Grav
ECCM - Grav
TC II
TC II

250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II

Locus II
Locus II


321 DPS at 113km or 258 DPS at 130km. 140m sig and 263 Sensor strength. Low grade Talon set.



Tengu for 100-180km:

GBA II
MFS II
MFS II
MFS II

ECCM - Grav (M4)
ECCM - Grav
ECCM - Grav
ECCM - Grav
SEBO II
TC II

250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II

Locus I
Locus II
Locus II

Supplemental Screening
Dissolution Sequencer
Power Core Multiplier
Magnetic Infusion Basin
Intercalated Nanofibers


The differences are that this one actually can do longer ranges. Its also a big diff in the Sensor strength department. A tad more DPS on the ranges specified for the Eagle.

Sensor strength 408 and Sig 157m.


I feel like Ive overdone the sensor strength thing on the Tengu but I rather like that. What did I do wrong and what did I do right?
Nad'x Hapax
Hapaxa
#9 - 2014-04-07 21:05:45 UTC
RavenPaine wrote:
If I could actually SEE your ship, My probe toon could probe you in one scan cycle.
If you were more than 150 away, 1 warp would get tackle on top of you.

You'd be safer sitting at 120 than you are at 200.



Now thats the thing. I need more than that. Can I make it so that u just cant scan me down and in that case how?
Froggy Storm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#10 - 2014-04-08 06:48:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Froggy Storm
Not sure if you can get the eagle to be "unscan".

I use quotes because there have been a number of changes to make that more and more difficult. I know it has been impossible to be 100% immune from scan for some time. However, it required max skills and implants. The addition of more mids to further boost probe str in combination with further tweeking of the ECCM soft cap have made the requirements lower still.
xPredat0rz
Project.Nova
The Initiative.
#11 - 2014-04-08 06:56:50 UTC
Sexy Cakes wrote:
Go look up ELO Knight's loss this last weekend on eve-kill.

Impossible to scan down afaik.


elo was probed down and had a bomber wing warped in on him to secure this kill http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=22817719

So not unprobable. Just a pain in the ass to probe out.
Nad'x Hapax
Hapaxa
#12 - 2014-04-08 10:17:14 UTC
With the fit i presented Ill have higher sensor str than the Elo Knights fit, considering I have one additional ECCM - Grav and one GBA II. This is not counting implants. He might have had a regular Talon set while Ill have a low-grade.

I kind of need numbers if anyone have the insight and will to provide it.

What will be needed to scan down a Tengu --> 157 Sig / 408 sensor str = 0.385
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#13 - 2014-04-09 06:45:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Lloyd Roses
Nad'x Hapax wrote:
With the fit i presented Ill have higher sensor str than the Elo Knights fit, considering I have one additional ECCM - Grav and one GBA II. This is not counting implants. He might have had a regular Talon set while Ill have a low-grade.

I kind of need numbers if anyone have the insight and will to provide it.

What will be needed to scan down a Tengu --> 157 Sig / 408 sensor str = 0.385


That threshold is floored at .98 , so straight out unprobable simply doesn't work. However, the BL. Tengu is basically unprobable and requires a covops full of scanmods (2 grav upgrades, 2 rangefinders) or virtues to get a hit.

Also, main idea of that tengu is to be nullified AND hard to probe. So if something is landing on you, you just warp off even against a dictor to prevent getting bombed.
Luwc
State War Academy
Caldari State
#14 - 2014-04-09 06:55:51 UTC
Nad'x Hapax wrote:
I have been thinking of getting myself one of those and I have a question or 2.

1) How har are they to probe down? What will my enemies need to do it?

2) This is what Im thinking about flying:

MFS II
MFS II
Signal Amp II
GBA II

ECCM - Grav II
ECCM - Grav II
Passive Targeter II
TC II
TC II

250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II

Anti-EM I
Locus II
Locus II


Supplemental Screening
Dissolution Sequencer
Power Core Multiplier
Magnetic Infusion Basin
Intercalated Nanofibers



This Will give me: 265 DPS at 207km optimal with Spike. 186 Grav sensor STR. Align time 4.6 sec. Targeting range 227km.


Plz gimme pointers!


pretty **** DPS and overall damage.

You will be more usefull going balls deep with an enyo :D

or get a tornado and snipe properly.

Unless you have a big fleet of these (see BL) this thing is pretty much a massive waste of ISK.

http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267520.gif
ChromeStriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2014-04-09 07:42:02 UTC  |  Edited by: ChromeStriker
Some fore thought and and smart flying and a tornado or other teir 3 BC will do a better job....

20 book marks and a choke point stargate later and this thing pwns:

[Tornado, Sniper]
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Reactor Control Unit II

10MN Microwarpdrive II
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script
Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script
Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script

1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L
1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma L

Medium Targeting System Subcontroller I
Medium Ionic Field Projector I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I

10,000 volly 650+ dps @ 120km

aaaand if you have a prober problem, run the MWD, swap to tracking and sensor resolution and oneshot the frig when he lands lol

No Worries
Nad'x Hapax
Hapaxa
#16 - 2014-04-09 10:48:58 UTC
Luwc wrote:
Nad'x Hapax wrote:
I have been thinking of getting myself one of those and I have a question or 2.

1) How har are they to probe down? What will my enemies need to do it?

2) This is what Im thinking about flying:

MFS II
MFS II
Signal Amp II
GBA II

ECCM - Grav II
ECCM - Grav II
Passive Targeter II
TC II
TC II

250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II
250mm Rail II

Anti-EM I
Locus II
Locus II


Supplemental Screening
Dissolution Sequencer
Power Core Multiplier
Magnetic Infusion Basin
Intercalated Nanofibers



This Will give me: 265 DPS at 207km optimal with Spike. 186 Grav sensor STR. Align time 4.6 sec. Targeting range 227km.


Plz gimme pointers!


pretty **** DPS and overall damage.

You will be more usefull going balls deep with an enyo :D

or get a tornado and snipe properly.

Unless you have a big fleet of these (see BL) this thing is pretty much a massive waste of ISK.


My aim is not to kill off cruiser+ fleets with it. My aim is to be a annoying and kill of a frig or two. Just because I find it to be fun. This is also solo work so there aint a fleet depending on what I do.
Nad'x Hapax
Hapaxa
#17 - 2014-04-09 10:51:34 UTC
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Nad'x Hapax wrote:
With the fit i presented Ill have higher sensor str than the Elo Knights fit, considering I have one additional ECCM - Grav and one GBA II. This is not counting implants. He might have had a regular Talon set while Ill have a low-grade.

I kind of need numbers if anyone have the insight and will to provide it.

What will be needed to scan down a Tengu --> 157 Sig / 408 sensor str = 0.385


That threshold is floored at .98 , so straight out unprobable simply doesn't work. However, the BL. Tengu is basically unprobable and requires a covops full of scanmods (2 grav upgrades, 2 rangefinders) or virtues to get a hit.

Also, main idea of that tengu is to be nullified AND hard to probe. So if something is landing on you, you just warp off even against a dictor to prevent getting bombed.



So what u are saying is that a lower value than .98 is a waste of med and low slots? So when my value is .35 my real value is still .98?

This will also not be used in null so the nullifier seems like a waste