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Dev Blog: True Stories – What did you think?

First post
Author
Magnor Aldent
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#61 - 2014-04-03 14:40:08 UTC
Good:
Printed Media: Eve Source was truly amazing. More artwork is always good
Artists: I did like the different ways the artist illustrated the eve universe

Bad:
The Story: While an important story in the player driven universe, it just didn't grip me the same way the chronicles did.
ANGER: Why is everyone in the comic always yelling? It seemed a bit over-dramatic.
Confusing: Way too many characters and it was a pain to keep track of everyone.

Suggestion:
Focus on Eve lore stories instead of player driven.
If player based stories help sell more comics, then at least make them shorter stories. Big battles told with info from both sides.
B-R5RB would be perfect for a short Eve comic, especially with the press from it recently.
Borgholio
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#62 - 2014-04-03 15:30:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Borgholio
I have been thoroughly enjoying the story so far. I was a (small) part of what happened in the aftermath and it's fun seeing something I had a hand in make it into a comic.

Also the artwork has been quite good...for the first three issues. I have to agree with previous posters that the artwork in issue #4 sucks. The first three were refined, polished, and very high quality drawings. #4 is the kind of crap I would expect from an old GI-Joe comic from the 80's.

Please CCP, ask Dark Horse to bring back one of the previous artists to do the rest of the series. And have them re-release #4 with new artwork if at all possible.

While I'll admit the #4 artist is still way better than I can do, he's not up to the quality of the first three. Thanks.

Edit - Just realized, issue #4 concludes the story arc? I don't think so...the looting of the assets was just the first part of what became a war of extermination lasting months. The good parts are still coming up, so hopefully they continue the story with a new series of comics.

You will be assimilated...bunghole!

PinkKnife
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#63 - 2014-04-03 19:47:58 UTC
Weaselior wrote:

The story selected was, by far, the best. No other story came close, except xttz's - and that's because xttz's was similarly galactic in scale and actually about interesting events.

There's a reason those stories won, and it's not that goons voted for them. It's that there are so many goons because those stories are compelling and drew them into the game.


If you say so, but popularity never has anything to do with quality. I'd figure everyone is familiar enough with that logical fallacy to see through it.

It just so happens the most voted on story goes to the alliance with the most members, entirely shocking and unprecedented. The BOB story is so old and tired because goons trot it out anytime any third person asks questions about EVE. I can't see how any current player would find it compelling when we're lectured with it in the media over, and over, and over again.

Eliminating personal taste, you get what the selection process was, a basic highschool popularity contest. And you get what you expect, basic highschool stories.
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#64 - 2014-04-03 20:01:10 UTC
I haven't read them yet, but plan to do so now while they're still free. Comics were never much my thing.

However, this mixing of OOC and IC sounds ridiculous to me.

You don't hear about the guy who was dual-boxing Batman and Robin, you just read the story as the characters develop it.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.

Paledan Safemal
Higher Than Everest
Hazardous Company
#65 - 2014-04-03 22:17:32 UTC
I'm a big comics fan, so I read it all, and will get the published version.

I also liked the 4th artist, who was better than the previous ones at not making his characters completely change heads from one page to another. He was probably one of the best at composition, though clearly drawing spaceship wasn't what he liked doing, or should be doing.

I generally didn't like the story, however, for the reasons already mentioned above:

- Can someone please tell me what's going on? We have a guy with a goatee who is being mad at everybody, for different reasons, throughout the volumes. We have Goonswarm mentioned every other page, though never quite in the same context. We have a super-smug Mittani pulling the strings, which I guess makes me glad someone at least seems to be following the plot Twisted And no, that is not grrgoons-ing because what I'm complaining about is that we don't really understand who the Goons are in that story, apart from "the winning side".

- I almost stopped reading with the first fight, for the reasons already mentioned, for which my pennance was that I saw a Maelstrom taking out half a squad of Arazus on its own. I mean... SERIOUSLY?

- I didn't get all the fuss about the Iterons, and the plot is so messy that I wasn't particularly interested in finding out.

So as others wrote, please get competent people to write a script. It is possible to do slow-paced in comic form. It is possible to write a saga, providing the characters don't feel the need to burst an artery every page. But it needs to be somewhat believable. If these are "True Stories", then all there is to the EVE universe isn't the vastness of space or the spaceships, but a bunch of unwashed guys with serious attitude problems fighting behind hologram screens.
Charles Javeroux
INTERSTELLAR CREDIT
#66 - 2014-04-04 06:22:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Charles Javeroux
I was excited to read the first part of the True Stories. I was a little less excited when I started to read the second part of the True Stories. When I finished, I was pretty disappointed so did not bother to read the third and fourth part of the series.
The whole storytelling were pretty confusing - confusing to to read and confusing to understand WTF is going on.
And this is from a person who's been playing EVE for 8 years.

CCP, when you ever going to do something like that again, choose the story yourself and do not let the EVE community know what you chose. Please leave us the excitement of discovery.

Also kudos CCP for leading me to Dark Horse Digital. Big smile
I'm now a fanboy of their newly launched "Serenity - Leaves On The Wind" series, which picks up the pieces where the film dropped them off. Also the "Veil" is pretty exciting storytelling.
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#67 - 2014-04-04 10:44:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Vera Algaert
Magnor Aldent wrote:

B-R5RB would be perfect for a short Eve comic, especially with the press from it recently.

I disagree completely.

A B-R short story would just be a long list of primaries with the occasional Russian managing to jump out before dying, I don't see any story material (you know the usual tropes - overcoming adversity, betrayal, finding yourself/coming of age, winning love, ...) there.

The only part of the battle that wasn't straight forward was the question whether PL/N3 would jump in their US TZ or not, in a good story this would have turned the battle around but in reality it just didn't happen.

.

Debir Achen
Makiriemi Holdings
#68 - 2014-04-04 11:00:05 UTC
CCP keeps saying "available to download". How exactly does one download them, as opposed to reading on-line in a browser?

Aren't Caldari supposed to have a large signature?

Rico Ramos
See Red
#69 - 2014-04-04 11:37:16 UTC
1. I love the fact that it was free to download. And if you want a paid version you can get the book with all the issues in it via omnibus! Don't change that concept.

2. IMO I loved the cover art for issue 2.

3. Seeing this in comic book format made me want WiS all the more. (sorry folks)

4. The way that the stories were chosen is long past, that boat has sailed. I did like the voting concept tho. The next few issues could be about certain themes ie a few issues about bank heists or revenge. One offs.

5. This one was a hard thought, but keep chronicles; chronicles! And use the comics to tell player stories. Something about reading the chronicles and letting my own imagination visualize the story works for me!

6. Don't stop.




PS: Bring back EON!!!!!! (or at least bring back the old issues via DL)

\o/

Internet Space Ships is Serious Business

Che Biko
Alexylva Paradox
#70 - 2014-04-04 16:31:56 UTC
  • I thought the art was very underwhelming, not what I expected of an EVE comic at all. I would have liked them better if Winterblink would have made them (Warp Drive Active style), and I feel like that would probably still feel underwhelming, but at least I would be somewhat satisfied.
  • The story was not well told, and indeed hard to follow sometimes.
  • This was amplified with the various artists renditions of the characters, as I sometimes did not recognize them at first. Next time: One story, one artist.
  • I think the story was cut too short to tell the story well and for the reader to get immersed, didn't care much for the characters or their factions. I've seen cardboard characters with more dept. Then again, maybe the story was not interesting enough to make it longer.
  • Maybe you should work with a voting system where only those who submitted stories can vote, and the votes of popular writers should weigh more than those that have no fans at all.
  • Publication methods are fine. The time between the publication of the issues was nice, not too long, not too short.
  • I was not a fan of this first attempt, but I would like to see you try again, and hopefully you'll create something more to my taste.
Draekas Darkwater
Frank Exchange of Views
#71 - 2014-04-04 23:27:13 UTC
The Chronicles and EVE Source are just way better IMO. I would stick to those types of endeavors but maybe those won't draw in new players, which is the whole point of trying a comic book.

However if you specifically want constructive criticism on the comic book format, well:

The art was just not appealing. Moving the hyper-realistic art style of EVE itself to a comic book style just didn't work for me, as an EVE player who is biased that way. Changing artists from book to book was just a bad decision.

As others have said, following the story was just hard/impossible. I was around back then and have heard the story dozens of times, and I just didn't know what to make of this effort. One main problem was likely the story chosen was WAY to big to fit into 4 comics, so next time, choose an appropriately sized story to tell depending on the medium is being told on. Don't be stupid and try to cram The Song of Ice and Fire series into a movie trilogy, and expect it to hold up.

For story submission, if you MUST stick with these true story things, don't do it by popular vote entirely. Anyone who follows the CSM knows how easy it is for one small but organized segment of the player base can just blob the process, and not to its benefit either. Try the STV system next time perhaps, and let everyone rank stories they like, how they like.

Also, as I said above, weed out / disqualify any stories that are too broad in scope and/or require too much insider knowledge to appreciate. The selected story should be knowledge neutral enough that someone who doesn't play EVE could follow it, and someone who does play EVE but has no attachment or background on the story to be able to really understand it. Hopefully then, the person who doesn't play EVE at least enjoys the story, and might think to check out more about EVE so they will truly understand it as well.

That all said, I am not a huge fan of comic books, although I felt I should read these. I much prefer the Chronicles to these comics, and EVE source as well. Short stories based on true stories might be doable, with art akin to EVE source thrown in to give some context/awesomeness between pages of text.

I'm not really sold on the True Stories idea either for a story format. I would honestly leave the story format to NPC stories like the Chronicles.

I think EVE's true stories SHOULD be recorded if possible, but in a historical way with as much accuracy and depth as possible from as many angles/perspectives as possible. An EVE history book of sorts. That would be awesome, although I don't know how possible it would be. Something like EVE source, but for the true stories of EVE year 1, year 2, etc.

If done well, I would totally buy every single volume as a way to celebrate and appreciate the rich history that does exist in the game. So many people who play the game only have a limited knowledge of these stories, that I think they would love to be able to explore the real history of EVE more fully.
Ingrid Arbosa
Knights of the Empire
#72 - 2014-04-05 06:07:21 UTC
Just finished reading. I loved it and hope you make a few more, or at least a few more like it.
Bash Dromeda
Telecom Extreme Industrial
#73 - 2014-04-05 17:48:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Bash Dromeda
Thank you CCP for doing this and adding another dimension to the EVE universe. Great job partnering with Dark Horse, too, who has a ton of credibility in the area of adapting other universes into the comic book realm.

The price was certainly right, and I think it will serve as a cool introduction to EVE for comic book geeks like me who read every free book in the Dark Horse store. I for one appreciate that you did it.

I enjoyed these books - I'm a comic book fan. Draw me a picture and tell me a story and I'm happy. I'm not an art critic or a cranky bittervet. It's an adaptation - I don't really care if they get details wrong here or there, because literal adaptations don't add anything. The worst graphic novel adaptations are literal and precise, and leave you wondering why they did a book in the first place.

But there are some who can't handle an adaptation. They should just stick to arguing about hull fits, and leave the comic book reading to folks who have an imagination.

My recommendation for the future: Don't let fans vote on these stories, because the meta game is in play. Big alliances can pump the vote, even if their story isn't compelling. Have story people choose the story - people who love comics and have a nose for a story that can be adapted well.

I think this is an excellent way to grow the EVE brand and to reach out to the comic book crowd. Thanks again for this effort to add another dimension. I hope the idea takes on a life of it's own, and that some day we see an EVE booth at San Diego Comic-Con.
Rionan Nafee
#74 - 2014-04-06 06:05:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Rionan Nafee
I was very excited about the comic but now I have to say that I am very disappointed.

I dont like these sketchy, half finished, scrawly drawing style at all. Too less details, too less clear lines and seriously, what's up with these ridiculous bigheads in the fourth issue?

The story is also disappointed. Too much stupid blah blah from characterless toons in any empty rooms, much zu less EVE. If there are not a fistfull of images with things which could be EVE space ships these comics could be from any random dystopic setting.
Where is the vast space? Where are the fast space ships and gigant stations with thousands of inhabitants? Where are the capsuleers? Where is EVE?

Only the style of the cover of issue 2 accords this I which I want to see EVE. THIS would be great.
Rakitina
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2014-04-06 11:09:08 UTC
Well....Meh. I am not sure if it was the disconnected way the story was told, the strange comments and battles with the ships or what, but I simply was not impressed. Sorry.
Jai Centarium
Anqara Expeditions
#76 - 2014-04-06 19:40:57 UTC
Meh.

I get that the story might not appeal to everyone. I get that the presentation style might not appeal to everyone.

Functionally, it was a good effort. Any EVE media is good EVE media, because for those to whom to the story and presentation appeal to this will be a good get. It'll make current players smile and might entice a few new players to come try this seething barrel full of monkeys we call EVE.

That being said, I'm more concerned about the fact that CCP seems unwilling, unable, or uninterested in multitasking. I get it: You're a company with limited resources, and fiction and world-building don't pay the bills. But if EVE is to have a 20th anniversary, there desperately needs to be some depth to the universe.

Once upon a time, Chronicles were regularly published, giving momentary insights into the world of EVE. I can't remember the last time I saw a new Chronicle.
Once upon a time, live events were held, rewarding players who were in the right place at the right time* with unique ways to interact with both the universe, CCP, and each other. The last live event that was tried was a disaster. It took the Caldari years to stop Ishukone's HQ from burning.
Once upon a time, there were regular in-universe news reports, both in news from reporters and flash fiction from writers. Again, completely useless but added a nice dimension to the world at large. Both are almost impossible to find in the current site; they're there, but small. The news niche has been supplanted by TMC and EN24, and it seems that Falcon is a one-man band in writing fiction these days.

What I'm saying, in the end, is that while I didn't like the comic, it also shows there are few other avenues for me to get my fix in. I want my EVE universe to be full of rich, generous content, rather than the world's fanciest IRC and spreadsheet skin.

* Yes, yes, yes, I know about the problems. But not every live event had a reward beyond "neat, CCP is interacting with us!"

Certified purveyor of the High Life.

Borgholio
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#77 - 2014-04-07 13:55:45 UTC
Debir Achen wrote:
CCP keeps saying "available to download". How exactly does one download them, as opposed to reading on-line in a browser?


Smartphone or tablet. You can download locally and read offline.

You will be assimilated...bunghole!

DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#78 - 2014-04-07 19:31:58 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Angus Adalwin wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

I was once involved in a wh fight where we had 5 ships and the attackers 6.
The drones from my Domi took out 3 recons while I was jammed, and we drove off the remaining attackers with the loss of one of our BC's.


Now this is a story I can see being a great stand-alone comic. (As in, just a single issue encapsulating the whole story.)


Let's face it.
Even though the target audience is likely existing Eve players, there is zero doubt that CCP wants this kind of story-telling to appeal, and hopefully attract, non-players to the game.

And what resonates more with more Eve players, and probably non-Eve players?

A story about some guy meta-gaming a really stupid and archaic mechanic that the vast vast majority will never ever experience, or a simple well-written story about some shoot-em-up bang-bang that every player across umpteen games and genres understands.

Run a series of comics, each being a one-issue story, each highlighting a different part of the gameplay experience.

Run one from the point of view of the FW guys.. Just pick one system, and cover a day in the life of these guys.
Run one issue that covers the last big supercap null fight, with all the ship losses, and the ramifications.
Run one issue about some miners getting ganked in high sec.
Run one issue about some wormhole eviction, or the battle to protect the system. (Had my own experience with that. We rolled the hole in the face of an invading fleet, with them literally parked outside the wh)

DON'T run some story because some clown needs his ego stoked further by having his sycophants upvote the story.
Just get talented people you trust, like I dunno, comic book editors and publishers, to choose the best stories.

This 100%.

Everyone is constantly hearing about these big alliances via gamer / online press. However nobody ever hears about the little guys in Eve, let alone hear their side of the story.

There's a lot of good little 1 issue 'True Stories' in Eve. How about focusing the spotlight on the little guys who actually make this game a reality?


DMC
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#79 - 2014-04-07 19:48:05 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:

Everyone is constantly hearing about these big alliances via gamer / online press. However nobody ever hears about the little guys in Eve, let alone hear their side of the story.

There's a lot of good little 1 issue 'True Stories' in Eve. How about focusing the spotlight on the little guys who actually make this game a reality?


DMC

the little guy is boring and unimportant and so are his stories

it sounds harsh but it's the truth, there's a reason that B-R made mainstream media and "guy mines rock in spaceship game" or "unimportant faction warfare battle changes nothing" did not

a story about boring unimportant people will be boring and unimportant and that's just reality, sorry it hurts your ego

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.

Joule Serine
Milk is Love of Killmail
#80 - 2014-04-07 21:50:59 UTC
The art in the first 3 comics, especially the 3rd, was great. They were good, however; the 4th comic seems rushed and its artistic style almost entirely killed the characters we've come to expect from the first three comics. I'll also add that there's a lack of text in the final comic. Having read the original BoB story, and comparing it to the comic, there's a lot that had been left out.