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PI whining and small gang PvP
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Lexmana
#1 - 2011-11-30 19:10:27 UTC
A lot of threads have started after crucible patch whining about the new PI taxes (and base prices). The whining focuses on the fact that staying with the NPC-corp customs offices in null and low means drastically increased production costs. Also, the only way to reduce this costs is to run player owned custom offices (POCOS) and they cost ISK and can be destroyed by a small gang.

Guess what, it was intended! And it was great buff to small gang warfare.

Stop the whining bears. Pay the price and adapt – and keep up the good job CCP.
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#2 - 2011-11-30 19:30:38 UTC
I really fail to see how it is a buff to small gang. The price of PI would have to raise astronomically to justify the cost of fighting over it. So high, in fact, that high sec PI would be justifiable.

90% of of the time my posts are about something I actually find interesting and want to learn more about. Do not be alarmed.

Castor II
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2011-11-30 19:35:14 UTC
JitaJane wrote:
I really fail to see how it is a buff to small gang. The price of PI would have to raise astronomically to justify the cost of fighting over it. So high, in fact, that high sec PI would be justifiable.


That's not how PvP works. If it can be shot at, you can bet your ass that someone WILL shoot it. Big smile
Russell Casey
Doomheim
#4 - 2011-11-30 19:36:51 UTC
Castor II wrote:
JitaJane wrote:
I really fail to see how it is a buff to small gang. The price of PI would have to raise astronomically to justify the cost of fighting over it. So high, in fact, that high sec PI would be justifiable.


That's not how PvP works. If it can be shot at, you can bet your ass that someone WILL shoot it. Big smile


"Look, Ned, a Customs Officer. IT'S COMING RIGHT AT US!" *Bang*
Lexmana
#5 - 2011-11-30 19:44:11 UTC
Castor II wrote:
JitaJane wrote:
I really fail to see how it is a buff to small gang. The price of PI would have to raise astronomically to justify the cost of fighting over it. So high, in fact, that high sec PI would be justifiable.


That's not how PvP works. If it can be shot at, you can bet your ass that someone WILL shoot it. Big smile


This ^^.

And it might not represent enough value for you to concur it but plenty of value to your enemy to motivate you to destroy it.
Sadayiel
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2011-11-30 19:46:26 UTC
Castor II wrote:
JitaJane wrote:
I really fail to see how it is a buff to small gang. The price of PI would have to raise astronomically to justify the cost of fighting over it. So high, in fact, that high sec PI would be justifiable.


That's not how PvP works. If it can be shot at, you can bet your ass that someone WILL shoot it. Big smile



And that's how the Low-sec Dwellers may find a new purpouse in hold and maintain a running customs office as a new source of income as pirating.

All you need it's a group dedicated to keep the customs at decent tax and always running so they can get free isk for PI runners and this should grant another reason to fight over it, instead roam just smack the customs and awit until the opposing group comes.


Now if CCP can fix the Hot dropping in lo-sec to screw big alliances on fighting over customs....
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-11-30 19:46:59 UTC
All well and good. So you expect small gangs to fight because????? What? Who is going to be having these fights? The same people fighting over low sec minig I suppose.....

90% of of the time my posts are about something I actually find interesting and want to learn more about. Do not be alarmed.

Ingvar Angst
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
#8 - 2011-11-30 19:47:25 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
A lot of threads have started after crucible patch whining about the new PI taxes (and base prices). The whining focuses on the fact that staying with the NPC-corp customs offices in null and low means drastically increased production costs. Also, the only way to reduce this costs is to run player owned custom offices (POCOS) and they cost ISK and can be destroyed by a small gang.

Guess what, it was intended! And it was great buff to small gang warfare.

Stop the whining bears. Pay the price and adapt – and keep up the good job CCP.


You seem to fail to realize that this will reduce PvP. People will (and currently are already) give up their PI in lowsec... the risk/reward is no longer worth it. That means less people traveling into low. So as you fly around low looking at those planets with no customs offices (you blew them up and got no killmails) and no PCOs (wasn't worth losing more than one, so people stopped putting them up), think about this day and the dreams you had that were never realized.

Six months in the hole... it changes a man.
Lexmana
#9 - 2011-11-30 19:49:23 UTC
JitaJane wrote:
All well and good. So you expect small gangs to fight because????? What? Who is going to be having these fights? The same people fighting over low sec minig I suppose.....


I expect small gang guerilla warfare everywhere - that is in low, noll and wh space.
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#10 - 2011-11-30 19:51:20 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
A lot of threads have started after crucible patch whining about the new PI taxes (and base prices). The whining focuses on the fact that staying with the NPC-corp customs offices in null and low means drastically increased production costs. Also, the only way to reduce this costs is to run player owned custom offices (POCOS) and they cost ISK and can be destroyed by a small gang.

Guess what, it was intended! And it was great buff to small gang warfare.

Stop the whining bears. Pay the price and adapt – and keep up the good job CCP.


Sadly, this is a hit to small gang roaming PvP in low sec. PI bears will leave low sec because they won't risk the isks or can't defend a PoCo. All this does is drive a segment of folks out of low sec.

If you are inclined to fight over your PoCo I expect you are already savy enough to be in null and making much more isks for less risks as you have more options to control a system there (or you are a WH explorer type and again making more isks for less risks).

This just gives less folks to shoot at in low sec. Not good for anyone.

Issler
Pavel Bidermann
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2011-11-30 19:51:41 UTC
Brace for some expensive POS fuel maintenance!

Yes you can build your own player-owned customs offices but since they can and will be destroyed, the higher tax but reliably stable NPC offices are your best bet in the long run. They will be expensive but they will always produce, unlike player-owned ones. The extra cost will be passed on to the customer.

Now, how about those stronger, up-to-date market tracking tools CCP? I would like a version of Morningstar reports in-game updating every 3 hours. Will subscribe for 50 isk a day. A longer subscription for a discount, naturally.
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-11-30 19:52:07 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
JitaJane wrote:
All well and good. So you expect small gangs to fight because????? What? Who is going to be having these fights? The same people fighting over low sec minig I suppose.....


I expect small gang guerilla warfare everywhere - that is in low, noll and wh space.

It is nice to have expectations I agree. So why tak about PI if what you expect is small gang warfare?

90% of of the time my posts are about something I actually find interesting and want to learn more about. Do not be alarmed.

Lexmana
#13 - 2011-11-30 19:56:49 UTC
JitaJane wrote:
Lexmana wrote:
JitaJane wrote:
All well and good. So you expect small gangs to fight because????? What? Who is going to be having these fights? The same people fighting over low sec minig I suppose.....


I expect small gang guerilla warfare everywhere - that is in low, noll and wh space.

It is nice to have expectations I agree. So why tak about PI if what you expect is small gang warfare?


It gives objectives for small gangs in many situations, even in alliance warfare, since (see below)

Lexmana wrote:
And it might not represent enough value for you to concur it but plenty of value to your enemy to motivate you to destroy it.
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#14 - 2011-11-30 20:00:57 UTC
So the same folks who fight over POSs now have a new thing to fight over. Define 'small gang' for me. Hot dropping carriers does not fit my definition.

90% of of the time my posts are about something I actually find interesting and want to learn more about. Do not be alarmed.

Thomas Orca
Broski is ded
#15 - 2011-11-30 20:20:08 UTC
Those customs offices are the perfect target for small gangs with their millions of EHP and reinforcement timers that are set by the owners.
Lexmana
#16 - 2011-11-30 20:22:42 UTC
Thomas Orca wrote:
Those customs offices are the perfect target for small gangs with their millions of EHP and reinforcement timers that are set by the owners.


Try to attack more than one. Increase your targets to split their forces.
Cloora
APEX Unlimited
APEX Conglomerate
#17 - 2011-11-30 20:33:09 UTC
The OP read my mind. This is a buff to anti pies and pirates alike.

http://www.altaholics.blogspot.com
Ingvar Angst
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
#18 - 2011-11-30 20:36:04 UTC
Cloora wrote:
The OP read my mind. This is a buff to anti pies and pirates alike.


How does making people give up low sec PI, and therefore trips into low sec, buff pirates?

Six months in the hole... it changes a man.
Fung Ku
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2011-11-30 20:44:04 UTC
lolPI
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#20 - 2011-11-30 20:46:37 UTC
JitaJane wrote:
So the same folks who fight over POSs now have a new thing to fight over. Define 'small gang' for me. Hot dropping carriers does not fit my definition.


they don't exist lmao

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
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