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[Summer 2014] Nestor Revisit?

Author
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#1 - 2014-03-20 18:47:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Arthur Aihaken
The last round of capacitor changes in Rubicon 1.3 helped, but the Nestor is still lacking. For an armor-based ship it's really lacking due to the 6 low slots. Thus, I propose the following:

The Nestor seriously lacks grid. You can't even mount 5 large lasers, a large armor repair and MWD or large jump drive - let alone any logistics. Extend the power grid to at least 19,250 (+8,000).
The Nestor lacks offensive capability. Add another 2 turrets for a total of 7 so you can run the Nestor primarily as a laser platform if so desired with drones as support, or vice-versa. You won't be able to run 7 of the largest lasers without augmenting your grid, but it offers some interesting options. Sure, it has the potential to be a glass cannon - but one that's running almost twice the cost of a Vindicator.

I think we've all but given up hope on the Nestor receiving a Covert Ops cloak or anything else to justify the hefty price tag, so let's at least make it more useful.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.

Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
#2 - 2014-03-20 18:52:10 UTC
That horse is dead.

While price may not be a balancing factor, price vs. performance certainly is. For this ship I give you this scenerio: If the armageddon cost more than the bhaal who would fly it? That's pretty much the nestor from a Logi / DPS perspective.

I'd just let it go. When CCP realizes that outside of a few collectors - it has no use - they will either drop the price to rattle snake levels or re-adjust the properties of the ship.
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#3 - 2014-03-20 19:20:50 UTC
CCP Fozzie explained quite in detail how CCP Rise is suffering from the Nestor being so not-quite-it. Thus, they actually are monitoring the ship *closely*. (From a short list of explanations during Chitsa's recent *small wormhole townhall)

So if there is any ship way up on the tweaking list, it's the nestor. In addition: If you spot a magnificent idea or discussion, pointing CSMs towards those was advertised as a good thing to do.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#4 - 2014-03-20 19:33:59 UTC
Lloyd Roses wrote:
CCP Fozzie explained quite in detail how CCP Rise is suffering from the Nestor being so not-quite-it. Thus, they actually are monitoring the ship *closely*. (From a short list of explanations during Chitsa's recent *small wormhole townhall)

So if there is any ship way up on the tweaking list, it's the nestor. In addition: If you spot a magnificent idea or discussion, pointing CSMs towards those was advertised as a good thing to do.

"This is a good death."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0w3JRz4Q8ME

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.

Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2014-03-20 21:05:51 UTC
Arthur Aihaken wrote:

The Nestor seriously lacks grid. You can't even mount 5 large lasers, a large armor repair and MWD or large jump drive - let alone any logistics. Extend the power grid to at least 19,250 (+8,000).


And I cant fit 6 Neutron Blasters a large armor rep and a MWD or MJD on a dominix either, but that's what you get for a DRONE BOAT. Your primary weapon doesn't take CPU and PG.
Does the nestor need a fix, absolutely but we don't need more PG to put more guns on it other wise its DPS potential at both short and long range would be unbalanced.

The biggest problem right now is they want it to be an exploration, remote rep, drone BS. Its trying to fill to many roles at once and while it could be useful in certain situations, the price to have one is not worth it compared to other ships.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#6 - 2014-03-20 22:10:13 UTC
Daoden wrote:
And I cant fit 6 Neutron Blasters a large armor rep and a MWD or MJD on a dominix either, but that's what you get for a DRONE BOAT. Your primary weapon doesn't take CPU and PG.
Does the nestor need a fix, absolutely but we don't need more PG to put more guns on it other wise its DPS potential at both short and long range would be unbalanced.

The biggest problem right now is they want it to be an exploration, remote rep, drone BS. Its trying to fill to many roles at once and while it could be useful in certain situations, the price to have one is not worth it compared to other ships.

A Dominix isn't a Pirate vessel, so that's not really a valid comparison.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.

Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2014-03-20 22:55:55 UTC
was refering more to the effect that the nestor is primarily a drone boat
HiddenPorpoise
Jarlhettur's Drop
United Federation of Conifers
#8 - 2014-03-20 23:01:50 UTC
Daoden wrote:
was refering more to the effect that the nestor is primarily a drone boat

The domi doesn't have laser and rep bonuses.
Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2014-03-20 23:47:18 UTC
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
Daoden wrote:
was refering more to the effect that the nestor is primarily a drone boat

The domi doesn't have laser and rep bonuses.

No but it did use to have bonus to hybrids
scimichar
Deep Hole Explorers of New Eden
#10 - 2014-03-21 00:06:40 UTC
Daoden wrote:
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
Daoden wrote:
was refering more to the effect that the nestor is primarily a drone boat

The domi doesn't have laser and rep bonuses.

No but it did use to have bonus to hybrids


Not since the T1 BS balance pass.
Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2014-03-21 00:21:22 UTC
clearly you missed the "use to have" portion of the post. The point i was trying to make is that a majority of shisp with drone bonuses dont tend to have the best CPU/PG to fit everything you want onto another non bonused ship of the same class. The rattlesnake (faction BS) only has 4 missile hardpoints, trying to fit a tank and dmg amps launchers is very tight without increasing its CPU either by rigs low slots or implants.
Im sure there is a way to fit all the things the OP wants on the nestor, just probably not witout using rigsand or faction/deadspace items and that is how balance in this game works.
Zan Shiro
Doomheim
#12 - 2014-03-21 00:43:00 UTC
Daoden wrote:
The rattlesnake (faction BS) only has 4 missile hardpoints, trying to fit a tank and dmg amps launchers is very tight without increasing its CPU either by rigs low slots or implants.



please show one or more of these tight fitting fits you have in mind.

Ratller unless a player has half assed support skill trains it the easiest of the pirates to fit. I have done vindi and mach. I did not pimp these fits to be e-peen....I needed ds/faction gear to free up grid. Rattler I have liked in the past since it has not needed pimp gear. Not even for freeing up grid.


Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-03-21 00:50:32 UTC
Dmg amps BCUs, DCU, Xlarge shield booster, invul fields, web,scram,launchers and nuets. I use it for dueling All T2 or faction mods. RIgs are shield rigs
JediRobin
Globaltech Industries
#14 - 2014-03-21 01:06:11 UTC
There is one simple way to fix the nestor......

GIVE IT A CLOAK BONUS LIKE ITS SMALLER COUSINS.

The only reason CCP took this off the ship is they had preasure to do so.

If they gave the Nestor the Cloak Bunus, that would compensate for the overpriced cost of the ship and keep all the SOE ships with the same theme of Bonus's.
Daoden
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2014-03-21 01:09:36 UTC
we dont need more cloaky BS, not like they can warp cloaked any way. BLOPs is also a very specific role and doesnt perform well in other areas.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#16 - 2014-03-21 07:41:10 UTC
Zan Shiro wrote:
Ratller unless a player has half assed support skill trains it the easiest of the pirates to fit. I have done vindi and mach. I did not pimp these fits to be e-peen....I needed ds/faction gear to free up grid. Rattler I have liked in the past since it has not needed pimp gear. Not even for freeing up grid.

If you look at any of the Pirate battleships you can fit the maximum number of the largest guns or launchers con any of them without having to augment CPU or grid. You can't on the Nestor, so regardless of the fact that it may be primarily a drone boat - you can't fit it properly. And for 3x the price, one would think you'd at least be able to do that.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.

Jill Antaris
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2014-03-21 08:59:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Jill Antaris
The nestor needs still quite a bit more cap(4m 40s with perfect skills is just not good enough with 600M in T2 RR rigs, fitting not even a single large remote rep or laser on it), a bit more fitting, 10 lockable targets and a 100% damage bonus to lasers, reducing the turret count to 3(what also massively helps with the cap), allowing it to fit both weapons and RR.

It is kind of ironic that I actually found kind of a useful niche for it and changed the opinion of many people that did say it is pointless, but it is still hilarious expensive for what it does and ultimately not worth the price tag(what extends the hull cost multiple times, as soon as you try put together something useful with the bonuses).
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#18 - 2014-03-21 09:21:01 UTC
Jill Antaris wrote:
It is kind of ironic that I actually found kind of a useful niche for it and changed the opinion of many people that did say it is pointless, but it is still hilarious expensive for what it does and ultimately not worth the price tag(what extends the hull cost multiple times, as soon as you try put together something useful with the bonuses).

Niche or not, it's priced itself out of contention for most players.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.

Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2014-03-21 11:12:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
Daoden wrote:
we dont need more cloaky BS, not like they can warp cloaked any way. BLOPs is also a very specific role and doesnt perform well in other areas.

It was never mentioned ITT what kind of cloack bonus was meant, and it's not like BLOPS role was suggested (as it stands today, we probably don't need different jump bridges just becayse they are of different color; exaggeration maybe, but still).

Not sure if it will make Nestor worth flying, but sure it isn't really atm.