These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Wormholes

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123
 

Idea: New Deployable - Wormhole Generator

Author
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
#41 - 2014-03-14 14:17:54 UTC
Adoris Nolen wrote:
Dunno what C4 space you guys play in but there's always a way out from C4 space via statics. The only time that ends if some1 down the chain collapses a static.

So if you have a C4 - c4-c6-c6-c4 chain of ridiculousness that doesn't lead to kspace at all. One of the wh's in the chain will either get a roaming pop up, like c2-c4/hs or c2 -c6/ns. If you roll any of the wormholes in the chain, the next system will definately route to kspace.



I have had on multiple occasions where we had Homesystem--C4/C4---C4/C4---Homesystem

Essentially a closed loop with no way out. And no k162's spawned during that time.

Using the term "always" along with "random k162" doesn't really work. The only way to say "always' would imply relying only on statics.
Talaq
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#42 - 2014-03-14 16:05:34 UTC
only deploy able i would perhaps want to see would be a :

wormhole effect diffuser

A POS sized generator anchorable only at the sun. with a anchor time of a large. and stront bay for a proper rio timer.

effects in a wh with effect, it will dampen the current effect to a generic system.
in a generic system you can give the wh a specific effect like a magentar/pulsar (different charges for effects), only at 50% strength of a real effect.

It will Broadcast and system conversion timer of 24 hrs before going online.

use the code of the one time usable ever in a wh, claim units and make them your new conflict driver, also take away the home field advantage of the residents. or give those pesky people in armor t3's a new pulsar to live in.

Or will make your expo system more interesting, and putting new life into some systems like black holes.

fuel for the generator will last 4 days and it will have a 4 day cd before it can restarted.

it would be at least a good conflict driver, it will **** the residents off way more than shooting poco's, it would also something specific for the wh crowd.

to powerful and tool for grief? perhaps but it would bring some new stuff into a hole (also you can make 3 versions for it) c1/2 fits in hauler, c3/4 in orca, c5/6 freighter sized.

It will also **** off sleepers to no end, forcing the deploying party, to attend to it. perhaps bring in the sleeper incursions (sleeper dreads in c5'/6s bs in lower) give them lower loot tables to prevent farming, then again its a farming fleet at the sun..

This ofc won't happen and probably be flamed down to the ground, still i think it would be a nice addition to w-space and actually cater to pve and pvp.


Low-Class Diplomat

Nightingale Actault
Borderland Dynamics
#43 - 2014-03-14 16:23:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Nightingale Actault
Haseo Antares wrote:
No.

I would however like to see a deployable structure that generates a pseudo WH and signature. It should look and act like a WH until someone attempts to activate it. Upon activation it will nuet, web, smartbomb, even ransom and trash talk its target (in local) until either it is destroyed or the target is dead or out of range.

No need to thank me, I have terrible ideas on a regular basis. I just had an uncontrollable urge to share that one.


Out of all the deployable ideas, I believe that although you may have done this in jest it probably has the most merits.

A deployable that does in fact create a new wormhole signature could have interesting implications. It would need to not show on dscan to prevent it being easily identifiable as such. Likely it would appear as a K162 wormhole to anyone cloaked on grid with it and only show it's true deployable nature once someone was uncloaked on grid with it. Requiring someone to attempt to activate it would leave too small a zone for identifying the structure and not give a smart scout an opportunity to avoid the trap set for them.
Proclus Diadochu
Mar Sarrim
Red Coat Conspiracy
#44 - 2014-03-14 16:43:51 UTC
Talaq wrote:
only deploy able i would perhaps want to see would be a :

wormhole effect diffuser



My imagination with this idea ran a bit wild, but with something like this, you could call it a "mobile star emulator".

As you stated it could be used in a vanilla hole to generate a particular star type's effects. Since this device is synthetic, it will surely be reduced effect, as you suggest by half...

It could be used by residents to effect their homes, torn down by visitors/invaders weakening the residents, and the invaders would even have the ability to turn the tide, or vice versa depending on how the engagement was going. It would need some sort of timer, so it isn't simply destroyed during someone's offtime, and would by scriptable, or "programmed" to emulate a particular star, and for systems that have effects, it could have a particular script that would create a "third star", dampening the effects of the existing stars in system.

I don't even care if the science is wrong, but this sounds like fun.

Minister of High Society | Twitter: @autoritare

E-mail: [email protected]

My Blog: http://diogenes-club.blogspot.com/

The Diogenes Club | Join W-Space | Down The Pipe

Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#45 - 2014-03-14 16:55:40 UTC
I believe that was my idea but I'll allow it Smile
Nightingale Actault
Borderland Dynamics
#46 - 2014-03-14 16:59:17 UTC
Changing existing system effects defeats the purpose of having systems with effects.
Proclus Diadochu
Mar Sarrim
Red Coat Conspiracy
#47 - 2014-03-14 17:50:06 UTC
Nightingale Actault wrote:
Changing existing system effects defeats the purpose of having systems with effects.


And technology has never changed nature...

Minister of High Society | Twitter: @autoritare

E-mail: [email protected]

My Blog: http://diogenes-club.blogspot.com/

The Diogenes Club | Join W-Space | Down The Pipe

Talaq
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#48 - 2014-03-14 17:53:58 UTC
Nightingale Actault wrote:
Changing existing system effects defeats the purpose of having systems with effects.


that's the point, unlike a wh generator, or shooting a poco it is something that does really affect you, either good or bad, and does make you do something, but it shouldn't be as overpowered that it will be just a tool for grievers.

at least i think it will be beneficial for using the less used Blackholes. and with the negative effects it should not fully counter the wh-effect just dampen it to level the playing field.


Low-Class Diplomat

Nightingale Actault
Borderland Dynamics
#49 - 2014-03-14 18:11:14 UTC
People choose to live in systems with effects often specifically for that effect. Introducing something that nullifies their reason for living in that system means that some will simply choose to live in a no effect system instead. I believe Bane said it best, if you are fighting in a system with a different effect than your doctrine, then bring a different doctrine (ie armor for wolfs and shield for pulsars).

If the sole use is to counter the effects of black holes, then why not just continue with the existing mission of changing the effects of black hole systems?
Rek Seven
The Persuaders
#50 - 2014-03-14 18:41:01 UTC
Nightingale Actault wrote:
People choose to live in systems with effects often specifically for that effect. Introducing something that nullifies their reason for living in that system means that some will simply choose to live in a no effect system instead. I believe Bane said it best, if you are fighting in a system with a different effect than your doctrine, then bring a different doctrine (ie armor for wolfs and shield for pulsars).


So what if people choose to live in a system with no effect?

TBH i think your assessment is wrong. People will still pick a system with an effect because of the benefits it offers but the introduction of a module like this means that invaders would be able the temporarily take away the home advantage.

Yeah people could reship to suit the effect but few corps will have the right ship doctrine ready.
Rall Mekin
End-of-Line
#51 - 2014-03-14 19:07:29 UTC
Mobile Capital Fleet Simulator-- Feeling bored? Thirsty for kill mails? WELL MY FRIENDS HAVE I GOT A GADGET FOR YOU!

Get your daily lulz and kill mail sets quickly and simply with this handy-dandy module. Simply load it into your friendly zefyr and anchor in ANY C5 OR ABOVE ESCALATABLE SLEEPER SITE!

2 NPC lokis, an archon, and a random dreadnought will appear and begin to run the sites--and 10 minutes later, another dread will appear, followed by a niddy 2 minutes later. Sites will FULLY escalate, and ganking the capital ships will yield legit kill mails. All drops will be officer mods.

Module build cost is estimated at 500,000 isk.
Nightingale Actault
Borderland Dynamics
#52 - 2014-03-14 19:07:40 UTC
Rek Seven wrote:
few corps will have the right ship doctrine ready.


This is the point I and others are trying to make. Stop just flying armor, get a shield doctrine set up if you plan on sieging a pulsar.

Look at it another way, what makes wormholes unique? System effects!! You don't find them anywhere else in EVE, why take what makes wormholes unique out of the equation?
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#53 - 2014-03-14 19:37:06 UTC

I like the basic premise your idea, but think it needs some limitations:

1.) The mass limitations need to be adhered, so you can't get capitals into a C1, or other silly possibilities. Realistically, you don't need 3 types of scripts, you just need one script to designate the type of WH (example: A641 for creating a WH to Highsec).

2.) It would be really interesting if this structure resulted in a designated grid for the WH to appear. For example, allowing someone to generate a WH on grid with a POS or a stargate or station. However, this would need some limitations if this happens. Possible limitations may include a minimum distance from other structures. That, or perhaps have the exit be a designation other than K162.

3.) It should not be a "I want a WH now" device. In my opinion, it should take some time to activate before it actually spawns a WH. Example, give it a 1 hour "onlining" time before the new WH pops open in system.

4.) I agree there needs to be a limit on how many can be used. I'd recommend one per constellation (in Kspace), not just one per system.

5.) I like the idea of the "scripts" getting consumed with each use. I'd recommend that the script varies in cost significantly.

6.) I would also recommend a means of easily identifying if one of these are activated in a system. Perhaps with a system wide beacon on it allowing anyone to notice it, and perhaps even instantly warp to it.

7.) What happens to the WH when someone destroys one of these? I'd recommend these things enter an RF "mode" when attacked to the point of destruction. While in RF, their generating WH remains up and open until its mass or time limit expires. Then the module itself detonates as its WH collapses.
Rek Seven
The Persuaders
#54 - 2014-03-14 19:55:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Rek Seven
Nightingale Actault wrote:
Rek Seven wrote:
few corps will have the right ship doctrine ready.


This is the point I and others are trying to make. Stop just flying armor, get a shield doctrine set up if you plan on sieging a pulsar.

Look at it another way, what makes wormholes unique? System effects!! You don't find them anywhere else in EVE, why take what makes wormholes unique out of the equation?


If we are talking about siegeing then yeah, you are obviously going to bring the right tool for the job but we are talking about day to day activities. It's a fact that some people will choose to roll a hole instead of fighting under an effect that they are not set up for,(or have the people for) and you asking nicely wont change that.

If you want the effect to remain unchanged, then you would have to ensure that the new structure was not anchored in your system.

Look at it from another perspective. The structure could allow smaller groups to combat unbreakable RR setups in cataclysmic wormmholes, which may help stop the need for corps to grow bigger...

Anyway, we appear to have gone off topic. o/
Nightingale Actault
Borderland Dynamics
#55 - 2014-03-14 20:06:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Nightingale Actault
Rek Seven wrote:
If you want the effect to remain unchanged, then you would have to ensure that the new structure was not anchored in your system.

Look at it from another perspective. The structure could allow smaller groups to combat unbreakable RR setups in cataclysmic wormmholes, which may help stop the need for corps to grow bigger...


We're talking about deployables so I believe this remains perfectly within topic :)

In your situation, you're talking about a group fielding an unbreakable RR setup in a cataclysmic, and I assume you are the smaller group who would like to fight this setup. So you're saying that as the smaller group, you are going to take a force into their wormhole, setup this negation device, and guard it through its activation against this other group?

I just don't see it playing out like that. In that situation your force would likely be wiped out before the device could ever activate, and knowing this your smaller group would never choose to go into that engagement.

However, what I do see it being used for, is a much larger group going into a wormhole against a smaller entity, whos only hope of survival is clever use of their system effect, and using it to negate any chance this smaller entity would have at making it out with their ships.
Rek Seven
The Persuaders
#56 - 2014-03-14 20:16:29 UTC
Nightingale Actault wrote:

I just don't see it playing out like that. In that situation your force would likely be wiped out before the device could ever activate, and knowing this your smaller group would never choose to go into that engagement.


You just reaffirmed my point... right? Straight

In a stalemate, this device could tip the scale. The alternative being, you go home and plan your upcoming recruitment drive for bhaalgorn pilots.
Nightingale Actault
Borderland Dynamics
#57 - 2014-03-14 20:25:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Nightingale Actault
Rek Seven wrote:
You just reaffirmed my point... right? Straight


I understand your desire to fight. I also understand that I will weigh a situation, and in the case of the unbreakable RR will simply choose not to lead the isk of my corpmates to death. Will I recruit just so that I can break that groups RR, no? I enjoy small gang and will engage when appropriate.

There is no perfect answer here as both parties cannot be satisfied.
Rek Seven
The Persuaders
#58 - 2014-03-14 20:32:59 UTC
Cool, so we are agreed. The ability to disrupt the effect of a system would encourage you to fight in this hypothetical situation.
Nightingale Actault
Borderland Dynamics
#59 - 2014-03-14 20:51:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Nightingale Actault
I would attempt something different within the confines of existing game mechanics if fighting was the only thing motivating me. For instance diverting them to a different area of the system and attempting to catch one of their group before warp. Or I would consider attempting to drag the group into a different system. I would not try to negate their system effect, even with a module to do so.

I would try..
Switching to a high range alpha comp.
Bring in bombers with voids.
Use heavy Ewar control with Neuts/ECM/Damps.

TL;DR You can fight an opponent even against overwhelming odds if you do not fight to their strengths. You don't need to negate their system effect to do so.
Glyndi
Ehefkae
#60 - 2014-03-14 23:26:08 UTC
Instead of adding something that would only apply to WSpace, why not something that is universal all across EVE?

It's been discussed before, most recently during the WH interview with Fozzie, but why not add a new/repurpose a hacking module for POSs? Its already something most of us agree with and has potential to make people a lot of money.

Not only could we clean up all the offlined faction towers of WSpace, but null sec as well. LOL, imagine someone finding you and your buddies ransacking their moon coverage of 50 small POSs!

This would be much more useful imo. It would cause a lot of conflict as well.
Previous page123