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Need help fitting a Merlin
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Shayne Rex
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2014-03-14 00:28:40 UTC
Hey guys, thanks for stopping here for me. I need help fitting a Merlin for solo/small gang PvP. I also kind of need an idea of what skills and such. Any help would be of much appreciation. Fly safe guys. Thanks for those that give me their time.
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#2 - 2014-03-14 01:01:53 UTC
Here are some solid PvP Merlin fits:

[Merlin, PvP AB]

Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Micro Auxiliary Power Core II
Damage Control II

1MN Afterburner II
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Medium Shield Extender II

Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S

Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Small Core Defense Field Extender I
Small Core Defense Field Extender I


[Merlin, PvP MWD]

Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Micro Auxiliary Power Core II
Damage Control II

Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction

Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S

Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Small Core Defense Field Extender I
Small Core Defense Field Extender I


[Merlin, PvP Scram Kite]

Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Damage Control II

1MN Afterburner II
Warp Scrambler II
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Medium Shield Extender II

125mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
125mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
125mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S

Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Small Core Defense Field Extender I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I

These fits are optimized assuming isk is not an issue, so they are a little expensive for T1 frigate fits (12-16mil depending on the fit) but it's nice to have every small advantage you can get over your opponent, if you can't use any of the modules at T2, use meta 3 modules instead, those are usually cheap and give the best bang for buck. As for what skills you need, you need to be able to fit all the modules I listed above at least at T1 (so you don't need the skills to V, but ideally you'd want the skills to IV) as well as good enough fitting skills (CPU/Power Grid Management, Weapon Upgrades, Advanced Weapon Upgrades) in order to fit everything and finally you want Caldari Frigate at least to IV. There are lots of other skills as well such as navigation skills, shield skills etc, I can't list everything here but you can get a good idea by right clicking the modules and checking the prerequisites.

As for which fit you choose it depends really, for solo work I would usually use either the AB/Blaster fit or the scram kiter fit, however this leaves you vulnerable to long-point kiting ships like the Condor, Executioner, Atron and Slicer but you should be able to avoid fighting them most of the time. The MWD fit is more versatile, being able to catch these kiting fits with some good piloting as well as standing a good chance against brawlers, but you will usually lose to dedicated brawlers because you lose most of your range control when your MWD gets turned off in a brawl by the opponents scram. For gangs I'd go with the MWD fit.

Hope that's helpful.
Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#3 - 2014-03-14 03:33:21 UTC
The fits that Dato suggested are solid. In some cases, you may consider dropping the damage control for a 2nd magnetic field stabilizer. The Merlin is a fairly simple ship to fit, and doesn't need super amazing skills to use properly. All of the above fits can be run with meta 3-4 modules and still perform well.

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Odithia
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2014-03-14 11:28:33 UTC
Provided fits all seems solids.

I can't decide who's the best blaster brawler between the merlin and incursus.
Any opinions?
acemastr Ocer
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2014-03-14 11:47:48 UTC
Dual rep Incursus is a beast, but requires good piloting skills to get the best of it, it isn't a simple 'orbit at 500m and stick everything on' kind of ship.
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#6 - 2014-03-14 14:22:14 UTC
acemastr Ocer wrote:
Dual rep Incursus is a beast, but requires good piloting skills to get the best of it, it isn't a simple 'orbit at 500m and stick everything on' kind of ship.


Main problem with the dual rep Incursus is it lacks a web, so most enemies can easily stay out of your blaster range, or simply disengage you if they're losing. Also some higher dps ships (like the FN Comet or destroyers) can punch through your reps and bleed into your structure. I personally like the Incursus as a scram kiting ship, it's faster than the Merlin and it has an easier time fitting tank + 150mm railguns.
Shelom Severasse
The Disney World Federation
Fraternity.
#7 - 2014-03-20 04:36:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Shelom Severasse
light neutron blaster II x3

t2 warp scram
t2 ab
t2 web x2

t2 dc
aar
mag stab

hybrid collision accelerator
small aux nano pump x2

gets 240 dps o/h

congrats you just killed anything thats brawl and can catch any kiter that lands on you

EDIT: that mag stab should be t2 as well
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#8 - 2014-03-20 05:26:02 UTC
Shelom Severasse wrote:
light neutron blaster II x3

t2 warp scram
t2 ab
t2 web x2

t2 dc
aar
mag stab

hybrid collision accelerator
small aux nano pump x2

gets 240 dps o/h

congrats you just killed anything thats brawl and can catch any kiter that lands on you

EDIT: that mag stab should be t2 as well

Solid fit. Do the same on an Enyo and go kill cruisers.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#9 - 2014-03-20 06:36:31 UTC
Shelom Severasse wrote:
light neutron blaster II x3

t2 warp scram
t2 ab
t2 web x2

t2 dc
aar
mag stab

hybrid collision accelerator
small aux nano pump x2

gets 240 dps o/h

congrats you just killed anything thats brawl and can catch any kiter that lands on you

EDIT: that mag stab should be t2 as well


Yeah double web Merlin is nice as well as a counter to scram kiters and being able to apply all your dps, but a good long point kiter can easily stay out of your OH web range unless of course you are sitting at 0 on a FW plex and catch them before they can pull range (which is what I assume you meant). Also the AB/Scram/MSE fit I posted above has more EHP and the same dps as this fit so you would lose in a straight up brawl however the double webs allow you to disengage or keep at range and use null (hopefully they don't use null as well or switch too late) to gain the advantage.
Shelom Severasse
The Disney World Federation
Fraternity.
#10 - 2014-03-20 13:40:35 UTC
Dato Koppla wrote:
Shelom Severasse wrote:
light neutron blaster II x3

t2 warp scram
t2 ab
t2 web x2

t2 dc
aar
mag stab

hybrid collision accelerator
small aux nano pump x2

gets 240 dps o/h

congrats you just killed anything thats brawl and can catch any kiter that lands on you

EDIT: that mag stab should be t2 as well


Yeah double web Merlin is nice as well as a counter to scram kiters and being able to apply all your dps, but a good long point kiter can easily stay out of your OH web range unless of course you are sitting at 0 on a FW plex and catch them before they can pull range (which is what I assume you meant). Also the AB/Scram/MSE fit I posted above has more EHP and the same dps as this fit so you would lose in a straight up brawl however the double webs allow you to disengage or keep at range and use null (hopefully they don't use null as well or switch too late) to gain the advantage.


actually the dual web fit gets roughly 20 more dps than the MSE one. the fit you had posted uses all shield rigs where as this one has a collision accelerator.
plus you can fit the armor without genos (i just tried to eft your fit with my skills and implants and i dont have enough pg even with AWU 4)
on top of that an o/h aar carries the same potential hp as the ehp of a t2 MSE
however, you do have much higher resists with any shield fit than you do with an armor fit which greatly improves your staying power
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#11 - 2014-03-20 14:03:56 UTC
Shelom Severasse wrote:
Dato Koppla wrote:
Shelom Severasse wrote:
light neutron blaster II x3

t2 warp scram
t2 ab
t2 web x2

t2 dc
aar
mag stab

hybrid collision accelerator
small aux nano pump x2

gets 240 dps o/h

congrats you just killed anything thats brawl and can catch any kiter that lands on you

EDIT: that mag stab should be t2 as well


Yeah double web Merlin is nice as well as a counter to scram kiters and being able to apply all your dps, but a good long point kiter can easily stay out of your OH web range unless of course you are sitting at 0 on a FW plex and catch them before they can pull range (which is what I assume you meant). Also the AB/Scram/MSE fit I posted above has more EHP and the same dps as this fit so you would lose in a straight up brawl however the double webs allow you to disengage or keep at range and use null (hopefully they don't use null as well or switch too late) to gain the advantage.


actually the dual web fit gets roughly 20 more dps than the MSE one. the fit you had posted uses all shield rigs where as this one has a collision accelerator.
plus you can fit the armor without genos (i just tried to eft your fit with my skills and implants and i dont have enough pg even with AWU 4)
on top of that an o/h aar carries the same potential hp as the ehp of a t2 MSE
however, you do have much higher resists with any shield fit than you do with an armor fit which greatly improves your staying power


My AB/Blaster fit fits without any implants, with AWU IV and Shield Upgrades IV, in fact you can easily switch one of the shield rigs for a hybrid burst aerator (with LV skills) and still maintain around 2000 EHP more than your AAR fit, assuming you OH your AAR and manage to get in every cycle of your rep with paste, which is alot, around 30+% more EHP. Also your cap lasts just around long enough to run the entire cycle of paste, assuming you OH your guns+rep and you start at 100% cap, which usually you won't, so you may also have cap issues if the fight lasts longer than 30seconds.

All in all I'm not saying your fit is bad, in fact it's actually quite good, double webs are incredibly powerful, but you have to know how to capitalize on it properly with some good piloting, it's not really a regular approch+OHeverything and pray type of brawler, you need to employ different tactics depending on the situation, and as I mentioned, if you choose the wrong approach you could lose even to my AB brawler. For example, you load CN Anti and just go for the straight up brawl at 0, assuming we shoot at the same time and both OH, you'll die first because of the significant EHP difference, however with good use of the double webs you can load null and keep me at range while I have CN anti loaded and by the time I realize and switch it might be too late for me. That's why I wouldn't recommend it as a starting fit, it requires more experienced pilots to get the most out of it.
Shelom Severasse
The Disney World Federation
Fraternity.
#12 - 2014-03-20 14:14:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Shelom Severasse
Dato Koppla wrote:
Shelom Severasse wrote:
Dato Koppla wrote:
Shelom Severasse wrote:
light neutron blaster II x3

t2 warp scram
t2 ab
t2 web x2

t2 dc
aar
mag stab

hybrid collision accelerator
small aux nano pump x2

gets 240 dps o/h

congrats you just killed anything thats brawl and can catch any kiter that lands on you

EDIT: that mag stab should be t2 as well


Yeah double web Merlin is nice as well as a counter to scram kiters and being able to apply all your dps, but a good long point kiter can easily stay out of your OH web range unless of course you are sitting at 0 on a FW plex and catch them before they can pull range (which is what I assume you meant). Also the AB/Scram/MSE fit I posted above has more EHP and the same dps as this fit so you would lose in a straight up brawl however the double webs allow you to disengage or keep at range and use null (hopefully they don't use null as well or switch too late) to gain the advantage.


actually the dual web fit gets roughly 20 more dps than the MSE one. the fit you had posted uses all shield rigs where as this one has a collision accelerator.
plus you can fit the armor without genos (i just tried to eft your fit with my skills and implants and i dont have enough pg even with AWU 4)
on top of that an o/h aar carries the same potential hp as the ehp of a t2 MSE
however, you do have much higher resists with any shield fit than you do with an armor fit which greatly improves your staying power


My AB/Blaster fit fits without any implants, with AWU IV and Shield Upgrades IV, in fact you can easily switch one of the shield rigs for a hybrid burst aerator (with LV skills) and still maintain around 2000 EHP more than your AAR fit, assuming you OH your AAR and manage to get in every cycle of your rep with paste, which is alot, around 30+% more EHP. Also your cap lasts just around long enough to run the entire cycle of paste, assuming you OH your guns+rep and you start at 100% cap, which usually you won't, so you may also have cap issues if the fight lasts longer than 30seconds.

All in all I'm not saying your fit is bad, in fact it's actually quite good, double webs are incredibly powerful, but you have to know how to capitalize on it properly with some good piloting, it's not really a regular approch+OHeverything and pray type of brawler, you need to employ different tactics depending on the situation, and as I mentioned, if you choose the wrong approach you could lose even to my AB brawler. For example, you load CN Anti and just go for the straight up brawl at 0, assuming we shoot at the same time and both OH, you'll die first because of the significant EHP difference, however with good use of the double webs you can load null and keep me at range while I have CN anti loaded and by the time I realize and switch it might be too late for me. That's why I wouldn't recommend it as a starting fit, it requires more experienced pilots to get the most out of it.

yes i agree but
#1) with dual webs, unless youre fighting say a dram or dd (if you feel like losing your ship lol), there really is no reason to NOT use void. so plain and simple if you use faction ammo and i use t2 with the same if not better dmg application, youre fit will melt.
#2) exactly how you said it, my first approach is basically keep at 1km and o/h guns and repper, if im losing i just pull range and switch to null. if im not losing then ill just keep at 1km anyway
#3) say you do realize i pull range and switch ammo accordingly and can dps me as soon as i can dps you, id still be losing, but i can warp out due to having 2 webs and live to fight another day

IMO dual web just adds so much more versatility and widens your engagement profile (like being able to fight evenly with dual web hooks) i would be reluctant to shield fit a merlin

btw are you sure about that fitting stuff? maybe i did it wrong but mine was showing i was 3 pg or so short. and i have shield upgrades to 4 as well

EDIT: yes i also agree its not a new player fit either. it requires you know how and when to pull range and to realize that you must disengage. also requires knowing when to start your repper so inc dmg doesnt bleed into your hull

also one thing to note is that the armor fit still has a shield buffer before you get to its armor with higher than avg resists. so while you take 2-3 shots to get through my shields (not much but it matters), your tank would already be taking dmg.
of course you have a small armor buffer as well but it does not receive resist bonuses.
again not that much but it does make a difference

p.s. i like debating fits like this so dont think im being an ass and just arguing to argue =)