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PI - Factory planets
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pmchem
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2011-11-26 02:25:58 UTC
Alisarina wrote:
To counter act some of this risk someone doing low sec extraction would need to be in a corp that actively defends either their POCO's or the Interbus CO's on a 23/7 rotation, which is totally nonviable.


This not the case. POCOs have a reinforcement timer which the owner can set to a specific preferred time when they would like to defend. Consider it a mini version of how nullsec people have to be concerned about defending POS, stations, etc. You just wait for the POCO to be reinforced and then defend it when it comes out of reinforced.

https://twitter.com/pmchem/ || http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/community-spotlight-garpa/ || Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal
Alisarina
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#22 - 2011-11-26 02:56:13 UTC
yes thats true about the POCO having a reinforcement timer where you can select a 2 hour priod when the POCO comes out of reinforced which can be set by the owners. However if it is already reinforced due to being attacked when your offline, you cannot modify the timer to a better time. However you can set it to be favorable when you set it up also.

Also I was saying, if a party wants the POCO dead, no real amount of defending will prevent it from being popped as everyone can see the approx time it comes out and fleet accordingly, should they be bothered.

However talking about POCO's in a factory planet thread is a kinda moot point as most factory planets are in high sec, usually within 10 jumps max of jita or other hub, thus are all owned by CONCORD and thus un-moveable.
Xen Solarus
Furious Destruction and Salvage
#23 - 2011-11-27 00:02:58 UTC
My main concern is how this effects people living in wormholes. I see alot of talk about how its going to change the low/null sec PI, but little about how its going to have a rollover effect in wormholes.

My bet, people are going to be blowing them up just for the hell of it. And there'd be little incentive to build your own after that, as they'd be just as vunerable, and regardless, taxing PI isnt really a viable option in a wh, as the people who generally do PI there are going to be the corp/alliance that has a home there.

In other words, this is going to be a right pain in the ass.

Post with your main, like a BOSS!

And no, i don't live in highsec.  As if that would make your opinion any less wrong.  
Jack Dant
The Gentlemen of Low Moral Fibre
#24 - 2011-11-27 13:10:16 UTC
Xen Solarus wrote:
My bet, people are going to be blowing them up just for the hell of it. And there'd be little incentive to build your own after that, as they'd be just as vunerable, and regardless, taxing PI isnt really a viable option in a wh, as the people who generally do PI there are going to be the corp/alliance that has a home there.

Reinforcement timers again. After you reinforce it, you need to spend 24-36 hours in the wormhole until it comes out. It's a serious time investment for dubious reward.

What happens in lowsec, stays in lowsec, lowering the barrier to entry to lowsec PVP: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=476644&#post476644
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#25 - 2011-11-28 15:15:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Esunisen
Ok, i did my homework on Sisi.

I could manage to build a P3+P4 production planet that runs at 100% 24/7

You need to resupply every day.

http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/5657/p3p4sisi.png

The two lanchpads have no links between them, you can add one to balance the available storage
Alisarina
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#26 - 2011-11-29 01:06:15 UTC
I've seen those set ups before somewhere, possibly tailored to only having CCU 4 and not 5 that you have with a slight reduction in output. It's a solid way to do it and how I used to do it till i messed around and got one that works better for what I'm making.
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#27 - 2011-11-29 03:34:32 UTC
P1 to P3 on a single planet with CCU4. With CCU5, I think you can add a 5th production chain.

http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Colony_Management#Barren_Planet_.28P1_to_P3_Factories.29

Load (2) P1s into the left LP, load the other (2) P1s into the right LP. Come back in about 40 hours (with the 20 AIF setup, otherwise about 32 hours with the 25 AIF setup).
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#28 - 2011-11-29 20:21:03 UTC
Oh well, taxes just got an outrageous increase.


This is for high sec, with Concord 10% rate (10% of what ???)
RAW : 0.5 isk/u
P1 : 50 isk/u
P2: 900 isk/u
P3: 7000 isk/u
P4: 135000 isk/u

Prices gonna be funny in few days What?

I feel like not playing this game anymore, would cost too much to rebuild everything to lower the taxes Roll
Linka Romanov
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#29 - 2011-11-29 20:32:19 UTC
Esunisen wrote:
Oh well, taxes just got an outrageous increase.


This is for high sec, with Concord 10% rate (10% of what ???)
RAW : 0.5 isk/u
P1 : 50 isk/u
P2: 900 isk/u
P3: 7000 isk/u
P4: 135000 isk/u

Prices gonna be funny in few days What?

I feel like not playing this game anymore, would cost too much to rebuild everything to lower the taxes Roll



It's almost as if there's now a tangible benefit to having access to your own customs office, so that you can control the tax rates! One could even argue that this provides an incentive for leaving highsec from time to time!
Caiyuga Onishi
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#30 - 2011-11-29 22:48:48 UTC
This is gonna be interesting.. small corps / lone wolves can't run factory planets anymore, and the big ones don't want to because there are more profitable things to do in low/nullsec.

Commodity prices might DETONATE soon™
Alisarina
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#31 - 2011-11-29 23:37:15 UTC
I run my 2 accounts of factory based PI's still, even with this massive tax hike. You still make isk if your smart. You will have to restructure your inputs and have slightly lower outputs due to that, but profit will still be flowing in, just no where near as much as before.

If you find your unable to turn a profit with factory planets, then it is more due to your either lack of skill at finding the right commodity to make, or that your buying the lower tier goods at too high a price.

Yes the high sec tax frigging sucks, but you get over it and get going. Remember the market WILL go up, it just needs more time to react to the body blow it just got delt. Also I'm sure the stockpilers are VERY happy now :P
Caiyuga Onishi
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#32 - 2011-11-30 00:57:24 UTC
Alisarina wrote:
Remember the market WILL go up, it just needs more time

Exactely. Time to sit back and watch the market for a while Big smile
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#33 - 2011-11-30 02:00:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Esunisen
Taxes aren't even balanced. Processed tax is way too much.

Example: Factories required to have 8 high tech running 24/7

15480 processed -> export tax = 18,576,000 isk per day

960 refined -> export tax = 20,736,000 isk per day

126 specialized -> export tax = 21,168,000 isk per day

8 high tech -> export tax = 25,920,000 isk per day

And you have to pay import taxes aswell. Some can be avoided but it's a small part.

And, no, I won't go to low/null. I can't. I can't even afford to pay this much taxes every day. I extracted one of my P2 planets, had to pay 2,970,000 isk

I already stopped making control towers few weaks ago because profit is too weak. Guess I completely stop PI now.

I feel my 3 subscriptions will follow soon.



EDIT 1: this is isk per day, not isk per hour
EDIT 2: corrected error on processed tax
Alisarina
Zebra Corp
Goonswarm Federation
#34 - 2011-11-30 02:10:15 UTC
Esunisen wrote:


I feel my 3 subscriptions will follow soon.


When you do, can I have your stuff?

On a side note, tax is never even. It's usually relative to your income as to how much tax you pay, why shouldn't it be the same here? If you where making control towers before and making money on it, and now complaining about a mear 3 mill in taxes and threatening to quit doing it, go ahead, but to me soemthing just doesn't add up with your story. I'm not refuting your numbers because I don't have the time and/or inclination to worry about them right now.

As I've said many times before, give it a week or two and the PI P1-P4 prices will see a marked jump in cost, how much is anyones guess, but until then just sit tight and do something else to enjoy the game and line your pockets with ISK. Once the prices rise to a more comfortable level for you, jump back into PI and make ISK passively again, though it won't be as much as it once was possibly.
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#35 - 2011-11-30 02:51:10 UTC
Alisarina wrote:

When you do, can I have your stuff?


No.

/me looking for a way to pay 250m of P4 export taxes per month without selling anything
Nekopyat
Nee-Co
#36 - 2011-11-30 05:05:36 UTC
Linka Romanov wrote:

It's almost as if there's now a tangible benefit to having access to your own customs office, so that you can control the tax rates! One could even argue that this provides an incentive for leaving highsec from time to time!


Ever notice that this never works?
The people who do not want to go to low/null will not go to low/null, and no amount of punishing them ever changes this.. all that happens is they stop doing the activity and the market shifts.

Plus, I doubt we will see many POCOs in low sec... to expensive, to easy to destroy. PoSes can survive because of the moon material prices (and inability to mine them at all in high sec) and the feasiblity of making them self defending.. or at least too much of a pain to attack. POCOs are just sitting targets and tear generators.
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#37 - 2011-11-30 16:25:17 UTC
I emptied 6 of my 18 planets, taxes cost me 32mil isk. Great.Roll
Dr Mercy
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#38 - 2011-11-30 21:38:22 UTC
I have a thread and spreadsheet that can help you with this matey. Take a look at my Sig.

Make isk with PI: http://failheap-challenge.com/showthread.php?1207-What-to-do-PI-Processor-only-planets
Esunisen
Les Tueurs de Killer
#39 - 2011-12-01 14:54:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Esunisen
Juste made this

Factories Income

Hope you find it usefull.

Let me know if you find a mistake.


Edit: Read Export taxes instead of Import taxes in the top right table.
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