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What are some actual numbers on current income in nullsec?
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Dyson Veare
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#41 - 2014-03-03 19:54:10 UTC
First off ccp has no numbers on my average personal income since everyone's play hours vary every day of every week.

Carrier Ratting:

With a Carrier using drones for anomalies, 10-12 sites which takes 4 hours, collecting the loot and salvage using tractor units. Lets guesstimate about 450-500 million. If you get rare spawns, i'd say ad anywhere from 50-500 million on luck.

Sites Relic/Data:

Given the luck on relic sites, lets say 1 container per site holds up 20-40 mill worth of t2 salvage in it, discarding the bpc's and other components because they are useless without proper amounts of the t2 salvage. So if you are hard core, and are lucky 10-15 relic sites a day x 20 million base, about 250-300 million.

Mining Ice/Minerals:

This is purely based on market, ability to refine and the ability to get it back to empire safely.
12 hours mining could net you 750-1 billion with 1 account if you target the high end ores with it there. Ice mining just the same if the right spawns are up and you have the lucky of no pvpers/npc's getting in your way.

Missions aren't done in low sec so lets do n/a for that.

Escalations:

This is a group effort in most cases, mind you a marauder is not a god and you will die if you push it. But these sites can be profitable, again, takes a huge amount of skills to solo, and even then the loot turn up is not always more then say a combined 500-1 bill isk.

PVP:

This is pointless to quote, if your good at it solo you may/may not get lucky, if your in a group you may/may not get lucky, if your in my alliance you lose so bad a landmark is created on your behalf.

Planetary with 2 full accounts of players:

Using 30 planets, to mine 4 raw materials, converted to 4 t1 commodities, then processed into 2 t2 commodities, depending on market sell, which is anywhere from 8k-11k for a t2 pi commodity, if you take the 1-2 hours a day to keep up on collecting, producing, you looking at about 3.5 billion a month after getting it into empire. Which is entirely passive income. In the end, planetary is the most lucrative, as its the least time consuming, although the most boring of all the professions, it will net you the best possible passive income in the game because it can be coupled with mining, pvp, ratting, and everything else while you make that 3.5 billion a month. So in my mind, it is something to not do without if you have an extra hour a day.
There's my guesstimates based on personal experience over the last several months.
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
#42 - 2014-03-04 00:12:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Sura Sadiva
Influence Powers wrote:
This thread has me more interested in exploration. Would some one be so kind to give me a simple what's what etc. What are the skills needed and the suggest lvl. Type of ship and general equipment needed. And if you so feel inclinded a simple process over view.example.


On my exploration alt I use this Cheetah:

1x Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
1x Sisters Expanded Probe Launcher
1x 200mm Light 'Scout' Autocannon I

1x Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I
1x Cargo Scanner II
1x Relic Analyzer II
1x Data Analyzer II

1x Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
2x Expanded Cargohold II

2x Small Gravity Capacitor Upgrade I


- Autocannon in high is not very useful, can be replaced with a salvager (I prefer to fit a gun to annoy some other unarmed exploration frigate if some issue raises inside a site).

- I use Expanded cargholds in low because I'm based in LS, in null I go nomadic across several regions so I cannot unload loot. With 2 cargholds I get 315 m3. But can replace them with nanofiber or such.

- Data and Relic aanalyzer can be downgraded to T1 version if you don't want to train hacking and archeology to 5, will have some container fail but is still profitable.

- I use wormhole as gateway, is way faster and allow you to get in deep null avoiding chocke points/gatecamps.

- I roam there till cargo is full, log off in safe.

- Beside few stagging systems and well known gatecamps null is generally empty, you can spend days and meetining only some occasional hauler. Natives are generally friendly or anyway scared too much by your presence and will dock as soon as you enter a system.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#43 - 2014-03-04 02:49:06 UTC
Batelle wrote:

I've yet to see a tower, but there are some tasty skill books that drop

No, there aren't. Unless you're talking combat ladar.[/quote]

300 mil booster books most certainly are tastey.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#44 - 2014-03-04 04:51:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Batelle
Onictus wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Onictus wrote:

I've yet to see a tower, but there are some tasty skill books that drop

No, there aren't. Unless you're talking combat ladar.


300 mil booster books most certainly are tastey.


hmm yes, and where do those drop? Not the same places where tower bpcs drop.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#45 - 2014-03-04 05:29:29 UTC
Batelle wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Onictus wrote:

I've yet to see a tower, but there are some tasty skill books that drop

No, there aren't. Unless you're talking combat ladar.


300 mil booster books most certainly are tastey.


hmm yes, and where do those drop? Not the same places where tower bpcs drop.


No close though,
Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#46 - 2014-03-04 10:17:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Little Dragon Khamez
all I know is that Highsec has been over nerfed income wise for years which is why in recent years there have been buffs to high sec such as the Noctis and now the MTU deployable both of which allow mission runners to make money faster when deployed in highsec.

Meanwhile Null gets the 5% nerf and the ESS (both of which I do not approve of).

Indeed a CCP dev said in the ESS F&I thread that money was being created like crazy in null and that this was of concern as they were worried about inflation, hence the ESS module was developed to counter this.

Now CCP are in the position of having access to all of the numbers plus they have economists on their staff so we've got to take it on face value that they know what they are doing with regards to the economy.

Just adapt and roll with the changes, you have no other choice.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...
Seven Koskanaiken
Shadow Legions.
SONS of BANE
#47 - 2014-03-04 10:50:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Seven Koskanaiken
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
Indeed a CCP dev said in the ESS F&I thread that money was being created like crazy in null and that this was of concern as they were worried about inflation, hence the ESS module was developed to counter this..


The crazy money is being made by 23/7 renters/botters and their feudal overlords (how else do they pay that extortionate rent each month?)

For the normal evening player who logs in to do sometimes bearing, sometimes pvp, not so much, and ends up begging 600mil for a plex at the end of the month.

In real world style the little guy player, who wasn't causing the problem in the first place, gets hardest hit by the ESS/5% reduction, while the mega faucet fat cats barely notice a change.

Maybe CCP could break that data down by region, that would be interesting for sure.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#48 - 2014-03-04 11:24:50 UTC
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
all I know is that Highsec has been over nerfed income wise for years which is why in recent years there have been buffs to high sec such as the Noctis and now the MTU deployable both of which allow mission runners to make money faster when deployed in highsec.

Meanwhile Null gets the 5% nerf and the ESS (both of which I do not approve of).

Indeed a CCP dev said in the ESS F&I thread that money was being created like crazy in null and that this was of concern as they were worried about inflation, hence the ESS module was developed to counter this.

Now CCP are in the position of having access to all of the numbers plus they have economists on their staff so we've got to take it on face value that they know what they are doing with regards to the economy.

Just adapt and roll with the changes, you have no other choice.


Said CCP dev then backtracked on the ESS comment because their own Economist stated that there was no issue with too much isk being injected into the economy. The ESS nerf was put in to encorage people to use the ESS.

We have also shown that activities such as running anoms is worse at earning isk than running missions. We have also shown that industry in null is never going to happen because it is cheaper to build in empire and just ship it out to null.

High sec has also not seen very many nerfs at all when compared to null income nerfs over the years.
Qweasdy
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#49 - 2014-03-04 11:28:32 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Please, for the sake of all that is good in the world, not another thread about income levels.
Can we stop with the propaganda wars for a couple weeks?

CCP has the numbers, so the forum wars are pointless.
But if you do want to get into it, consider this: the failed lawyer in his last message to his minions was exhorting every member of goons to get into a Titan, or failing that, a supercap. Guess they don't seem to have a problem with income.


DINSDALE! I haven't heard your tinfoil hat rustling in a while, missed ya! :P

This is a terrible thread. As such, it's locked. - CCP Falcon
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#50 - 2014-03-04 12:11:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Tauranon
Seven Koskanaiken wrote:


The crazy money is being made by 23/7 renters/botters and their feudal overlords (how else do they pay that extortionate rent each month?)

For the normal evening player who logs in to do sometimes bearing, sometimes pvp, not so much, and ends up begging 600mil for a plex at the end of the month.

In real world style the little guy player, who wasn't causing the problem in the first place, gets hardest hit by the ESS/5% reduction, while the mega faucet fat cats barely notice a change.

Maybe CCP could break that data down by region, that would be interesting for sure.


Map -> Statistics -> Pirate and Police ships destroyed in the last 24 hours. Even the vaguest glance at it will tell you a story. In any case.


Vale of the Silent - including 60+ systems belonging to PBLRD, no individual system has more than 2000 kills (just now when I looked). Note though I did not rat yesterday, I can rat at 250 kills per hour in good anoms and up to 500 per hour in bad anoms. As PBLRD ratters are generally confined to a system due to rental agreement, this would tend to suggest that 24x1 character ratting was not achieved in any PBLRD system in the last 24 hours in Vale.

Gents had 1 system in their 40 odd crack 3000 npc kills. I'd imagine, but can't be bothered counting them all, that the average per system ratted for vale was about 500 npc's.


For reference,
Aireken: 18570, Korsiki : 32544, Osmon : 18794, Inaya : 22343

Going to suggest that sisters runners working from the Osmon agent, have in those 4 systems, shot the equivalent to ~180 null systems, and there is enough spare change in the other systems of that constellation to basically round it up to 200 nullsec systems or 2 of the largest regions worth - and those people are all also earning LP.
Ptraci
3 R Corporation
#51 - 2014-03-04 12:15:58 UTC
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
I think there's a lot of misinformation (disinformation?) around what those evil mean nullseccers get by puppeteering CCP, so let's set it straight.


You must be good at spreadsheets and math, carebear, why don't you figure it out? All I know is it pays enough for my pew.
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#52 - 2014-03-04 13:45:11 UTC
Qweasdy wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Please, for the sake of all that is good in the world, not another thread about income levels.
Can we stop with the propaganda wars for a couple weeks?

CCP has the numbers, so the forum wars are pointless.
But if you do want to get into it, consider this: the failed lawyer in his last message to his minions was exhorting every member of goons to get into a Titan, or failing that, a supercap. Guess they don't seem to have a problem with income.


DINSDALE! I haven't heard your tinfoil hat rustling in a while, missed ya! :P


Not much to say these days.
The GD threads are the typical "high sec too rich, kill high sec" crap that is just so tiring to read.
Or other fairly meaningless threads.

Typically CCP starts announcing the next set of changes associated with the summer release in the next week or so.
We will see what damage is done to high sec with that set, and then I am sure there will be all kinds of threads sprouting up.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#53 - 2014-03-04 14:25:15 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

Not much to say these days.
The GD threads are the typical "high sec too rich, kill high sec" crap that is just so tiring to read.
Or other fairly meaningless threads.

Typically CCP starts announcing the next set of changes associated with the summer release in the next week or so.
We will see what damage is done to high sec with that set, and then I am sure there will be all kinds of threads sprouting up.


You mean as soon as the "Pirannha-Alarm" goes off notifying you that Fozzie made a post.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#54 - 2014-03-04 16:45:01 UTC
Batelle wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Onictus wrote:

I've yet to see a tower, but there are some tasty skill books that drop

No, there aren't. Unless you're talking combat ladar.


300 mil booster books most certainly are tastey.


hmm yes, and where do those drop? Not the same places where tower bpcs drop.



Exploration can be so random at times I'm amazed when people consider it as a means of ISK income.

Sometimes you leave a site feeling like you got forced at gunpoint to suck a lemon, other times you feel like CCP is Santa Claus.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#55 - 2014-03-04 17:33:16 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Batelle wrote:
Onictus wrote:

I've yet to see a tower, but there are some tasty skill books that drop

No, there aren't. Unless you're talking combat ladar.


300 mil booster books most certainly are tastey.


hmm yes, and where do those drop? Not the same places where tower bpcs drop.



Exploration can be so random at times I'm amazed when people consider it as a means of ISK income.

Sometimes you leave a site feeling like you got forced at gunpoint to suck a lemon, other times you feel like CCP is Santa Claus.


You think thats bad?

In 8 years I have had two officer spawns, one dropped about 300 mil in mods while the other dropped tags and ammo... yet some people seem to think you an earn several hundred mil/hr on them.
Brewlar Kuvakei
Adeptio Gloriae
#56 - 2014-03-04 17:35:38 UTC
Null sec is one area of EVE that I will never return to until serious changes are made SOV ect. To me Null sec is pointless where blob warfare is the only warfare which I hate as you just become a clog in a machine and it requires no independent thought unless you are willing to become senior in your corporation or allince. I also feel the RL hardware currently available is not able to provide the resources needed that null requires.

I get why other peeps love null, each to there own.
Marlona Sky
State War Academy
Caldari State
#57 - 2014-03-04 17:40:40 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
In 8 years I have had two officer spawns

At least you have had two. Zero officer spawns crew checking in. Ugh
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#58 - 2014-03-04 18:40:00 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
In 8 years I have had two officer spawns

At least you have had two. Zero officer spawns crew checking in. Ugh


I wonder how many officer spawns occur in Eve on a daily basis.
I guess someone might be able to do some wildly inaccurate extrapolations based on killmails and movement in major hubs, but I wonder how horrible it would be if CCP just did a quick SQL serach, and said, "last year, there were X Officer's killed".
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#59 - 2014-03-04 21:18:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
In 8 years I have had two officer spawns

At least you have had two. Zero officer spawns crew checking in. Ugh


I wonder how many officer spawns occur in Eve on a daily basis.
I guess someone might be able to do some wildly inaccurate extrapolations based on killmails and movement in major hubs, but I wonder how horrible it would be if CCP just did a quick SQL serach, and said, "last year, there were X Officer's killed".




Perhaps if we look at market value of the modules they drop and then the ISK-loss of incursion shineys as a "prevalence" vector and then reverse engineer that over the life of the given modules.

Unfortunately I'm lacking the kind of 50 lb brain required to crunch those kinds of number.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Qalix
Long Jump.
#60 - 2014-03-04 22:43:43 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
We have also shown that activities such as running anoms is worse at earning isk than running missions.

I'd love to read the article and/or thread. Link?