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Scams: Where do you stand?

First post
Author
Doireen Kaundur
Doomheim
#81 - 2014-02-28 03:07:50 UTC
Yonis Kador wrote:
Then EVE is not the proper game for them and the chance that 'quitters' would otherwise have become long-term players is pretty low. People who quit because they got scammed will quit because they get ganked too often, because they get wardecced too much, or because they get bountied again and again, etc. etc. etc. IT'S ALL SO UNFAIR!!!

Overcoming adversity is a requirement of EVE. It's supposed to be hard. HTFU?

Besides, scammers need love too.

Have you hugged a scammer today?

Lol

YK


I own a billboard outside a well frequented jump gate in a high sec region. Ive been wanting to unload it for a very cheap 500million isk. If anyone is interested let me know. We can fly out together to the billboard, and uopn isk transference you take immediate possesion of the billboard.

Just imagine the bragging rights you will have with your corpmates when you tell them you own an EVE billboard.
Blink

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Xia Kairui
Perkone
Caldari State
#82 - 2014-02-28 07:48:43 UTC
Farsiris Arbosa wrote:
So I ask you: where do you stand on scamming in EVE? Fair game, or exceptionally awful?


I think scams are good and should remain allowed as long as they can be averted with a little common sense.
The Margin Trading scam is a bit dubious, as this is bordering on abusing game mechanics for your own gain since there is no way to discern if an order is legit or not. It also undermines trust in the market which makes trading harder.
But then most if not all MT scams can be detected if you simply check prices or price history. Or simply think a moment about the advert basically saying: "OMG look at this order which you can make tons of money off but I rather shout about it than make that money myself".

Interestingly, spending a few days in Jita prepared me rather well for all the pitfalls and hooks in real life insurances and mortgages.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#83 - 2014-02-28 07:56:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaarous Aldurald
Xia Kairui wrote:
there is no way to discern if an order is legit or not.


I am really, really tired of hearing this lie repeated.

[Edit: Hell's freaking bells, you even admit it yourself 2 sentences later.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Boomhaur
#84 - 2014-02-28 09:22:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Boomhaur
Scams:

This is Eve Online, this is were the evil sick sadistic bastards gather to play a game. It's where WoW players come to play expecting to PWN everyone in a months time in a titan only to be slaughtered, scammed, used and immediately told to HTFU or play Hello Kitty Online.

Had someone tried to scam me a few hours ago, I was impressed this one tried actually talking to me and put in some effort. But failed miserably in execution when trying to scam me out of a 425mil part and isk in a contract. I laughed, at end of the day I've seen just about every scam there is thanks to Eve.

Heck I've known people in real life who were talking about some opportunity that came knocking at their door recently and how they were thinking about taking advantage of it to be quickly cut off by me when I started breaking down to them how that scam works in great detail. Lets just say the wise ones listen, and than wonder how I learned all this from a video game.

Welcome to Eve. Everyone here is an Evil Sick Sadistic Bastard who is out to get you. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either trying to scam you or use you.

Sable Moran
Moran Light Industries
#85 - 2014-02-28 09:34:46 UTC
Farsiris Arbosa wrote:
a lot more controversial


Can't really understand why. They (scams etc.) add flavour to EvE which is good.

Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene V - Moon 4 - Duvolle Labs Factory. Hybrid charges, Projectile ammo, Missiles, Drones, Ships, Need'em? We have'em, at affordable prices. Pop in at our Ammo Shop in sunny Alentene.

Salvos Rhoska
#86 - 2014-02-28 10:07:34 UTC
Scams are fine.

I think the cost of setting up/maintaining some irrational buy/sell orders however are just that, a bit irrational.

I dont even nearly completely understand the vagaries of margin trading and escrow, but I suspect there are some eleents there that need taking a look at. Player behavior is self-regulating, and the gross aggragate of that, is rational. When instances of irrarionality begin tomoccur, its a sign of the limitations of the environment external influences on that self-regulating player behavior.

I think CCP would do well to dedicate a future patch to an overview of trading, and see if they cant more closely model some elements of it on existing IRL trading systems, regulations, taxes, fees and types of buy/sell orders as well as financing them.

I dont consider those "scams". I rather consider themma result of the large part of essentially NPC based market elements and trade affecting elements being very static and undynamic, and the games system as a whole not being quite "finished" yet interms of an NPC system that would emulate the IRL elements of market authorities and regulators being sure they too get their cut.

POCOS was a good change in this direction, as players can set the tax they wish. But the NPC based authorities on stations and variousnfunctiins of stations, are completely undynamic (except for responding to Standing).

One example of this, is Jita. IRL a marketplace in such high demand would be charging a premium for people to do business on their premisis. Though Corp office rent scales dynamically with the demand, the price of doing business there, does not, because the NPC Jita authorities have not responded dynamically at all to demand of their services. (Except in the indirect fashion that a bottleneck has formed at entry points)
Xia Kairui
Perkone
Caldari State
#87 - 2014-02-28 12:21:17 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Xia Kairui wrote:
there is no way to discern if an order is legit or not.


I am really, really tired of hearing this lie repeated.

[Edit: Hell's freaking bells, you even admit it yourself 2 sentences later.


Ok, I was a bit vague. There is no real hard proof in game generated by the client that shows you whether an order is going to be fulfilled.
You can extrapolate from the price history using your own knowledge, but the information the client gives you is that someone offered a helluva money for that item. It's only my personal experience that says "if there's only that single order at that price, chances are high it's a scam". In fact, someone might ACTUALLY have made that buy order (mistyping the price or so) so it might be a legit offer, and there's no way to see it.

Inari Visas
Aliastra
#88 - 2014-02-28 12:29:09 UTC
CCP should introduce some sort of gameplay mechanic for private detectives. These crimes should be investigated by other players!!

Seriously though, that would be cool.
BrundleMeth
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#89 - 2014-02-28 14:53:33 UTC
Yonis Kador wrote:
Then EVE is not the proper game for them and the chance that 'quitters' would otherwise have become long-term players is pretty low. People who quit because they got scammed will quit because they get ganked too often, because they get wardecced too much, or because they get bountied again and again, etc. etc. etc. IT'S ALL SO UNFAIR!!!

Overcoming adversity is a requirement of EVE. It's supposed to be hard. HTFU?

Besides, scammers need love too.

Have you hugged a scammer today?

Lol

YK

One friend who quit was never scammed. He quit simply because CCP "allows" scamming. He was fed up with that attitude, and he WAS a long term player already...
Yonis Kador
KADORCORP
#90 - 2014-02-28 15:10:00 UTC
You sure do have lots of friends quitting EVE for pretty silly reasons... I'm starting to wonder if you're gonna make it yourself! Sounds like you're one scam and two ganks away from your own unceremonious exit.

Good luck! Lol

YK

Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#91 - 2014-02-28 17:28:49 UTC
Inari Visas wrote:
CCP should introduce some sort of gameplay mechanic for private detectives. These crimes should be investigated by other players!!

Seriously though, that would be cool.


You can already do that. A few people have claimed that they spent all of their wealth to prove I scam. Unfortunately, in their haste to make such a damning charge stick, they failed the rules.

I've been thinking lately...

What if I went undercover for the next year and actually scammed people on alts using a variety of scams we have seen here and other new ones. Is there really isk in it? Could I maintain my sterling reputation on my main if I did this? It's an interesting thought.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.

Desivo Delta Visseroff
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#92 - 2014-02-28 17:52:08 UTC
Inari Visas wrote:
CCP should introduce some sort of gameplay mechanic for private detectives. These crimes should be investigated by other players!!

Seriously though, that would be cool.



There is already a mechanic. It's called Due Diligence

Allow me to introduce it to you:

Due Diligence - DD*

1. An investigation or audit of a potential investment. Due diligence serves to confirm all material facts in regards to a sale.

2. Generally, due diligence refers to the care a reasonable person should take before entering into an agreement or a transaction with another party.

*Credit to Investopedia - http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/duediligence.asp

There! I saved CCP programming time and did a solid for the community. Donations not required, but are welcomedCool

I was hunting for sick loot, but all I could get my hands on were 50 corpses[:|]..............[:=d]

Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#93 - 2014-02-28 18:21:56 UTC
Sometimes for fun, I like to check the contract histories of everyone offering contracts in local chat. The key is to pay attention to the character who sets up the contract, which is not necessarily the character spamming it.

I know that when I was new, seeing some get accepted on a regular basis was eye opening. Of course, you have to take into account the sheer volume of spam messages posted over many hours a month to get to those kind of results.

Who would buy a mispriced contract in Jita?

ALOT of people.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.

Percival Rose
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#94 - 2014-02-28 20:52:40 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:
Who would buy a mispriced contract in Jita?

ALOT of people.

With 2100 people in Jita alone, it's not that odd to see at least one person fall for a (sometimes obvious) scam. I try to stay away from scamming myself, but I won't have a problem with anyone who does. It's all fair game. That's why I love EVE.

To avoid scams:
- Check the item name. A Gneiss is not a Gnosis!
- Count the zero's on big amounts of ISK
- Double check everything
- Don't do drugs (related song by Curzon Dax)

Do you know who's going to inherit New Eden? Arms dealers. Because everyone else is too busy killing each other.

Inari Visas
Aliastra
#95 - 2014-03-01 11:43:44 UTC
Desivo Delta Visseroff wrote:
Inari Visas wrote:
CCP should introduce some sort of gameplay mechanic for private detectives. These crimes should be investigated by other players!!

Seriously though, that would be cool.



There is already a mechanic. It's called Due Diligence

Allow me to introduce it to you:

Due Diligence - DD*

1. An investigation or audit of a potential investment. Due diligence serves to confirm all material facts in regards to a sale.

2. Generally, due diligence refers to the care a reasonable person should take before entering into an agreement or a transaction with another party.

*Credit to Investopedia - http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/duediligence.asp

There! I saved CCP programming time and did a solid for the community. Donations not required, but are welcomedCool


I'm sorry, to much common sense for me.
RAIN Arthie
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#96 - 2014-03-01 12:50:53 UTC
Scamming is more annoying than anything.